{"id":"court_sdny_441_0","court":"SDNY","case_no":"","doc_number":441,"sub_number":null,"doc_type":"DOC","filed_date":"2024-07-23","title":"SDNY ECF 441","summary_zh":"庭审记录——美国诉Ho Wan Kwok（Miles Guo / Guo Wengui / 郭文贵）案，SDNY 1:23-cr-00118 ECF 441，2024年6月26日。法官Analisa Torres主持庭审，双方就证人作证、共谋者声明的可采性（Geaney标准）、视频翻译协议等程序问题进行论证和讨论。","summary_en":"Trial transcript — United States v. Ho Wan Kwok (Miles Guo / Guo Wengui), SDNY 1:23-cr-00118 ECF 441, June 26, 2024. Judge Analisa Torres presides as parties address witness testimony, admissibility of co-conspirator statements under Geaney standard, and translation agreements on video evidence.","body_en":"O6Q1GUO1\n1 UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK\n2 ------------------------------x\nUNITED STATES OF AMERICA,\n3\nv. 23 Cr. 118 (AT)\n4\nMILES GUO,\n5\nDefendant. Trial\n6 ------------------------------x\nNew York, N.Y.\n7 June 26, 2024\n9:00 a.m.\n8\nBefore:\n9\n10 HON. ANALISA TORRES,\n11 District Judge\n-and a Jury-\n12\nAPPEARANCES\n13\nDAMIAN WILLIAMS\n14 United States Attorney for the\nSouthern District of New York\n15 BY: MICAH F. FERGENSON\nRYAN B. FINKEL\n16 JUSTIN HORTON\nJULIANA N. MURRAY\n17 Assistant United States Attorneys\n18 SABRINA P. SHROFF\nAttorney for Defendant\n19\nPRYOR CASHMAN LLP\n20 Attorneys for Defendant\nBY: SIDHARDHA KAMARAJU\n21 MATTHEW BARKAN\n22 ALSTON & BIRD LLP\nAttorneys for Defendant\n23 BY: E. SCOTT SCHIRICK\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n1 ALSO PRESENT:\nIsabel Loftus, Paralegal Specialist, USAO\n2 Robert Stout, Special Agent, FBI\nJorge Salazar, Defense Paralegal\n3 Tuo Huang, Interpreter (Mandarin)\nShi Feng, Interpreter (Mandarin)\n4 Yu Mark Tang, Interpreter (Mandarin)\n5\n6\n7\n8\n9\n10\n11\n12\n13\n14\n15\n16\n17\n18\n19\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n1 (Trial resumed; jury not present)\n2 THE COURT: Good morning.\n3 ALL COUNSEL: Good morning, your Honor.\n4 THE COURT: Please make your appearances.\n5 MR. FERGENSON: Good morning, your Honor. Micah\n6 Fergenson and Justin Horton for the United States.\n7 MS. SHROFF: For Mr. Ho Wan Kwok, Sabrina Shroff and\n8 Scott Schirick. Good morning, your Honor.\n9 THE COURT: Please be seated.\n10 Is there anything before we get started at 9:30?\n11 MR. FERGENSON: Yes, your Honor. I think we had two\n12 points.\n13 One, and I don't want to raise something that the\n14 proper defense counsel is not here to respond to, but just to\n15 inform the Court of an issue. Maybe we can take it up at\n16 lunchtime. We've been working very well with the defense on\n17 stipulations, translations, and we appreciate their assistance\n18 in making this a more efficient trial. There is one recording\n19 that we have agreement on with the defense. It was a recording\n20 that was part of Mr. Shamel Medrano's, you know, large summary\n21 chart of videos that we redacted because we were still working\n22 on translations for that video. I think we've reached\n23 agreement on the translation of it, your Honor, and we've\n24 reached agreement that, you know, for what actually goes back\n25 into evidence, we can use an updated version of Mr. Medrano's\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n1 chart that includes this video and the translated text. There\n2 is one portion of the translated transcript that we have a\n3 dispute about. It's not a translation dispute; it's a Rule 403\n4 dispute. And I won't get ahead of it because I want\n5 Mr. Kamaraju or Mr. Barkan, who I've discussed this with more\n6 recently, to be here to address it as well, but just very\n7 briefly to preview it. It's about two lines of text where\n8 Mr. Guo says something to the effect of: \"The United States\n9 will never falsely accuse you. Listen to what I say. The\n10 United States will never falsely accuse you.\" The context for\n11 this remark is, in 2020, when the investigations into GTV\n12 begin, Mr. Guo is broadcasting that essentially the people who\n13 are complaining to the U.S. authorities are in fact fake\n14 victims and CCP spies or traitors, and they're going to be\n15 criminally charged by the United States, and he makes this\n16 remark about how the United States will never falsely accuse\n17 you. Our view is, there's nothing unfairly prejudicial about\n18 using, you know, an opposing party's statement against legal\n19 interests. That's sort of the heartland of what an opposing\n20 party admission is. You know, criminal defendants confess in\n21 some instances, and confessions are admissible at trial. And\n22 so our view is there's no 403 issue here really, if a statement\n23 by the defendant is clearly admissible. But I don't want to\n24 get ahead of myself. We can take it up——unless the defense\n25 wants to take it up now.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n1 THE COURT: So we need not hear now because neither of\n2 those attorneys are here, but your understanding is that the\n3 defense position is that the statement is unfairly prejudicial?\n4 MR. FERGENSON: Yes, your Honor.\n5 THE COURT: Okay. Anything else?\n6 MR. FERGENSON: There was one other matter that\n7 Mr. Horton wanted to address, given that we are hopeful, but\n8 not certain, we may rest today, and I'll let Mr. Horton address\n9 that.\n10 MR. HORTON: Thank you, your Honor.\n11 Your Honor had indicated one day last week that the\n12 Court would like the government to make a formal application\n13 pursuant to Geaney for the admission of co-conspirator\n14 statements that came in at trial, so I just want to address\n15 that briefly.\n16 In six weeks of testimony, give or take——\n17 THE COURT: So is this what you're offering at this\n18 time?\n19 MR. HORTON: If the Court wishes, I'm happy to make\n20 that application now.\n21 THE COURT: Go right ahead.\n22 MR. HORTON: So we've had something like six weeks of\n23 testimony and documentary evidence at trial about a sprawling,\n24 interconnected series of racketeering and fraud conspiracies\n25 that were global in nature, extensive in time, and really\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n1 depended on communication as sort of their fuel and lifeblood.\n2 And there's been a considerable amount of co-conspirator\n3 statements and documents reflecting those statements offered\n4 into evidence subject to connection under the circuit's Geaney\n5 protocol.\n6 I'll just start with the top and say that the\n7 standard, of course, is a preponderance, so the Court needs\n8 only find that it's more likely than not that these declarants\n9 were members of conspiracies with the defendant, and spoke\n10 during and in furtherance of those conspiracies. I'll start\n11 right at the top with Ms. Wang, who pled guilty to——\n12 THE COURT: One moment, please.\n13 MR. HORTON: Sure.\n14 THE COURT: You're going to specify the individuals,\n15 correct?\n16 MR. HORTON: So I think what I'll do, your Honor, is\n17 sort of go somewhat in order, and then, you know, given the\n18 nature of these conspiracies, there are a number of\n19 co-conspirators and agents who were not quite at the periphery,\n20 people who were not like Yvette Wang, really.\n21 THE COURT: If you could bring the microphone closer\n22 to you. You said that there were a number of co-conspirators——\n23 MS. SHROFF: Your Honor, I apologize. Two of our team\n24 members are not here, but I wanted to just apologize and ask\n25 the Court if I could just flag for the Court one issue.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n1 There is a witness that's supposed to testify this\n2 afternoon and we do not know what subset of exhibits are being\n3 used for that witness. I'm happy to let Mr. Horton continue,\n4 but as to Ms. Chen, the government has identified only a wide\n5 number of exhibits. I believe Ms. Tilton emailed the\n6 government yesterday for a narrower subset. We have not yet\n7 received it. While Mr. Horton is making this argument to the\n8 Court——which I apologize again for interrupting——if the lawyer\n9 who is in charge of the Chen direct could just please send us\n10 the exhibit numbers, it would be very helpful to us. Thank\n11 you.\n12 MR. FERGENSON: We'll be sure to do that, your Honor.\n13 I'm not familiar with that exhibit set, but we'll be sure to\n14 send them the specific exhibits. The way we numbered the\n15 exhibits for victim witnesses is that each victim witness has\n16 its own exhibit series, so, I mean, we can identify the\n17 specific ones within that, but it is identified at least by the\n18 exhibit series.\n19 THE COURT: So you'll do that right away.\n20 MR. FERGENSON: We will, your Honor.\n21 MS. SHROFF: Your Honor——\n22 THE COURT: One moment.\n23 MS. SHROFF: Oh, sorry.\n24 THE COURT: You had something further, Ms. Shroff?\n25 MS. SHROFF: Yes, your Honor. I know Mr. Hinton is\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n1 still going, but for Ms. Chen, we've also received some 3500\n2 material with new Bates stamp numbering, so if there's any\n3 additional 3500 between yesterday and today, we would\n4 appreciate receiving that as well.\n5 That's all. Thank you, your Honor.\n6 THE COURT: Thank you.\n7 Okay. So I interrupted Mr. Horton, and if you want to\n8 backtrack, you may. I specifically wanted to make sure that I\n9 have the specific names.\n10 Go ahead. Go ahead.\n11 MR. HORTON: So there were a number of repeat-player\n12 co-conspirators, so to speak, that your Honor saw evidence\n13 about in this case.\n14 Starting with Ms. Wang, who your Honor noted early in\n15 trial, there was a colloquy with defense counsel about the\n16 admissibility of some of her statements, and at the break we\n17 talked about the fact that she had pled guilty in fact to\n18 conspiring with the defendant and so her statements came in for\n19 the rest of the trial.\n20 William Je, a key co-conspirator. There was evidence\n21 about his ownership and control of certain key entities on\n22 behalf of the defendant, his transfer of funds between those\n23 entities on behalf of the defendant, including proceeds that\n24 were retained by himself, and his cooperation with other\n25 co-conspirators, including the one I'll go to next, Mileson\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n1 Guo.\n2 There's evidence about Mileson Guo's use of fraud\n3 proceeds to purchase luxury goods. There's documentary\n4 evidence of Mileson Guo's communications on behalf of entities\n5 in the G enterprise. Mileson Guo connects to Haoran He.\n6 There is extensive evidence, including from witnesses\n7 who dealt with Mr. He directly, about his role as the paper\n8 owner of and operator of a large number of significant G\n9 Enterprise entities, and of course, he sort of takes center\n10 stage at G|CLUBS, through the testimony of Ms. Reyes and many\n11 of the documents your Honor saw where he is giving direction\n12 for G|CLUBS purportedly as its owner, and of course other\n13 evidence suggested that he was doing that in connection and\n14 conspiracy with the defendant and the defendant's other\n15 co-conspirators.\n16 So those are the sort of core co-conspirators in the\n17 case. And of course there was other evidence that came in.\n18 Some of it was resolved in realtime. It was somebody who made\n19 one or just several appearances. And so we——\n20 THE COURT: So Yanping Wang, William Je, Mileson Guo,\n21 and Haoran He, correct?\n22 MR. HORTON: That's right. I would call those the\n23 core co-conspirators. Of course, there's evidence about Aaron\n24 Mitchell, Victor Cerda, etc. I would just draw the Court's\n25 attention to two things. So co-conspirators and agents——and of\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n1 course the co-conspirator exception is just the sort of more\n2 specific species of 801(b)(2) which deals with agent statements\n3 in general. When somebody came up and they weren't a repeat\n4 player, so to speak, we often went to sidebar and we litigated\n5 that in realtime and pointed the Court to evidence that had\n6 come in or was about to come in and the Court ruled during the\n7 course of trial.\n8 So just to set that stage and reiterate that the\n9 standard is a preponderance, we think that there's evidence\n10 beyond a reasonable doubt that the elements are met, that if a\n11 conspiracy existed, that the co-conspirator declarants were\n12 members of that conspiracy with the defendant, and that the\n13 statements that we offered, to the extent we offered them for\n14 their truth——and of course the Court saw, not all of these\n15 co-conspirator and agent statements were offered for their\n16 truth; some of them were offered for their falsity, some of\n17 them were offered for their effects on the witness or other\n18 people, but to the extent that they were offered for their\n19 truth——we'd submit that the evidence over the last six weeks\n20 surpasses that preponderance standard that the Court uses in\n21 making its Geaney finding. And as Mr. Fergenson said, we're\n22 hopeful to rest today, and we'd submit that the Court has more\n23 than enough evidence it needs to make that finding today.\n24 THE COURT: So I believe that the case law calls for\n25 me to make any findings after the close of the prosecution's\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n1 case, and I just don't want to deviate from the formality.\n2 MR. HORTON: I just wanted to tee it up for your\n3 Honor. That's all.\n4 THE COURT: Okay. Anything further?\n5 MS. SHROFF: Your Honor, I wasn't sure if the Court\n6 wanted to hear from us or if we could respond when it is\n7 properly brought at the end of the government's case, or after\n8 the close of the government's case. Obviously we had no notice\n9 that the government was going to address this issue this\n10 morning. I don't think Mr. Kamaraju was alerted either. So we\n11 would appreciate additional time.\n12 I would note just two short points here. One, the\n13 conspiracy has to exist prior to the admittance of the\n14 statement, and a generic statement by the government counsel\n15 that a conspiracy existed over a six-week——I think it's been\n16 six weeks, although I've lost count——trial I do not think meets\n17 even the preponderance standard. And the government, at least\n18 this morning, has just sort of generally addressed Ms. Wang,\n19 Mileson, Mr. He, and William Je. I think there were issues\n20 with statements made by others, including Dara Lawall. And we\n21 would like an opportunity to make sure we have the transcript\n22 pages ready for the Court and be better prepared before\n23 addressing it. Since it should be done after the close of the\n24 government's case, we will endeavor to be ready.\n25 THE COURT: And what is the spelling of the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n1 individual's name that you just mentioned?\n2 MS. SHROFF: The first name is D-A-R-A, and the last\n3 name is L-A-W-A-L-L. For the Court's convenience, your Honor,\n4 she is the spouse of Aaron Mitchell, who practiced law, and her\n5 testimony was brought out, or her issue was raised during Amy\n6 Buck's testimony.\n7 THE COURT: Of course I will offer the defense an\n8 opportunity to address these issues at the close of the\n9 prosecution's case.\n10 MS. SHROFF: Thank you, your Honor.\n11 MR. FERGENSON: I'm happy to address Ms. Lawall, but\n12 we can also table it for later, if your Honor prefers that.\n13 THE COURT: I think it's a better idea.\n14 MR. FERGENSON: Okay. And just one update on the\n15 other issue Ms. Shroff raised. On the specific exhibits,\n16 actually, when I checked my email, the other AUSA had already\n17 sent them across, so that one's done.\n18 THE COURT: All righty. So we will have the witness\n19 back on the stand at 9:29 and get started at 9:30.\n20 MS. SHROFF: Your Honor, we did receive the email at\n21 9:06 this morning. Thank you.\n22 (Recess)\n23 (At the sidebar)\n24 THE COURT: I just wanted to make clear that the\n25 government needs to specify all the individuals with respect to\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 the Geaney application, and of course justify why those\n2 statements should be allowed in.\n3 MR. HORTON: Understood. Thank you, your Honor.\n4 MR. KAMARAJU: Thank you, your Honor.\n5 (In open court)\n6 THE COURT: Please have the jurors brought in.\n7 (Continued on next page)\n8\n9\n10\n11\n12\n13\n14\n15\n16\n17\n18\n19\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 (Jury present)\n2 THE COURT: Please be seated.\n3 Good morning, jurors.\n4 THE JURORS: Good morning.\n5 THE COURT: We're going to continue with the direct\n6 examination of the witness.\n7 Sir, remember that you're still under oath.\n8 You may continue the inquiry.\n9 MS. MURRAY: Thank you, your Honor.\n10 PAUL HINTON, resumed.\n11 DIRECT EXAMINATION\n12 BY MS. MURRAY:\n13 Q. Good morning, Mr. Hinton.\n14 A. Good morning.\n15 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, can we please put up\n16 Government Exhibit Z26 and go to slide 5.\n17 Q. Mr. Hinton, while we're waiting for this, can you explain\n18 to the jury what tracing is.\n19 A. Yes. Tracing, as I use the term, relates to following\n20 money through a series of accounts over time.\n21 Q. And how, if at all, do you trace funds through a series of\n22 accounts?\n23 A. Well, you look at the inflows into an account and the\n24 subsequent outflows from an account, and then if there are any\n25 outflows that go to another account, for example, via a wire\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 transfer, you then have to follow the money to that subsequent\n2 account, and then you do the same thing there.\n3 Q. How, if at all, did you use tracing of funds in the process\n4 of checking the accuracy of the information in these summary\n5 slides?\n6 A. Well, strictly, I wasn't asked to do any tracing.\n7 Q. Did you evaluate inflows and outflows in evaluating the\n8 accuracy of the information contained on these summary charts?\n9 A. Yes. For each trans——individual transaction, I was looking\n10 at the timing of the flows and the amounts of the flows and\n11 which accounts they went between.\n12 Q. And we talked a bit yesterday about the Sources of Funds\n13 that's contained within the summary charts. Do you recall\n14 that?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 Q. And specifically how the government characterized Sources\n17 of Funds for purposes of G|CLUBS. What about GTV and Voice of\n18 Guo, or VOG; how did the government instruct Brattle to define\n19 source of funds for purposes of those accounts?\n20 A. For those accounts, we were simply identifying all of the\n21 flows for individuals who weren't otherwise identified as being\n22 associated with any of the entities that we talked about\n23 yesterday that were in the different categories that were shown\n24 on my charts.\n25 Q. And for the Farms, for Sources of Funds for purposes of the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Farms analysis, did the government provide Brattle with a list\n2 of entities or individuals who should be categorized as Sources\n3 of Funds for the Farms?\n4 A. Yes, there was a long series of entities that were\n5 associated with Farms, and those were shown on the chart as\n6 contributing funds through the Farms category on the chart.\n7 Q. And finally, the Himalaya Exchange. Did the government\n8 identify for you certain companies or bank accounts that were\n9 associated with incoming Sources of Funds for purposes of the\n10 summary of the Himalaya Exchange money?\n11 A. Yes. So again, in terms of the entities that are part of\n12 the Himalaya category, those were all defined, listed for us by\n13 the government, so we matched those against the transactions,\n14 and then anything that was——any of the Sources of Funds that\n15 flowed into those entities' accounts came from individuals who\n16 weren't otherwise associated with any of these classified\n17 entities.\n18 Q. And can you explain, again, as we're waiting, just a few of\n19 the other methods that you used to confirm the accuracy of the\n20 information contained on the charts as it's reflected in the\n21 source bank records that you reviewed.\n22 A. Yes. So ultimately, after the government determined which\n23 of the financial transactions and groups of transactions they\n24 wanted to appear on the charts, we used our database to\n25 identify what the underlying individual transactions were that\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 would be summed up and displayed on the chart, and then for\n2 each of those transactions, we were able to look at the\n3 underlying Government Exhibit, which was a bank record that\n4 showed the amount of the transaction.\n5 Q. All right. We now have Government Exhibit Z26 up at slide\n6 5. What is the title of this slide, Mr. Hinton?\n7 A. This slide is titled GTV/VOG: Select Flows.\n8 Q. And looking at the first-level entities or first-level bank\n9 accounts, if I can call them that, from the Source of Funds\n10 into each of the first arrows, can you just read the entity\n11 names that the funds for GTV and VOG flowed to.\n12 A. Yes. So from Sources of Funds on the left-hand side, we\n13 see the first account is Voice of Guo Media, and it's a Bank of\n14 America account, 7226.\n15 The second account is also a Voice of Guo Media, Inc.\n16 account, this one at Wells Fargo bank, 5536.\n17 The third account is a Saraca Media Group, Inc.\n18 account at JPMorgan, 5601.\n19 The fourth account is a GTV Media Group, Inc. account\n20 at Capital One.\n21 And the fifth account is a GTV Media Group, Inc.\n22 account at JPMorgan, 3335.\n23 Q. And so of those five accounts, is it correct that they are\n24 held at four different banks?\n25 A. That's correct.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Q. Looking at the center arrow, down to the JPMorgan 5601\n2 Saraca Media account, how much money flowed through Sources of\n3 Funds into that account through June 4th of 2020?\n4 A. 275.9 million.\n5 Q. And then if we could look at the flows out of that account.\n6 Can you just read the amounts and the date ranges of when the\n7 money flowed out of that account.\n8 A. Yes. There were three flows out of that Saraca account\n9 that are shown on this chart to other entities.\n10 On the left, 125.5 million between June 3rd and\n11 June 10th is transferred to Saraca Media Group, Inc.'s JPMorgan\n12 account ending 2038.\n13 200 million is transferred on June 3rd to GTV Media\n14 Group's Citibank account 6691; and 10 million on May 13, 2020,\n15 to GTV Media Group, Inc. Capital One account ending 7000.\n16 Q. And Mr. Hinton, just to be clear, did these summary charts\n17 reflect all of the transactions that were contained within the\n18 bank records that the government provided you?\n19 A. No. It's only a selected number of the transactions.\n20 Q. And the bank records that you were provided, were those\n21 selected by the government?\n22 A. They were.\n23 Q. Did Brattle process only a portion of those bank records in\n24 the end and reflect those on these charts?\n25 A. That's correct. We identified a large number, and the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 government instructed us to——us to process a subset of those.\n2 Q. Can you describe the process by which the government\n3 discussed with Brattle which accounts to prioritize for\n4 purposes of processing.\n5 A. Yes. So initially they gave us this huge volume of\n6 documents and we had to identify which accounts were contained\n7 in those documents. We then generated a list of those\n8 accounts, showed them to the government, and the government\n9 instructed us which of those accounts were the highest priority\n10 and we should process.\n11 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, could we go to the next\n12 slide, please.\n13 Q. What's the title of this slide, Mr. Hinton?\n14 A. This slide is titled VOG: Select Flows.\n15 Q. Looking on the top left, there's a category called Other\n16 Inflows. What, if anything, does that represent?\n17 A. Well, that just shows all the flows into the Voice of Guo\n18 Media accounts that are listed there other than the\n19 26.7 million coming from Sources of Funds over the time period\n20 May 26, 2020, to June 6, 2020.\n21 Q. And there's an individual named on here, Lihong Wei\n22 Lafrenz. Do you know who that is?\n23 A. No.\n24 MS. MURRAY: All right. Ms. Loftus, let's go to the\n25 next slide.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Q. If we could turn now to the Farms, Mr. Hinton.\n2 MS. MURRAY: If we could go to slide 8, please.\n3 Q. So looking here, there are kind of two categories on the\n4 top. There's Farms in green, and then there's Sources of Funds\n5 on the right in gray.\n6 First, the Farms category showing flows, does that\n7 capture the companies or individuals the government provided\n8 and identified to Brattle as associated with the Farms?\n9 A. Yes, that's correct. There's a list, a long list of those.\n10 Q. And what accounts does the 77 million go to from the Farms?\n11 A. It goes to an ACA Capital account at First Abu Dhabi Bank.\n12 Q. Where is First Abu Dhabi Bank located?\n13 A. In Abu Dhabi, I believe.\n14 Q. From your review of bank records the government provided,\n15 do you have an understanding of who, if anyone, controlled that\n16 ACA Capital account?\n17 A. No.\n18 MR. KAMARAJU: Objection.\n19 Q. If we could look now at the——\n20 THE COURT: The objection is overruled.\n21 Q. If we could look now at the flow of funds from the ACA\n22 Capital account. Let's start on the left.\n23 And if you could just read for the jury the amount and\n24 then the account holder or holders that the money went to.\n25 A. Yes. First, 19 million was transferred to Lexington\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Property & Staffing LLC in two accounts, DCB 0625 and Signature\n2 3545.\n3 Q. Sorry. Could you read the signature number again?\n4 A. Signature 3945. Sorry.\n5 Q. Thank you.\n6 A. The next transfer shown is 11.2 million transferred to\n7 William Je and Sing Ting Rong. And they're at three different\n8 bank accounts that received that money——two Barclays accounts\n9 and an HPB account.\n10 Q. And the next flow?\n11 A. The next flow is 18 million to Hudson Diamond.\n12 Q. Over what time period?\n13 A. From February 2, 2021, to February 10, 2021.\n14 Q. And where, ultimately, does 16 million go then from the\n15 Hudson Diamond's holding account?\n16 A. Yes, in May through June, 16 million from the Hudson\n17 Diamond account is transferred to Lamp Capital LLC.\n18 Q. And just to be clear about the date ranges of that\n19 $16 million collective transaction, what was the date range for\n20 that flow?\n21 A. May 28, '21, through July 30, 2021.\n22 Q. All right. Continuing from the ACA Capital account, we\n23 just did to Hudson Diamond. What's the next flow represented\n24 on the summary?\n25 A. Well, there's a $13 million transfer from ACA Capital\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 directly to the Lamp Capital accounts.\n2 Q. And then finally——well, not finally, but the next one going\n3 to the right.\n4 A. Yes, the next one is 5 million going to Greenwich Land LLC.\n5 Q. And then the last flow that we see going kind of 3:00.\n6 A. Is 32 million to Savio Law.\n7 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, I'd like to pull up\n8 Government Exhibit GX PNC39 at page 3, please.\n9 Q. Focusing on that last transaction that you just mentioned,\n10 or the last flow you just mentioned, Mr. Hinton, the 32 million\n11 to Savio Law.\n12 MS. MURRAY: All right. And if we could go to page 3,\n13 please. Actually——sorry——let's go to the top of the page,\n14 Ms. Loftus.\n15 Q. Mr. Hinton, is this one of the bank records that you were\n16 provided by the government in this case?\n17 A. It is.\n18 Q. Is this one of the records that you reviewed to confirm the\n19 accuracy of the charts we've been talking about, including Z26?\n20 A. It is.\n21 Q. Looking at the top left, what is listed in the bold and\n22 then, underneath that, on the very top left?\n23 A. It says IOLTA, IOLTA Checking.\n24 Q. And beneath that?\n25 A. PNC Bank.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Q. What is the time period for this particular bank statement?\n2 A. October 31, 2020, through November 30, 2020.\n3 Q. And then beneath that, can you read the entity name and the\n4 address associated with this account.\n5 A. Savio Law at 3 Dale Court, Hazlet, New Jersey.\n6 Q. Under Savio Law LLC, there's a description. Can you read\n7 that to the jury, please.\n8 A. IOLTA Attorney Trust Account.\n9 Q. Do you have any independent knowledge of whether Savio Law\n10 LLC is a law firm?\n11 A. No.\n12 Q. And looking on the right, what are the last four of the\n13 account number we're looking at here?\n14 A. 8162.\n15 MS. MURRAY: All right. We can now go to page 3,\n16 Ms. Loftus.\n17 And let's focus on Activity Details, Deposits and\n18 Other Additions.\n19 Q. Mr. Hinton, do you see the transactions that are listed\n20 here for Deposits and Other Additions in this account?\n21 A. I do.\n22 Q. What are the date ranges of the top four transactions?\n23 A. From November 12th to November 16th.\n24 Q. And what are the amounts of each, just from the top down?\n25 A. Yes. 9.5 million, 8.5 million, 7.5 million, and 6,499,935.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Q. Mr. Hinton, did those four transactions collectively\n2 represent the 32 million that we just looked at in the flow\n3 from ACA Capital to Savio Law?\n4 A. Yes.\n5 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, we can go back to Z26,\n6 please.\n7 And we were at page 8.\n8 Q. All right. So this is the broader summary of the Farm\n9 flows, Mr. Hinton. I'd like to now go and drill down on a few\n10 of the different flows.\n11 MS. MURRAY: If we could go to the next page, please,\n12 Ms. Loftus.\n13 Q. Looking beneath Savio Law and ACA Capital and what's now\n14 the blank space——if we can go to the next slide,\n15 please——Mr. Hinton, what are the two flows that are reflected\n16 here that occurred on October 15, 2020?\n17 A. There's a $5 million transfer to Greenwich Land LLC and\n18 there's a $5 million transfer to Lamp Capital.\n19 Q. And at which bank were the accounts held that received\n20 those $5 million transfers on October 15, 2020?\n21 A. Bank of Princeton.\n22 MS. MURRAY: All right. Ms. Loftus, let's go to the\n23 next slide now, please.\n24 Q. And then what do we see reflected here, Mr. Hinton, from\n25 ACA Capital to Greenwich Land and then the flow out to the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 right?\n2 A. Right. So in October, between October 21st and 23rd, 2020,\n3 $5 million was transferred from ACA Capital to Greenwich Land,\n4 then subsequently on October——between October 26 and\n5 November 20, 2020, 9 million was transferred from Greenwich\n6 Land to Lamp Capital.\n7 MS. MURRAY: All right. Let's go to the next slide,\n8 please, Ms. Loftus.\n9 Q. This is another portion of the broader Farms chart that we\n10 were just looking at, Mr. Hinton. Can you just explain,\n11 generally, starting with Farms and going down to the account\n12 that's highlighted in yellow, what type of flows we're looking\n13 at here in this summary.\n14 A. Yes. This is just showing those flows from the previous\n15 chart that went from Farms, 77 million transferred to ACA\n16 Capital and then two transfers or transfers from ACA Capital to\n17 two different entities, Hudson Diamond receiving 18 million and\n18 Lamp Capital receiving 13 million from ACA Capital, and of\n19 the——there's also a subsequent transfer from Hudson Diamond\n20 Holding of 16 million into Lamp Capital.\n21 Q. And just to make sure that we're reading this correctly, so\n22 the Farms, 77 million to ACA Capital, ultimately, does\n23 $29 million go into the Lamp Capital LLC account, as\n24 represented in these transactions?\n25 A. Yes, ultimately, the account that received the $77 million\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 from Farms subsequently transferred money to Lamp Capital with\n2 13 million and 18 to Hudson; Hudson Diamond then subsequently\n3 transferred 16 million to Lamp Capital; so together, there's\n4 29 million coming into Lamp Capital.\n5 MS. MURRAY: And let's go the next slide, please,\n6 Ms. Loftus.\n7 Q. On this slide, Mr. Hinton, we're starting with what was the\n8 terminus of the last slide, the Lamp Capital account; is that\n9 correct?\n10 A. Yes.\n11 Q. And what is the title of this slide?\n12 A. It's Farms: Select Expenses from Lamp Capital Accounts.\n13 Q. Mr. Hinton, does this slide reflect just a subset of\n14 outflows from the Lamp Capital Signature Bank account?\n15 A. It does.\n16 Q. And who selected which transactions to reflect on this\n17 slide?\n18 A. The government.\n19 Q. I want to look at some of the records underlying these\n20 transactions. But first, Mr. Hinton, if you could just read\n21 the categories that are shown in the bubbles starting from left\n22 to right for the flows here.\n23 A. Yes. The select expenses include car-related expenses,\n24 Yachtzoo LLC expenses, ACASS Canada Ltd., Cirrus Design\n25 Corporation, Mei Guo, and Qiang Guo.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 MS. MURRAY: All right. Ms. Loftus, let's go to\n2 Government Exhibit SIG102 and go to page 4.\n3 Q. I want to look at one of the car-related expenses that was\n4 reflected on the slide we just looked at, slide 13.\n5 Actually, focusing on the first page——thank you,\n6 Ms. Loftus——just looking at the statement itself, what is the\n7 statement period we're looking at here, Mr. Hinton?\n8 A. The statement period is May 1st through 31st——\n9 Q. And what year?\n10 A. ——2021.\n11 Q. Sorry. I spoke over you. What year?\n12 A. 2021.\n13 Q. And is this one of the bank records the government provided\n14 to you which you reviewed in connection with checking the\n15 accuracy of the summary charts?\n16 A. It is.\n17 Q. Looking on the left, what is the name and the address for\n18 this particular bank account?\n19 A. It's Lamp Capital LLC, at 667 Madison Avenue, New York, New\n20 York.\n21 MS. MURRAY: All right. Ms. Loftus, let's zoom out of\n22 that and go to page 4, please.\n23 Thank you. And if we could highlight the May 27th,\n24 the larger entry here.\n25 Q. Mr. Hinton, do you see that, that transaction as reflected\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 in this bank record?\n2 A. I do.\n3 Q. Looking at that, what type of transaction is reflected\n4 here, for May 27, 2021, from this Lamp Capital account?\n5 A. It's an outgoing wire.\n6 Q. And two lines down, to whom was that outgoing wire sent?\n7 A. The wire transfer was made to Wells Fargo bank account\n8 8296, which was for the benefit of Miller Motorcars, Inc.\n9 Q. What was the dollar amount of that outgoing wire to Miller\n10 Motorcars from Lamp Capital?\n11 A. It was $294,306.\n12 MS. MURRAY: Skipping around on the expenses, if we\n13 could look on the same page, Ms. Loftus, the second entry,\n14 May 19 of 2021.\n15 Q. What type of transaction is reflected here, Mr. Hinton?\n16 A. This is also an outgoing wire transfer.\n17 Q. And looking two lines down, to whom was this outgoing wire\n18 sent?\n19 A. It was sent to Mei Guo.\n20 Q. What was the dollar amount of this outgoing wire from Lamp\n21 Capital to Mei Guo on May 19, 2021?\n22 A. It was $500,000.\n23 MS. MURRAY: All right. Ms. Loftus, let's go now,\n24 please, to Z26 again at slide 13.\n25 Q. I just want to look back at where we see the transactions\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 we just saw reflected on this chart.\n2 So Mr. Hinton, the Miller Motorcars, where, if\n3 anywhere, on this summary chart is that sum included?\n4 A. It's in the red-lined bubble that's titled Car-Related\n5 Expenses.\n6 Q. And the $500,000 to Mei Guo, where, if anywhere on this\n7 summary slide, is that transaction reflected?\n8 A. That's the second line from the right with the——the\n9 lavender-colored bubble at the bottom.\n10 Q. All right. We're going to look now, Mr. Hinton, at one of\n11 the records for ACASS Canada Ltd., which is the third arrow\n12 flow on this chart.\n13 MR. HORTON: If we could please go to Government\n14 Exhibit NJ808, page 2.\n15 Q. And just to clarify, not looking at one of the bank records\n16 but looking at one of the government exhibits relating to that\n17 particular flow. Mr. Hinton, do you know what kind of company\n18 ACASS Canada Ltd. is?\n19 A. No.\n20 Q. So this is a Government Exhibit titled NJ808. Have you\n21 seen this before?\n22 A. I don't recall.\n23 Q. Focusing on the top——Ms. Loftus, if we could zoom in——the\n24 Company Name/Service Provider listed here, could you read that\n25 for us, please, Mr. Hinton.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 MS. MURRAY: If we're able to zoom in on that, please,\n2 Ms. Loftus.\n3 Q. So it's under Company Name entry there, the first line, the\n4 first long line.\n5 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, can you highlight that,\n6 please.\n7 A. Yes, so it says Company Name, ACASS Canada Ltd., and then\n8 afterwards, it has in quotes Service Provider, so I believe the\n9 service provider you're referring to is ACASS Canada Ltd.\n10 MS. MURRAY: And let's zoom out of that, please,\n11 Ms. Loftus, and let's look further down the page.\n12 Q. Focusing now on the bottom, just the \"Agreed by\" through to\n13 the right side.\n14 Mr. Hinton, looking here, \"Agreed by Service\n15 Provider,\" what is in that field on this document?\n16 A. It's ACASS Canada Ltd.\n17 Q. And who is listed on the right as the customer?\n18 A. \"Agreed to by customer Whitecroft Shore Ltd.,\" and then\n19 there's a signature and a printed name.\n20 Q. What is the printed name?\n21 A. The printed name is Mei Guo.\n22 MS. MURRAY: All right. Let's zoom out of that,\n23 please, Ms. Loftus.\n24 And if we could focus again just on the very top\n25 paragraph, \"In accordance with.\"\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Q. Mr. Hinton, looking at this portion of this document, can\n2 you just read the first sentence through to the first comma.\n3 A. Yes. \"In accordance with paragraph C6 of the CorporateCare\n4 Terms as incorporated in an Aircraft Enrollment Contract, the\n5 customer, Whitecroft Shore Limited, hereby authorizes,\" etc.\n6 Q. And in this text, what type of contract is referenced?\n7 A. It's an Aircraft Enrollment Contract.\n8 Q. Thank you.\n9 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, let's take that down now and\n10 go to Government Exhibit VK10 at page 58.\n11 It's VK10 at page 58. Oh, sorry. UK, UK10.\n12 If we could look at the top of this, please.\n13 Q. Mr. Hinton, have you seen this document before?\n14 A. I don't recall whether I've reviewed this one individually.\n15 Q. What is the title on this page of Government Exhibit UK10?\n16 A. It's Initial Deposit Wire Transfer.\n17 Q. Who is listed as the customer on this document?\n18 A. Mileson Guo.\n19 Q. And the account name a few lines down?\n20 A. Is Wells Fargo Bank.\n21 Q. Oh, not the bank name——sorry——the account name, a couple of\n22 lines down.\n23 A. Oh, I'm sorry. Cirrus Design Corporation is the account.\n24 Q. A few lines further down from that, there's a deposit\n25 amount in USD. Do you see that?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 A. I do.\n2 Q. What is that amount?\n3 A. It's $95,000.\n4 MS. MURRAY: Could we zoom out of it, Ms. Loftus, so\n5 we can see more of this page.\n6 And let's go to the next page, please.\n7 Q. Mr. Hinton, what's the title of this page of Government\n8 Exhibit UK10? This is page 59.\n9 A. This page is titled Second Deposit Wire Transfer.\n10 Q. And the customer name here?\n11 A. Mileson Guo.\n12 Q. Again, a few lines down, the account name for this second\n13 deposit wire transfer?\n14 A. The——the account name is Cirrus Design Corporation.\n15 Q. And a few lines below that, deposit amount in U.S. dollars?\n16 A. It's 206,700.\n17 Q. And the next line on this document, what is the field and\n18 then what is the information in that field?\n19 A. Yes. It says, \"Aircraft Reference: Vision SF50 G2\n20 Position.\"\n21 MS. MURRAY: All right. Ms. Loftus, let's go again to\n22 Z26, page 13, just to see where the transactions we just\n23 reviewed are reflected.\n24 Q. So here, Mr. Hinton, can you explain to the jury where we\n25 see those two entities we just looked at, ACASS and Cirrus\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Design.\n2 A. They are the black ovals that are towards the bottom middle\n3 of the chart.\n4 Q. And finally, I'd like to look at the 20 million on the\n5 right side of this chart that goes to Qiang Guo. And do you\n6 know who that individual is, Mr. Hinton?\n7 A. I do not.\n8 Q. All right. What is the date range of that $20 million\n9 collective transfer?\n10 A. It's May 18, '21, through June 1st——\n11 Q. Of what year?\n12 A. ——of 2021.\n13 MS. MURRAY: All right. Ms. Loftus, let's go to\n14 Government Exhibit 3200, please.\n15 Q. Focusing first on the top of this document, Mr. Hinton, is\n16 this one of the bank records that you reviewed in connection\n17 with your work verifying the summary charts?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. At the top, what is the date for this account statement?\n20 A. It is December 14, 2021.\n21 Q. And looking on the right, there are three letters on the\n22 top right. Do you see those?\n23 A. I do.\n24 Q. What do those reflect?\n25 A. CHF I believe refers to Swiss francs.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Q. And the name beneath that?\n2 A. Qiang Guo.\n3 MS. MURRAY: Let's go to the next page, please,\n4 Ms. Loftus. Oh, actually, let's stay here for a moment.\n5 Q. Mr. Hinton, the first line on this account statement, what\n6 was the balance of this account as of July 31, 2020?\n7 A. It indicates a 0 balance on that date.\n8 MS. MURRAY: All right. Let's go to the next slide,\n9 please.\n10 And the next slide. Excuse me.\n11 Q. Looking here, Mr. Hinton, again, the top line, the balance\n12 brought forward as of July 31, 2020, what is that amount as\n13 reflected here?\n14 A. It's a 0 balance.\n15 Q. Can you read the next entry on this bank statement,\n16 starting with the date.\n17 A. On May 19, 2021, there's a credit transaction that's\n18 referred to as bonification from Lamp Capital LLC for 7 million\n19 U.S. dollars.\n20 Q. And how do you know that that's denominated in U.S.\n21 dollars, based on this bank record?\n22 A. Well, this particular page of the statement has USD at the\n23 top right.\n24 MS. MURRAY: And Ms. Loftus, let's go to the next\n25 slide, please.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Q. Focusing on the third line on this page of the bank\n2 statement, what is the date of that transaction? And can you\n3 explain the details.\n4 A. The date of that transaction is the 2nd of June and——2021,\n5 and it's a $13 million credit from bonification——it says\n6 bonification from Lamp Capital. So it's——my understanding is\n7 that's a transfer to this account from Lamp Capital of\n8 $13 million.\n9 MS. MURRAY: All right. Ms. Loftus, go back to Z26,\n10 slide 13.\n11 Q. Mr. Hinton, those two transactions we just looked at, the\n12 7 million and the 13 million, are those collectively the\n13 20 million reflected on the right side flow on this summary\n14 chart?\n15 A. They are.\n16 MS. MURRAY: Go to the next slide.\n17 Q. I'd like to talk through G|CLUBS and Crane a bit.\n18 First of all, Mr. Hinton, who determined that Crane\n19 accounts were associated with the G|CLUBS category for purposes\n20 of these summaries?\n21 A. The government.\n22 Q. Do you have any independent knowledge of what Crane is?\n23 A. I do not.\n24 Q. All right. Looking at this, there's a lot going on, so\n25 we're going to break it down a little bit.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Does this show the flow of certain Sources of Funds\n2 that were within the category of G|CLUBS and Crane that the\n3 government identified?\n4 A. Yes, certain selected funds and certain selected accounts,\n5 yes.\n6 Q. And does this slide reflect just a subset of the flows that\n7 went to and through the various G Club and Crane accounts?\n8 A. Yes, it's just a subset.\n9 Q. Let's look at a couple of the transactions that are\n10 reflected here.\n11 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, if we could go——\n12 Q. Well, first of all, Mr. Hinton, can you just explain the\n13 color scheme that we have going on here a bit so the jury\n14 understands what those colors reflect.\n15 A. Yes. The idea here is to use the same color for all the\n16 different accounts for the same entity or groups of entities.\n17 So the G|CLUBS entities are shown in dark blue, the Crane\n18 entities are shown in light blue, and the Hamilton and Himalaya\n19 entities are shown in yellow.\n20 Q. And up on the top right there is an inflow from Farms to\n21 Crane Advisory. What color is reflected for Farms?\n22 A. Yes, we're consistently using green to indicate Farms\n23 entities.\n24 Q. All right. So let's break this down a little bit.\n25 MS. MURRAY: If we could go to the next slide, please,\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 Ms. Loftus.\n2 Q. Focusing now, Mr. Hinton, on the G|CLUBS portion of this\n3 summary of selected flows, can you just narrate us a bit\n4 through the various flows that end up in the G Club Operations\n5 Morgan Stanley account, the three accounts listed here.\n6 A. Yes. Between February 3, 2021, and July 9, 2021,\n7 $8.6 million was transferred to those Morgan Stanley G Club\n8 accounts that are listed in the box there from Sources of\n9 Funds.\n10 Q. And in looking at the other inflows into those Morgan\n11 Stanley accounts, as reflected here, just at a high level,\n12 where do we see the money coming from and into those Morgan\n13 Stanley accounts?\n14 A. They're coming from other G Club Operations accounts at two\n15 different banks.\n16 Q. Starting on the left, can you read kind of the left bottom\n17 from the Signature account going around clockwise.\n18 A. Certainly. So there's a G|CLUBS Operations LLC account at\n19 Signature Bank, 3576, and that account transferred 14.5 million\n20 on January 11, 2021, to the Morgan Stanley G Club Operations\n21 account.\n22 Then next in the rotation, there's a G|CLUBS\n23 Operations account at——I think it's First Bank, 7085, and\n24 there's a $52.2 million transfer on December 17, 2020, to the\n25 Morgan Stanley G Club Operations accounts.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 And finally, there's a separate First Bank account for\n2 G Club Operations ending 7052. The transfer is a hundred\n3 thousand, on December 29, 2020.\n4 Q. And Mr. Hinton, each of those three transfers that you just\n5 discussed had a single date associated with them; is that\n6 correct?\n7 A. That's correct.\n8 Q. Was each of those an individual transaction into the\n9 G|CLUBS Morgan Stanley account?\n10 A. I believe so, but that's based on my——my memory.\n11 Q. And then looking from the Morgan Stanley accounts, what are\n12 the two outgoing flows that are reflected on this summary\n13 chart?\n14 A. Yes, there's a $10 million collection of outflows on\n15 January 21, 2021, through February 4, 2021, to Fiesta Property\n16 Developments Limited, and there's a series of transfers to a\n17 G|CLUBS International account at Mercantile Bank that summed to\n18 62.7 million over the period August 20, '21 through October 8,\n19 2021.\n20 Q. Mr. Hinton, do you know what Fiesta Property Developments\n21 Limited is?\n22 A. I do not.\n23 MS. MURRAY: All right. Let's go to the next slide,\n24 Ms. Loftus.\n25 Q. I'd like to focus now on the Crane portion of the select\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct\n1 flows reflected here.\n2 We're not going to go through this in every\n3 transaction detail, Mr. Hinton, but just starting with the\n4 arrow straight down from Sources of Funds to the Citi account,\n5 5278, what amount is represented there?\n6 A. 59.5 million.\n7 Q. And over what time period?\n8 A. November 23, 2020, through April 1, 2021.\n9 Q. And then following that arrow straight down, what is the\n10 next flow that's reflected here from that Citi account?\n11 A. Yes, that same Citi account for Crane Advisory Group at\n12 Citibank transfers 58.2 million to Crane Advisory Group at\n13 Morgan Stanley.\n14 Q. And I want to focus just briefly on the Crane Advisory\n15 Group account on the far right, the Capital One 0887 account.\n16 Do you see that?\n17 A. I do.\n18 (Continued on next page)\n19\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 BY MS. MURRAY:\n2 Q. There are both inflows and outflows for that account; is\n3 that correct?\n4 A. Yes.\n5 Q. Looking at other inflows above which is going down the 25.3\n6 million, what types of transactions does that reflect on this\n7 chart?\n8 A. Those are all the transactions over that time period that\n9 aren't coming from the other entities the explicitly listed on\n10 the chart.\n11 Q. And then there's an outflow or outflows over a time period,\n12 the $42 million, which accounts and over what time period does\n13 that money flow from Capital One?\n14 A. Between May 28 and July 13, 2021.\n15 Q. And that goes to Crane Advisory accounts held at what bank?\n16 A. At Morgan Stanley.\n17 MS. MURRAY: Let's go to the next slide please,\n18 Ms. Loftus, and marry those two, the G/Club and the Crane.\n19 Q. Looking at this, this now brings those together, and in\n20 particular there's a flow just to the left of the middle of the\n21 page from Crane Advisory Group's Morgan Stanley accounts to the\n22 G/Club Morgan Stanley accounts, if would highlight that,\n23 Ms. Loftus.\n24 What is the dollar amount of that collective transfer\n25 from Crane to G/Club?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 A. The aggregate amount of the transfers between the Morgan\n2 Stanley accounts for Crane Advisory and the Morgan Stanley\n3 accounts for G/Club Operations over that period is 87.1\n4 million.\n5 Q. What is the period for that 87.1 million transfer?\n6 A. It's a series of transfers over the period May 24, 2021\n7 through July 2nd, 2021.\n8 Q. Ms. Loftus, let's go to the next slide and build in the\n9 Himalaya Exchange entities.\n10 Mr. Hinton, now looking at the accounts we just ended\n11 with, the G/Club Morgan Stanley accounts, what is the outflow\n12 reflected here over the period of May 6, 2021 to June 23, 2021?\n13 A. $85 million.\n14 Q. If you could highlight that for the jury, please,\n15 Ms. Loftus, on the left from G/Club to Hamilton.\n16 And then looking from that Hamilton Digital Assets\n17 account we see another flow in the amount of $85 million. Is\n18 that right?\n19 A. That is correct.\n20 Q. What is the period of time for that agregation of flows?\n21 A. From September 1, 2021 through September 16.\n22 Q. And that goes to a bank account held in what name?\n23 A. Hamilton Opportunity Fund.\n24 Q. At what bank?\n25 A. At Silvergate Bank, 9306.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 Q. Focusing now on that Silvergate account, the Hamilton\n2 Opportunity Fund, there's also another incoming flow above from\n3 a Himalaya International Clearing entity. Do you see that?\n4 A. I do.\n5 Q. What is the dollar amount of that?\n6 A. It's $25 million.\n7 Q. Let's build in the next slide, please, Ms. Loftus.\n8 Looking on the right now, Mr. Hinton, we're looking in\n9 the September and October 2021 time period with a series of\n10 flows to Lawall & Mitchell, LLC account. Do you see that?\n11 A. I do.\n12 Q. Can you read the dollar amounts and the dates of the\n13 inflows into that account from the various Crane accounts as\n14 reflected on this chart?\n15 A. The Morgan Stanley account sends 6.8 million on October 19.\n16 The IDB bank account send 1.6 million on the 27th of September.\n17 The Signature Bank account sends 2.3 million between September\n18 27th and October 12, 2021, and the Crane Advisory account at\n19 Capital One sends 37 million on September 26, 2021.\n20 Q. Let's go to the next slide. I want to continue along in\n21 our chronology here on this summary.\n22 So we're looking again in the middle of the page\n23 Hamilton Opportunity Silvergate account. There's now an\n24 outgoing flow from that account on October 27, 2021. Do you\n25 see that?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 A. I do.\n2 Q. What is the dollar amount of that flow?\n3 A. 59 million.\n4 Q. And that goes from a Hamilton Opportunity Fund account held\n5 at what bank to a Hamilton Opportunity account held at what\n6 bank?\n7 A. This transfer between two Silvergate accounts for the same\n8 entity, Hamilton Opportunity Fund, so it had a 9306 account\n9 that transferred to the 7747 account.\n10 Q. Let's go to the next slide please, Ms. Loftus.\n11 What do we see here?\n12 A. We see the same amount being transferred on the same day\n13 from the Silvergate 7747 account to a third Hamilton\n14 Opportunity Fund account at Silvergate numbered 7739.\n15 Q. And those $59 million transfers from Hamilton Opportunity\n16 Fund accounts, those transfers are on the same day among\n17 different accounts; is that correct?\n18 A. That's right.\n19 Q. Let's go to the next slide, please.\n20 So there's now an account at the bottom of this slide\n21 listed as Silvergate 7713. Do you see that?\n22 A. I do.\n23 Q. In what entity name is that account held?\n24 A. That's also Hamilton Opportunity Fund SPC.\n25 Q. And let's look at the inflows then into that account from\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 both the Hamilton Opportunity Fund SPC 7721 Silvergate account\n2 on the left, and the Hamilton Opportunity Fund SPC 7739\n3 Silvergate account on the right?\n4 A. Yes. There's 5.6 million transferred on November 15, 2021\n5 from the Silvergate 7721 to the Silvergate 7713 accounts.\n6 Q. And then looking on right, the incoming transfer to 7713\n7 from 7739?\n8 A. Yes, that's 46.5 million on December 2, 2021.\n9 Q. Let's go to the next slide, please, Ms. Loftus.\n10 Mr. Hinton, this is now again a subset of the broader\n11 G/Club/Crane summary chart we've been looking at. As you can\n12 see, there's a highlight on this G/Club International Limited\n13 account at Mercantile Bank. Do you see that?\n14 A. I do.\n15 Q. And the inflows reflected on this chart into that account,\n16 what is the amount from the G/Club Operations Morgan Stanley\n17 account?\n18 A. 62.7 million.\n19 Q. Let's go to the next slide, please.\n20 What is the title of this slide, Mr. Hinton?\n21 A. G/Club select flows and expenses.\n22 Q. Here looking at the top, are we starting with this summary\n23 flow analysis from the account we just saw on the prior slide\n24 that the 62.7 million came into?\n25 A. We are.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 Q. Focusing on a few of the outflows that are reflected here.\n2 Let's start on the right with the blue.\n3 What is shown with the outflows on the right to Yacht\n4 Zoo, LLC?\n5 A. It shows that between October 26, 2021 and September 1,\n6 2022, $478,000 was transferred.\n7 Q. Then looking to the red, what category of transactions is\n8 reflected in the summary chart here?\n9 A. The red symbols are associated with car-related expenses.\n10 Q. What is the dollar amount for those collective car-related\n11 expenses?\n12 A. 6.4 million.\n13 Q. The prior car-related expenses that we looked at\n14 Mr. Hinton, those were expenses that originated from a\n15 different bank account; is that correct?\n16 A. That's correct.\n17 Q. The Lamp Capital account?\n18 A. That's correct.\n19 Q. And these are expenses from an account held in what\n20 entity's name?\n21 A. G/Club International Limited.\n22 Q. Continuing on there's an entry called Stone Offer Design.\n23 Do you see that?\n24 A. I do.\n25 Q. From what accounts do we see transactions flowing into\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 Stone Offer design?\n2 A. We see payments from both the G/Club International\n3 Mercantile account and from G/Clubs Operations in a separate TD\n4 Bank account.\n5 Q. Looking left, Mr. Hinton, there is a sources of funds\n6 section over on the top left, and that flows into both the\n7 G/Club Operations account and the Himalaya International\n8 Clearing account. Do you see that?\n9 A. I do.\n10 Q. Does the money that's reflected in the sources of funds,\n11 does that include incoming sources of funds that the government\n12 identified for Brattle?\n13 A. Yes, these are sources of funds coming from entities that\n14 we previously described how the government instructed us to\n15 identify.\n16 Q. And based on the information on this slide, does that\n17 include sources of funds for both Himalaya Exchange, which\n18 would be shown in the flow to Himalaya International Clearing\n19 and for G/Clubs which is shown in the flow to G/Club\n20 Operations?\n21 A. It does.\n22 Q. Let's focus on the far left side of this. We have a flow\n23 into G/Club Operations, where then do we see $7 million going\n24 between March 2, 2022 and April 12, 2022?\n25 A. There are aggregate transfers to -- I'm not sure how to\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 pronounce the name of the swiss bank, but it's right there.\n2 Q. I represent to you that it's Kyrgyz swiss bank.\n3 A. Thank you.\n4 Q. Let's look at those transactions from the bank records.\n5 Ms. Loftus if we could go to Government Exhibit TDB-93. We'll\n6 start on the first page, Ms. Loftus.\n7 Mr. Hinton, is this one of the bank records that you\n8 reviewed in connection with your work in this case?\n9 A. It is.\n10 Q. What's the statement period for this record?\n11 A. It's January 14, 2022 through January 31st of the same\n12 year.\n13 Q. And what is the entity name and the address that this\n14 account is held in?\n15 A. It's G/Club Operations, LLC, 162 East 64th Street, New\n16 York, New York.\n17 Q. And the last four of the primary account number on the\n18 right side?\n19 A. 2044.\n20 Q. On the account summary here, what's the beginning balance\n21 in this account on this statement period?\n22 A. It has a zero beginning balance.\n23 Q. Let's go to page eight, please, Ms. Loftus and scroll down.\n24 On the other withdrawals, Mr. Hinton, can you read\n25 that first withdrawal, March 2?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 A. Yes. March 2nd, there's a ware transfer outgoing to Kyrgyz\n2 swiss bank 3 million.\n3 Q. And then let's go to page 12, please, Ms. Loftus. And\n4 scroll down to the other withdrawal section there.\n5 On the first entry for April 12 here, Mr. Hinton, do\n6 you see that?\n7 A. Yeah, this is a similarly titled wire transfer outgoing for\n8 $4 million.\n9 Q. And what bank does that go to?\n10 A. It's going to Kyrgyz swiss bank.\n11 Q. So those two transactions the 3 million and the 4 million,\n12 do those collectively represent the $7 million that we saw in\n13 the flow on the summary chart at Z26 page 25?\n14 A. They do.\n15 Q. Ms. Loftus, let's go back to Z26. Let's go to slide 26. I\n16 want to talk through now at a high level about some of the\n17 Himalaya exchange flows.\n18 Mr. Hinton, starting on the left top here, sources of\n19 funds. Again, do the sources of funds reflected on the\n20 Himalaya Exchange flow summary, are those the same category of\n21 funds that we discussed earlier?\n22 A. Yes.\n23 Q. So the left most line, just taking us straight down the\n24 line, if you could just read the dollar amount and the date\n25 ranges and what accounts that monies flows through?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 A. Yes. 473.8 million is the aggregate amount of transfers\n2 from sources of funds to Himalaya International Clearing FEV\n3 3763 account between June 2, 2021 and June 30, 2022.\n4 Q. And then from that FV Bank international clearing account,\n5 what do we see reflected inflows between March 21st and May\n6 13th of 2022?\n7 A. 80 million in aggregate transfers to a different Himalaya\n8 International Clearing Limited account at the same bank, but\n9 this account ends in 2119.\n10 Q. And then from there what is the next flow reflected here?\n11 A. Yes. Then from March 5, 2022 through May 13, 2022, there's\n12 30 million flowing to a Mercantile account for Himalaya\n13 International Financial Group limited.\n14 Q. And looking kind of in the middle of the slide, Mr. Hinton,\n15 there's another Himalaya International Clearing account. Do\n16 you see that, it's 0133?\n17 A. I do.\n18 Q. At what bank is that held?\n19 A. That's also at Mercantile Bank.\n20 Q. How much money flows into that account as reflected here\n21 from both Clearing at FV Bank 3763 and from sources of fund?\n22 A. There's 220 million in aggregate coming from FV Bank\n23 Himalaya International Clearing Limited and 36.9 coming from\n24 sources of funds, so together that's 256.9 million.\n25 Q. And then there's another inflow reflected here going to the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 clearing account at Mercantile Bank, that's from the right\n2 side, what is that amount, and what account does that come from\n3 or what entity?\n4 A. Yes. That's a $50 million transfer on December 2, 2021\n5 from G/Club International Limited.\n6 Q. So that's $50 million from G/Club International to Himalaya\n7 International Clearing; is that right?\n8 A. That's right.\n9 Q. And then looking at the outflow from the Himalaya\n10 International Clearing at Mercantile to Hamilton Opportunity\n11 Fund, what is the aggregate dollar amount of that outflow?\n12 A. 51 million.\n13 Q. And what is the Hamilton Opportunity Fund bank account that\n14 that money goes to?\n15 A. It's a Silvergate account ending 7739.\n16 Q. Let's go to the next slide, please, Ms. Loftus.\n17 I want to focus on the bottom flow that's reflected\n18 here, Mr. Hinton. From that Himalaya International Financial\n19 Group Mercantile account we discussed, the 0139, what flow did\n20 we see on April 15, 2022?\n21 A. We see a $37 million transfer to Zeisler & Zeisler, PC,\n22 IOLTA account.\n23 Q. Do you know what Zeisler & Zeisler PC is?\n24 A. I understand it's a law firm.\n25 Q. Do you know what role, if any, Zeisler & Zeisler has in the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 government's case?\n2 A. I do not.\n3 Q. Let's go to the next slide. Focusing on just one of the\n4 categories of expenses that we had discussed in connection with\n5 some of the transactions from the various accounts.\n6 On the next slide, Ms. Loftus. Mr. Hinton, what is\n7 the title of this slide?\n8 A. This slide is titled Yacht Zoo, LLC expenses summary.\n9 Q. What is at the top of this slide?\n10 A. It's an oval representing Yacht Zoo, LLC.\n11 Q. Going from left to the right counter clockwise, does this\n12 represent various different inflows to Yacht Zoo, LLC from\n13 different accounts we've been discussing?\n14 A. Yes. They're essentially expenses of those accounts,\n15 monies that are being transferred to Yacht Zoo, LLCs account.\n16 Q. What is the aggregate amount of money just from the bank\n17 transactions reflected on this summary chart that goes to Yacht\n18 Zoo, LLC between May 7, 2020 and October 21, 2022? In the\n19 middle there, Ms. Loftus.\n20 A. Yes, it's 3.9 million.\n21 Q. And so starting on the left with the Lamp Capital Signature\n22 account, what's the date range of that 1.8 million aggregate\n23 flows?\n24 A. 1.8 million.\n25 Q. What's the date range?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 A. It's May 7, 2021 through September 13, 2021.\n2 Q. And the next account, the IDB account held in the name of\n3 Lamp Capital, what's the date range for those Yacht Zoo, LLC\n4 payments?\n5 A. October 25 through December 20, 2021.\n6 Q. And in the middle there, Lamp Capital, LLC, DCB or Dime\n7 Community Bank, what is the dollar amount that goes up to Yacht\n8 Zoo from that account?\n9 A. $990,000.\n10 Q. Continuing right, HCHK Tech, what is the date of the\n11 transfers to Yacht Zoo from that account?\n12 A. October 21, 2022.\n13 Q. By the way, you see money going from G/Club as well to\n14 Yacht Zoo, what is the dollar amount of that collection of\n15 transactions?\n16 A. 478,000.\n17 Q. Let's just take a look at one of those for the HCHK Tech\n18 transfer to Yacht Zoo, LLC. Ms. Loftus, if you could pull up\n19 Government Exhibit MTB-83. Let's focus on the top first.\n20 What is the last four of the account number looking on\n21 the right here?\n22 A. The account number ends in 2176.\n23 Q. And the statement period for this particular bank record?\n24 A. October 1 through October 31, 2022.\n25 Q. What is the name and address for this particular bank\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 account?\n2 A. It's HCHK Technologies, Inc, 750 Lexington Avenue, New\n3 York, New York.\n4 Q. Let's zoom out, Ms. Loftus, and look down the page a bit.\n5 If we could look at the second entry for October 21, 2022.\n6 Do you see that, Mr. Hinton?\n7 A. I do.\n8 Q. What is the description of that transaction as reflected in\n9 this HCHK Tech bank record?\n10 A. It's entry says outgoing chips transfer auto rep Yacht Zoo\n11 Limited G Fashion Hold Co. B Li.\n12 Q. Do you know what G Fashion hold Co. B. Li refers to?\n13 A. I imagine it's a G Fashion entity.\n14 Q. And looking to the right, the second column which shows the\n15 transaction amount, what is that transaction amount here?\n16 A. $123,452.\n17 Q. Let's go back to Z26, slide 30, Ms. Loftus.\n18 Is that then the 123,000 rounded that we see reflected\n19 on this summary chart?\n20 A. It is.\n21 Q. Let's continue, and let's go to the next slide.\n22 Mr. Hinton, is this kind of a high level summary of\n23 the sources of funds for the primary categories that we've been\n24 looking at over the course of your testimony?\n25 A. It is.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 Q. And if you could just take us through left to right -- and\n2 again, just for clarity, the summary charts that we've been\n3 reviewing, Mr. Hinton, is it correct that these reflect only a\n4 portion of the total transactions that were in the records that\n5 Brattle received?\n6 A. That's correct.\n7 Q. And is it also correct that Brattle did not process every\n8 bank record that it received from the government?\n9 A. That's correct, yes.\n10 Q. So sources of funds, what is the approximate aggregate flow\n11 to the GTV/VOG category?\n12 A. Of all the transactions that we processed, of which there\n13 were thousands for this category, the aggregate amount was\n14 $411 million going to GTV and VOG.\n15 Q. And what about for the farms category, what's the aggregate\n16 amount of sources of funds that flowed to the farms category\n17 that the government identified?\n18 A. Of the transactions we processed, there's $110 million\n19 worth of transactions categorized as going from sources of\n20 funds to farms entities.\n21 Q. What about the G/Clubs category?\n22 A. Likewise for the G/Clubs category, we identified and\n23 processed $240 million of individual transactions from sources\n24 of funds accounts.\n25 Q. And finally the Himalaya Exchange category, what is the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 aggregate amount of processed money flowing to that category?\n2 A. 517 million.\n3 Q. Ms. Loftus, can we go to the next slide, please. This sums\n4 it up for us, Mr. Hinton.\n5 Among those four broad categories, what amount do we\n6 see going from sources of funds into those categories?\n7 A. Collectively they make up $1.3 billion.\n8 Q. And let's go to the next slide.\n9 What is reflected here at the bottom of this slide for\n10 outflows from that broad $1.3 billion worth of sources of\n11 funds?\n12 A. Yes. At the bottom of the slide we're indicating that\n13 there were outflows collectively from these four entities,\n14 entities that were classified into these four categories. From\n15 all of the transactions that we processed, we were able to\n16 identify net inflows into these two other groups of accounts.\n17 Q. And so looking first at the left, family offices and family\n18 members, is that a collective category reflective of what we\n19 saw yesterday on Government Exhibit Z27 where the government\n20 identified who qualifies as a family member or what qualifies\n21 as a family office?\n22 A. Right. I think you're referring to that beautifully\n23 multi-colored list of all the different accounts, and we had a\n24 column for family offices and family members. And at the\n25 bottom there was a footnote that descrived what were the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 entities that were classified in that column.\n2 Q. And for purposes of this summary chart, is the\n3 classification the same for family offices and members here as\n4 it was on that other summary chart?\n5 A. Yes, it is.\n6 Q. What are the net inflows we see from the collective 1.3\n7 billion going to either family offices or family members?\n8 A. We compute that the net amount of inflows, that means the\n9 amount coming in less whatever amounts went out is $100\n10 million.\n11 Q. And then looking on the right companies owned by William\n12 Je, are those the companies we discussed yesterday that the\n13 government identified for you, the Hamilton and ACA Capital\n14 entities?\n15 A. That's correct.\n16 Q. And of the aggregate $1.3 billion, what approximate amount\n17 of net inflows do we see going into those companies, the\n18 William Je companies?\n19 A. From these four different entities we see net inflows to\n20 the ACA Capital and Hamilton accounts of 550 million.\n21 Q. Let's go to the next slide, please, Ms. Loftus.\n22 What's the title of this slide, Mr. Hinton?\n23 A. This is titled cumulative sources of funds inflows by\n24 category.\n25 Q. Is this a different visual representation of the $1.3\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Direct\n1 billion sources of funds money that we just looked at on the\n2 prior slides?\n3 A. Yes, it just shows how it built up over time.\n4 Q. Can you explain for the jury what the different colors\n5 represent and how they build over time as we go from 2020 here\n6 to 2023?\n7 A. Yes. Well, because we're building up this number from all\n8 the individual over 200,000 transactions, we have the date of\n9 every single transaction, so it's possible to compute a daily.\n10 In this case we do it monthly, but a cumulative amount of the\n11 inflows into all the accounts that are classified into these\n12 four different categories, each one having a different color.\n13 So underlying each of those bands of color are many, many\n14 individual entities, and for each of those entities many\n15 individual accounts that are receiving money in the form of\n16 sources of funds.\n17 Q. And the amounts that are totaled within each color band,\n18 Mr. Hinton, are those the amounts associated with the\n19 categories indicated on the bottom of this chart?\n20 A. Those are the amounts that you get to by the end of July\n21 2023. You can see that in each case they sort of build up at\n22 different points in time to reach that total.\n23 Q. And then starting at the bottom of this chart working up,\n24 is it correct based on the key at the bottom and the colors\n25 that we start with GTV/VOG, add on the farms, then G/Club and\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 finally starting at some point it looks like in late 2022 the\n2 Himalaya Exchange?\n3 A. Yes, just by stacking them up, you can see what they sum to\n4 altogether.\n5 Q. Mr. Hinton, in this case for purposes of the summary\n6 exhibits that we reviewed with the jury yesterday and today, is\n7 it correct that the government prepared or advised what\n8 information it wanted reflected on those summary charts?\n9 A. It did.\n10 Q. And in the course of either preparing or reviewing those\n11 summary charts, did you and Brattle take instruction from the\n12 government?\n13 A. We did.\n14 MS. MURRAY: May I have a moment, your Honor?\n15 THE COURT: You may.\n16 MS. MURRAY: Thank you, Mr. Hinton. I have nothing\n17 further.\n18 THE COURT: Cross examination.\n19 MR. KAMARAJU: Thank you, your Honor.\n20 CROSS-EXAMINATION\n21 BY MR. KAMARAJU:\n22 Q. Good morning, Mr. Hinton.\n23 A. Good morning.\n24 MR. KAMARAJU: Before we start, just a little bit of\n25 housekeeping, your Honor. At this time I'd like to read a\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 stipulation between the parties.\n2 THE COURT: Go ahead.\n3 MR. KAMARAJU: Could we please pull up Government\n4 Exhibit Stip-14, please, and it's in evidence already so we can\n5 publish it.\n6 \"It is hereby stipulated and agreed by the United\n7 States of America and Miles Guo, the defendant, the below\n8 listed exhibits were lawfully obtained by the government and\n9 are authentic records of the entity listed in column A that\n10 were made at or near the time by or from information\n11 transmitted by a person with knowledge of matters set forth in\n12 the records. Such records were kept in the course of the\n13 regularly conducted activity, and it was a regular practice of\n14 the entity to make the records.\"\n15 And then could we go to page eight of this\n16 stipulation.\n17 \"It is further stipulated and agreed that the defense\n18 exhibits listed in column C may be received as defense exhibits\n19 at trial.\" Then can we go back to the front page, please.\n20 Your Honor, pursuant to this stipulation, I'm going to\n21 offer several exhibits at this time.\n22 THE COURT: All righty.\n23 MS. MURRAY: No objection.\n24 MR. KAMARAJU: So the defense offers DX-11124 through\n25 11129, DX-11255, DX-11432 through 11436, DX-10299 through\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 DX-10301, DX-13005 through DX-10329, DX-10526, DX-10528 through\n2 DX-10530, DX-10551 through DX-10562, DX-10564 through DX-10577,\n3 DX-11299 through DX-11300, DX-11302, DX-11304 and DX-11305,\n4 DX-11485, DX-11486 through, DX-11488, DX-11489, DX-11491\n5 through DX-11492, DX-11548 through DX-11549, DX-11552 through\n6 DX-11553, DX-11562 through DX-11570, DX-10430 through DX-10457,\n7 DX-10960 through DX-10971, DX-11073 through DX-11078, DX-11110\n8 through DX-11121, DX-11493 through DX-11506, DX-10007,\n9 DX-10531, DX-10606 through DX-10626, DX-10008 through DX-10010,\n10 DX-10330 through DX-10356, DX-10578 through DX-10605, DX-11256\n11 through DX-11257, DX-11281, DX-11517 through DX-11526, DX-11572\n12 through DX-11573, DX-11581, DX-11585, DX-10357 through\n13 DX-10359, DX-10627 through DX-10631, DX-10972, DX-10013,\n14 DX-10017 through DX-10028, DX-10360 through DX-10373.\n15 (Counsel conferred)\n16 MR. KAMARAJU: If it will speed it along, your Honor,\n17 I'll offer every exhibit in Column C of the stipulation.\n18 THE COURT: They are admitted.\n19 (Defendant's Exhibits DX-11124 through 11129,\n20 DX-11255, DX-11432 through 11436, DX-10299 through DX-10301,\n21 DX-13005 through DX-10329, DX-10526, DX-10528 through DX-10530,\n22 DX-10551 through DX-10562, DX-10564 through DX-10577, DX-11299\n23 through DX-11300, DX-11302, DX-11304 and DX-11305, DX-11485,\n24 DX-11486 through, DX-11488, DX-11489, DX-11491 through\n25 DX-11492, DX-11548 through DX-11549, DX-11552 through DX-11553,\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 DX-11562 through DX-11570, DX-10430 through DX-10457, DX-10960\n2 through DX-10971, DX-11073 through DX-11078, DX-11110 through\n3 DX-11121, DX-11493 through DX-11506, DX-10007, DX-10531,\n4 DX-10606 through DX-10626, DX-10008 through DX-10010, DX-10330\n5 through DX-10356, DX-10578 through DX-10605, DX-11256 through\n6 DX-11257, DX-11281, DX-11517 through DX-11526, DX-11572 through\n7 DX-11573, DX-11581, DX-11585, DX-10357 through DX-10359,\n8 DX-10627 through DX-10631, DX-10972, DX-10013, DX-10017 through\n9 DX-10028, DX-10360 through DX-10373 received in evidence)\n10 MR. KAMARAJU: Thank you.\n11 BY MR. KAMARAJU:\n12 Q. Just one other housekeeping detail, Mr. Hinton, can you\n13 confirm for the jury, please, sir that you are not in fact a\n14 Chinese spy?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 Q. Thank you. Now, Brattle was first retained by the\n17 government in the summer of 2023, correct?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. And Brattle has a team working on this project, right?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. And you were involved from the start of Brattle's\n22 engagement, correct?\n23 A. Correct.\n24 Q. And over the course of that engagement, Brattle has been\n25 compensated for its work by the government?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. That's correct.\n2 Q. And I believe you testified on direct you receive about $2\n3 million, correct?\n4 A. Well, I think that's an estimate of the amount of fees.\n5 I'm not sure what's being collected.\n6 Q. You're owed $2 million?\n7 A. As I said, I think my -- we've accrued certain amounts of\n8 fees.\n9 Q. That work entailed doing the fund analysis that you\n10 testified about on direct among other things, correct?\n11 A. That's right.\n12 Q. And you only learned about GTV from the prosecutors, right?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. You only learn about the farm loan program from the\n15 prosecutors, correct?\n16 A. Yes.\n17 Q. Same with G/Clubs, right?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. And the same with the Himalaya Exchange, right?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. Now, did you learn about Mr. Guo from the prosecutors?\n22 A. No.\n23 Q. When did you first hear of him?\n24 A. When the government contacted us.\n25 Q. Your testimony today was about summaries you prepared of\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 evidence in this case, right?\n2 A. Yes.\n3 Q. And the prosecutor provided you with the evidence they\n4 wanted you to summarize, right?\n5 A. They provided us with a large number of documents at the\n6 beginning we had to sort of identify, and then they selected\n7 certain of those for us to put onto certain charts.\n8 Q. So it's fair to say they identified the evidence they\n9 wanted summarized?\n10 A. Yes.\n11 Q. As part of that, for example, they gave you companies that\n12 they wanted you to focus on, right?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. Same with the bank accounts, they gave you those too,\n15 right?\n16 A. Yes.\n17 Q. And they told you what kind of charts they wanted, right?\n18 A. That's right.\n19 Q. And they instructed you to make changes to those charts,\n20 right?\n21 A. Yes, additions, yes, adjustments.\n22 Q. Additions, subtractions, modifications, all kinds of\n23 changes, right?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. You also testified that you had been working in earnest on\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 this project I think since the start of the year; is that\n2 right?\n3 A. That was the more intensive period, yes.\n4 Q. So even though Brattle has been retained for more than a\n5 year, it's true that the prosecutors were directing changes to\n6 your chart through last night, correct?\n7 A. Yes.\n8 Q. I want to talk just a little bit about the process.\n9 So you testified I think on direct about the process\n10 that Brattle uses to analyze data, right?\n11 A. A little bit, yes.\n12 Q. Not the entire process, but just a little bit, right?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. And that's, to use a colloquial term, maybe you scrub the\n15 data in different ways?\n16 A. I wouldn't say that.\n17 Q. But part of the process is deciding what's relevant to the\n18 task, right?\n19 A. Well, not for me.\n20 Q. That's going to be my next question. It's the government\n21 deciding what's relevant, right?\n22 A. Yes.\n23 Q. And then they tell you, right?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. And then you go out and find it, right?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. No.\n2 Q. So what do you do after the government tells you what they\n3 think is relevant?\n4 A. I think the sequencing is a little different. They gave us\n5 the records. We told them what's in the record, and then they\n6 told us which of those records they wanted us to process. But\n7 they didn't know what was in the records until we processed\n8 them, so we were then to share the results with the government.\n9 Q. So it's a back and forth; fair to say?\n10 A. Yes.\n11 Q. You told them, this is what's out there. They said, that's\n12 what we care about, right?\n13 A. That's right.\n14 Q. And they never told you that they care about anything that\n15 was helpful to Mr. Guo, right?\n16 A. I have no idea.\n17 Q. Cause that's not part of your retention, right?\n18 A. I'm sorry.\n19 Q. Withdrawn. Now, the prosecutors also reviewed your summary\n20 charts for accuracy, right?\n21 A. I believe so.\n22 Q. Was that part of the changes that they made or proposed\n23 changes for accuracy, sir?\n24 A. Not so much for accuracy, to ensure that all the\n25 transactions that they wanted included were actually included,\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 and not those that should not be included.\n2 Q. Does Brattle do its own independent check for accuracy?\n3 A. Yes.\n4 Q. Can you describe that process to us?\n5 A. Well, there's many different checks. Obviously when the\n6 database and the extraction is happening, individual team\n7 members are checking each others work. But then ultimately\n8 what happens here is after the charts have been produced based\n9 on the transactions that the government wanted to be\n10 represented on the charts, we're able to identify every single\n11 source document associated with those transactions and then\n12 check the amounts against those source documents.\n13 Q. So let's take a look at one of those charts. Could we\n14 please pull up Government Exhibit Z26. Could we go to slide\n15 four, please.\n16 So you testified about this on direct, correct, sir?\n17 A. I did.\n18 Q. First, the sources of funds box, what sources go into that?\n19 A. Well, sources of funds are identified as flows of funds\n20 from individual accounts where those individuals are not\n21 persons who have been identified as persons of interest or\n22 persons who are associated with any of the corporate agreements\n23 that we processed for the entities that are associated with the\n24 categories the government gave us.\n25 There was also in some charts I discussed on direct,\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 you may recall that there were certain amounts that were\n2 flowing into G/Clubs/Crane account that were in round amounts\n3 of 10,000, 20,000, 30,000, 40,000, 50,000 where there wasn't\n4 actually the name of an individual indicated in the bank\n5 records, that information was blank. But in those specific\n6 instances, the government told us to also categorize those an\n7 inflows, as sources of funds.\n8 Q. Got it. So with the exception of that last category that\n9 you talked about, the blind contracts, is it fair to say that\n10 the sources of fund process was a process of elimination?\n11 A. I wouldn't say that.\n12 Q. Well, you eliminated persons of interest, right?\n13 A. No, we started by identifying all the transactions in the\n14 accounts that the government told us to process and identified\n15 all the transactions of inflows from individuals.\n16 Q. And then you categorized those individuals, right?\n17 A. Then we identified which, if any, of those individuals\n18 should not be included and excluded those.\n19 Q. And one of the groups of people who should not be included\n20 were persons of interest, right?\n21 A. Yes.\n22 Q. Who decided what a person of interest was?\n23 A. The government.\n24 Q. Can you give me an example of who some of the people are\n25 who are in the persons of interest category?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. That would be the persons who were showing up in family\n2 members category or the defendant for example.\n3 Q. And were there any other categories of people that you\n4 excluded?\n5 A. Yes. As I said, there were persons who were identified as\n6 signatory or counter-parties in service agreements and other\n7 contracts between the entities that were in the various\n8 categories that were in my summary charts.\n9 Q. And those are service agreements that were identified to\n10 you by the government?\n11 A. Yes. One of the assignments the government gave us,\n12 actually our first assignment was to review various different\n13 types of agreements, including the farm loans that we discussed\n14 on my direct. There was a detail list of those loans. Those\n15 were actually individual loan documents, and those were among\n16 some of the agreements that we processed.\n17 Q. So the farm loan documents that you testified about on\n18 direct, they were signed by the lenders, correct?\n19 A. Yes.\n20 Q. But not the borrowers, right?\n21 A. Yes.\n22 Q. Did you exclude the lenders from the sources of funds?\n23 A. No, just the persons who were associated with the entities\n24 that are in each of these farms, GTV, Himalaya, etc.,\n25 categories.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 Q. So there's further selection within the idea of the\n2 counter-parties on the agreements, right?\n3 A. Yes. So anybody who is a party to an agreement who's\n4 working for one of these entities or signing on behalf of one\n5 of these entities, not a person who is providing sources of\n6 funds.\n7 Q. Did you discuss with the prosecutors why they focused on\n8 these particular sources of funds on slide four?\n9 A. No.\n10 Q. So you have no idea what the import of this slide is in\n11 term -- withdrawn. That's a bad question. I apologize.\n12 Let's just look at the VOG box on the left. You see\n13 that?\n14 A. Yes.\n15 Q. The date range on that is from April 2020 to October 13,\n16 2020, correct?\n17 A. Yes.\n18 Q. Have you ever heard of the GTV private placement?\n19 A. I think I've seen references to a private placement in the\n20 documents.\n21 Q. Could we pull up GXC63-T alongside this exhibit, please.\n22 So on the left is the translation of a June 2020 broadcast.\n23 Could we just blow up or highlight the line that starts, It's\n24 almost in the first bucket there.\n25 Can you just read that, Mr. Hinton?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. It's almost 12 o'clock noon on June 2nd.\n2 Q. Can we go to page seven and highlight the line when you get\n3 there, GTV is now, it's in the fourth box down.\n4 Can you read the part of that sentence that starts,\n5 GTV is?\n6 A. GTV is now starting to be legal.\n7 Q. You would agree with me, sir, that June 2, 2020 is earlier\n8 than October 13, 2020?\n9 A. Yes.\n10 Q. And you would agree with me that if you expand the scope of\n11 the date range that you're looking in that could include more\n12 money flows, correct?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. We can take that down. Can we put up GXZ26 again, same\n15 slide. Let's look in the middle box, the one that says Saraca.\n16 You see that?\n17 A. Yes.\n18 Q. What's the date range for that $286 million?\n19 A. February 22, 2019 through July 3, 2020.\n20 Q. Could we just pull up alongside of GXBK-5, please,\n21 alongside it. Do you see a date on that document on the right?\n22 A. April 20th, 2020.\n23 Q. And you would agree with me, sir, that April 20, 2020 is\n24 more than a year after February 22, 2019?\n25 A. I agree.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 Q. And again if you expand that date range, it would increase\n2 the amount of money coming in, right?\n3 A. Well, just to be clear, this date range represents the date\n4 range of all the transactions that we processed, so those we're\n5 just showing all the transactions that we processed. And, yes,\n6 if there are more transactions from other accounts, we didn't\n7 process, that number could go up.\n8 Q. Sure. And if you expanded the time period, the number\n9 could go up, right?\n10 A. Perhaps. I don't know. I haven't processed those\n11 transactions.\n12 Q. So let's go to slide five. Actually, let's go to slide\n13 six. This is the VOG flow of funds, right?\n14 A. Yes.\n15 Q. And you see the middle arrow there?\n16 A. I do.\n17 Q. That's $17.3 million, right?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. And the date range there is March 12, 2018 through May 12,\n20 2020, right?\n21 A. Yes.\n22 Q. Again, that's more than two years from the private\n23 placement start date, correct?\n24 A. Based on your representation of when that date was, yes.\n25 Q. Based on the document that I had you read the April 20th\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 date, right?\n2 A. Yes.\n3 Q. And then if we look to the box to the right of that, that\n4 goes to Voice of Guo Media, right. Do you see that?\n5 A. Yes.\n6 Q. And that's $2 million?\n7 A. I'm a little confused as to which arrow you're referring\n8 to.\n9 Q. So maybe can you help me out. The middle box there, the\n10 one for Lafrenz that has WFB 1005. You see that?\n11 A. Yes.\n12 Q. Correct me if I'm wrong, it looks like there's an arrow\n13 going from that box to Voice of Guo Media with WFB 5536, right?\n14 A. Yes.\n15 Q. And that arrow reflects a fund flow of $2 million over the\n16 period of time between July 11, 2019 and May 5, 2020, correct?\n17 A. Yes.\n18 Q. And July 11th, 2019 is several months before April 20,\n19 2020, correct?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. Let's look at slide 15. Let's just start at the top left\n22 there. So you see all those I think you call them dark blue\n23 boxes?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. Those are associated with G/Clubs -- withdrawn.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 Those reflect bank accounts associated with G/Clubs\n2 Operations, LLC, correct?\n3 A. There's also another blue box for a different G/Club\n4 entity.\n5 Q. So let's start with the ones at the top, the four at the\n6 top. Those are all G/Clubs Operations, right?\n7 A. Yes.\n8 Q. And the way that you're able to associate them with G/Clubs\n9 Operations is because all of those accounts are in the name of\n10 G/Clubs Operations, right?\n11 A. Yes.\n12 Q. And so the same is true with the other dark blue box that\n13 is in the name of G/Club International Limited, correct?\n14 A. Yes, the one, the Mercantile 0103 account is G/Club\n15 International Limited.\n16 Q. Another way to represent what's going on at the top,\n17 instead of having four boxes, you could just have one\n18 representing G/Club operations, correct?\n19 A. Yes.\n20 Q. But the prosecutors asked you to have four, right?\n21 A. Yes.\n22 Q. Now, the same is true if we go over to the light blue boxes\n23 on right. Do you see those?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. Those are all for Crane Advisory, right?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. That's correct.\n2 Q. And again you were able to associate those with Crane\n3 Advisory because all of those accounts are in the name of Crane\n4 Advisory, right?\n5 A. That's right.\n6 Q. So you could have collapse those six boxes into one, right?\n7 A. In theory, yes.\n8 Q. But they didn't want you to do that, right?\n9 A. They instructed us on the format of the chart.\n10 Q. So now let's look at the yellow boxes down at the bottom.\n11 Do you see those?\n12 A. Yes.\n13 Q. Now, the yellow boxes down at the bottom, almost all of\n14 them are associated with something called Hamilton, right?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 Q. There's one that's not that doesn't have the word\n17 \"Hamilton\" in the box, right?\n18 A. Yes, there's a Himalaya International Clearing account.\n19 Q. Who told you to put that box in yellow?\n20 A. The government.\n21 Q. So again, all of the Hamilton accounts, the ones that are\n22 actually labeled with Hamilton, you are able to associate those\n23 with Hamilton because they're all in Hamilton's name, right?\n24 A. Yes, there's five Hamilton Opportunity Fund and one\n25 Hamilton Digital Assets.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 Q. Now I'm just going to pick one at random.\n2 The Crane Advisory account that receives $59.5 million\n3 between 11-23-2020 and April 1, 2021, you see that at the top?\n4 A. Yes.\n5 Q. CIT is Citibank, right?\n6 A. Yes.\n7 Q. Citibank is a U.S. bank, right?\n8 A. Yes.\n9 Q. Almost all the banks represented on this slide are U.S.\n10 banks, right?\n11 A. Most of them, that's right.\n12 Q. In fact, of the, I don't remember, the 600 bank accounts\n13 that you analyzed roughly, the hundreds of bank accounts that\n14 you analyzed roughly, almost all of them were U.S. bank\n15 accounts, right?\n16 A. Well, there's swiss accounts.\n17 Q. That wasn't my question. I asked you almost all of them?\n18 A. The majority were U.S. bank accounts.\n19 Q. Just staying on this for a second, let's look at the top\n20 left, and I'd like to just circle the 52.2 million from G/Club\n21 Operations to G/Club Operations, that's at the top left box.\n22 Can we circle that 52.2, please.\n23 That's a transfer of $52.2 million on December 17,\n24 2020 between two G/Clubs bank accounts, correct?\n25 A. Yes.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 Q. And then let's circle the 14.5 below that. That reflects a\n2 $14.5 million transfer on January 11, 2021, between G/Clubs\n3 bank accounts, correct?\n4 A. Yes.\n5 Q. Now let's circle the $10 million one below that to Fiesta,\n6 and that represents a $10 million payment -- withdrawn. A $10\n7 million transfer from G/Clubs Operations account to Fiesta\n8 Property Developments, correct?\n9 A. It's the aggregate amount of transfers between those\n10 periods from those accounts.\n11 Q. So those transfers started on January 21, 2021, right?\n12 A. Yes.\n13 Q. And so those transfers started after the $52 million\n14 transfer and the $14.5 million transfer, right?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 Q. So from this chart, how much of the 52.2 million and 14.5\n17 million make up that $10 million?\n18 A. I don't know.\n19 Q. You can't know, right?\n20 A. Well, you could do some tracing analysis and come up with\n21 an estimate.\n22 Q. Right, but you testified on direct that you didn't do that,\n23 right?\n24 A. That's correct.\n25 Q. So there's no way based on this chart to link those amounts\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 to that $10 million, right?\n2 A. They are linked to it on this chart.\n3 Q. Well, I understand that you put arrows there, but there's\n4 no way to say that this dollar is this dollar, right?\n5 A. Well, I disagree. The funds come in at an earlier point in\n6 time, and then funds leave at a later point in time, so that is\n7 a connection.\n8 Q. That is a connection between two dates, right?\n9 A. Between flows of funds.\n10 Q. It's a chronology?\n11 A. Yes.\n12 Q. We'll come back to that. Let's go to the Crane Advisory,\n13 the center bucket there. You see those? Let's start with the\n14 $58.2 million that goes from Citibank account 5278 down to that\n15 light blue box below it, the other Crane Advisory account. You\n16 see that one?\n17 A. Yes.\n18 Q. Then there's an arrow going $6.8 million from that account\n19 to the Lawall Mitchell account. You see that?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. The date range of the $58 million transfer is January 22,\n22 2021 through March 30, 2021, correct?\n23 A. Yes.\n24 Q. And the transfer of the $6.8 million is October 19, 2021,\n25 right?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. Yes.\n2 Q. So that's almost seven months after the last transfer of\n3 the $58.2 million, correct?\n4 A. Yes.\n5 Q. And I believe you testified on direct that this is select\n6 flows, so it doesn't represent all of the transactions,\n7 correct?\n8 A. That's true.\n9 Q. It doesn't reflect any other money that went into that\n10 Crane Advisory group box that received the $58.2 million,\n11 right?\n12 A. No.\n13 Q. Let's stay with this blown up for a second.\n14 A. I disagree. I said no.\n15 Q. You said no to what? I'm sorry. What is it that you're\n16 disagreeing with?\n17 A. With your prior question. I didn't affirm your question.\n18 I disagreed with it.\n19 Q. Okay. Tell me what you're disagreeing with?\n20 A. You said there weren't any other flows coming into that\n21 account. There's another arrow coming into that account. I\n22 just want to be clear.\n23 Q. Understand. That's a fair point. All the potential other\n24 flows that are coming into that account, right?\n25 A. Correct.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 Q. Thank you for that. Let's look then at there is an arrow,\n2 the $58 million. The account that sends $58 million to the\n3 Crane Advisory account also sends $10.7 million to this Crane\n4 Advisory set of IDB bank accounts, correct?\n5 A. Correct.\n6 Q. And that is the last date of those transfers were May 28,\n7 2021, right?\n8 A. Yes.\n9 Q. And then there's another transfer to -- from the IDB Crane\n10 accounts to Lawall Mitchell of $1.6 million, correct?\n11 A. Yes.\n12 Q. And that occurs on September 27, 2021, right?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. So that's almost four months after the last of those $10.7\n15 million transfers, right?\n16 A. Correct.\n17 Q. Let's now go to slide 27, please.\n18 Now this shows various flows of funds related to the\n19 Himalaya Exchange, right?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. So the first box sources of funds that represents the same\n22 sources of funds we were talking about before, right?\n23 A. Correct.\n24 Q. And then it shows about $470 million going from that gray\n25 box to a Himalaya International Clearing bank account, right?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. Yes.\n2 Q. And that's an account for the Himalaya Exchange you\n3 understand?\n4 A. I have no independent understanding of what it's for.\n5 Q. So you don't know what company that's associated with?\n6 A. Well, the chart says Himalaya Exchange, and these are the\n7 accounts that are designated, but the title of the account is\n8 Himalaya International Clearing, so I don't know what the role\n9 of that account is.\n10 Q. But the government told you that this was a Himalaya\n11 Exchange bank account?\n12 A. To color it yellow so it's in that category. To say it's a\n13 Himalaya Exchange account is -- that's just a classification\n14 for the purposes of these charts.\n15 Q. Fair enough. They gave you the paint by numbers, right?\n16 A. Yes.\n17 Q. Now, the date range for that is June 2, 2021 through June\n18 30, 2022, right?\n19 A. Yes.\n20 Q. Would you agree with me, sir, that November 2021 comes\n21 after June 2, 2021?\n22 A. Yes.\n23 Q. Are you're aware that the Himalaya Exchange first launched\n24 trading on November 20, 2021?\n25 A. No.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 Q. So let's go to slide 30, please. This is titled Yacht Zoo\n2 expenses, right?\n3 A. Yes.\n4 Q. Now, there's a $3.9 million sum of all the inflows in the\n5 middle there, right?\n6 A. Yes.\n7 Q. And that's suppose to represent all the money coming in\n8 from these other entities, right?\n9 A. Yes.\n10 Q. So bank accounts, right?\n11 A. Yes.\n12 Q. So you got the G/Club International with 478,000 right; you\n13 got the HCHK, and then the three Lamp bank accounts, right?\n14 A. Yes.\n15 Q. Now, the 478 from G/Clubs that counts in the 3.9 million,\n16 you ever heard of a yacht called the Liberty before?\n17 A. No.\n18 Q. And the date range listed under the 3.9 million, that's May\n19 7, 2020 through October 21, 2022, right?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. Can you find for me on this chart a transfer that began on\n22 May 7, 2020?\n23 A. I think it's a typo. It looks like it starts on May 7,\n24 2021 if you look at the transfer on the left.\n25 Q. That's the Lamp Capital one, right?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. Correct.\n2 Q. The prosecutors didn't ask you to include any transfers to\n3 Yacht Zoo from 2020, right?\n4 A. These are the flows they selected to present on the chart.\n5 Q. And they're all suppose to be from 2021, right?\n6 A. I don't know what the criteria they used to select them.\n7 Q. I'm meant ignoring the typo they're all suppose to be from\n8 2021, right?\n9 A. These all are between 2021 and October 2022.\n10 Q. And that's the date range that they gave you, right?\n11 A. Well, they identified the transactions, and these are the\n12 dates of the transactions.\n13 Q. Now, let's look at slide eight I believe it is. This is\n14 the farm select flows, right?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 Q. Now, you have no idea what farms means in the context of\n17 this case, right?\n18 A. That's correct.\n19 Q. And there's $77 million that are reflected on this chart\n20 going to a company called ACA Capital, right?\n21 A. Yes.\n22 Q. So first let's take a look at -- there's a transfer from\n23 ACA Capital that goes to Savio Law for $32 million, correct?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. That occurs between of a period of November 12 and November\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 16, 2020, correct?\n2 A. Yes, correct.\n3 Q. And then your chart reflects an arrow going from Savio Law\n4 to Leading Shine of $3 million on August 20, 2020, correct?\n5 A. Correct.\n6 Q. So August 20, 2020 is before November 12, 2020, correct?\n7 A. Yes.\n8 Q. So as a logical matter, the 3 million that went from Savio\n9 Law to Leading Shine could not have been part of the 32 million\n10 that went from ACA Capital, correct?\n11 A. I would agree.\n12 Q. So then let's look down to Lamp Capital the one below it.\n13 Now that's a $5 million transfer from Savio Law to\n14 Lamp Capital, correct?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 Q. And what's the date of that transfer?\n17 A. That is October 15, 2020.\n18 Q. You would similarly agree with me that October 15, 2020 is\n19 before November 12, 2020, correct?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. As a logical matter, that $5 million couldn't have come\n22 from that $32 million, correct?\n23 A. That's correct.\n24 Q. And then there's also a $5 million transfer from Savio Law\n25 to Greenwich Land, correct?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. Yes.\n2 Q. And what's the date of that?\n3 A. October 15, 2020.\n4 Q. Same thing, right, October 15th is before November 12,\n5 2020?\n6 A. Correct.\n7 Q. So that money couldn't have come from the $32 million,\n8 correct?\n9 A. That's correct.\n10 Q. But the prosecutor asked you to put these arrows this way\n11 anyway, right?\n12 A. I don't know what you mean by anyway. These arrows reflect\n13 transactions that are represented accurately on the chart.\n14 Q. They represent transactions that happened, right?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 Q. Now, there's another box all the way up in the top left.\n17 Do you see that?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. It says other inflows. You see that?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. What are other inflows?\n22 A. Well, it's other sources of funds -- well, sorry. Other\n23 transfers into the ACA Capital account that aren't otherwise\n24 represented on this chart, so from sources other than farms.\n25 Q. You met with the prosecutors this past Saturday, correct?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. Yes.\n2 Q. June 20th, right?\n3 A. I believe that was the date.\n4 Q. And during that meeting you discussed this slide?\n5 A. I don't remember which of the slides we discussed on\n6 Saturday versus Sunday versus Monday.\n7 Q. Now, prior to that meeting, there was a version of this\n8 slide that didn't have the other inflows on it, correct?\n9 A. Probably, yes.\n10 Q. And after your meeting -- and you told the prosecutors that\n11 there were these other inflows, right?\n12 A. I don't remember whether that was something I said.\n13 Q. So can you tell me the process by which the other inflows\n14 box got added to this slide?\n15 A. Well, the prosecutors asked that we add it to the slide.\n16 Q. When did that happen?\n17 A. I don't recall.\n18 Q. Now, do you remember or recall in reference of this issue\n19 Brattle using the phrase inflow/outflow violation?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. What's that mean?\n22 A. It's just a balancing check that was conducted for certain\n23 of the needs on the chart.\n24 Q. Can you break that down for the jury a little bit?\n25 A. Sure. Just that because these charts don't show all of the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 transactions, they're only showing the transactions that we\n2 processed and the transactions between the entities that were\n3 selected on the charts, it's possible that the amounts that are\n4 shown on the arrows, if you sum up all the arrows going into\n5 the account and going out, that the amount going out might be\n6 larger than the amount coming in; so that's just the balancing\n7 question or check that we were asked to sometime perform for\n8 some of these nodes.\n9 Q. So if the outflows exceed the inflows from a particular\n10 source, that means that there was money in the account outside\n11 of the specific source that you were looking at, correct?\n12 A. Right. That either means that there was a preexisting\n13 balance in the account before the time period where we had\n14 data, or there were other entities that had transferred money\n15 into the account that weren't being shown on the chart.\n16 Q. So one of the ways that the prosecutors try to address this\n17 violation was by sending you more entities that they could\n18 classify as farms, right?\n19 A. If you want to try to explain more of the inflows, you've\n20 got to identify what are those transactions and who are they\n21 with. So there were a couple of examples where there were\n22 changes made to the chart to give us more financial records so\n23 we could add those financial records to the chart.\n24 Q. Right. And the goal of that was to increase the inflows\n25 from the so-called farms, right?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. In that particular case, yes. There were additional\n2 entities identified as farms while we were preparing the\n3 summary charts and looking at different iterations of those,\n4 the government decided to add additional entities to the farms\n5 classification.\n6 Q. And Brattle didn't do any kind of independent check to\n7 figure out if those were actually farms, right?\n8 A. That's correct.\n9 Q. That all came from the government, right?\n10 A. That's correct.\n11 Q. Even after that were you able to solve the so-called\n12 violation?\n13 A. It's nothing really to solve. It's just a balancing test\n14 to see whether or not the number of inflows, the amounts are\n15 greater than -- inflows are greater or less than the amounts\n16 that you're showing going out. That's all it is.\n17 Q. And is it fair to say that the fact that there's this other\n18 inflows box means that the farm inflows did not account for all\n19 of the money that came out of the ACA Capital account?\n20 A. That's right.\n21 Q. Now, there's no amount of money on this chart associated\n22 with those other inflows, right?\n23 A. That's right.\n24 Q. So the chart doesn't tell the jury how large those inflows\n25 are, right?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. That's right.\n2 Q. There's no dates associated with it, right?\n3 A. That's right.\n4 Q. There's no date range, right?\n5 A. That's right.\n6 MS. MURRAY: Asked and answered.\n7 THE COURT: Sustained.\n8 Q. So if you take that $19 million that goes from ACA Capital\n9 to Lexington Property, you see that?\n10 A. Yes.\n11 Q. How much of that money comes from the other inflows versus\n12 the 77 million from the farms?\n13 A. I haven't been asked to do that calculation.\n14 Q. So you don't know?\n15 A. I don't know.\n16 Q. Same question with the 11.2 million that goes to William Je\n17 and Sing Ting Wang?\n18 A. I don't know. I haven't been asked to do that calculation.\n19 Q. Let's go to Hudson Diamond, the 18 million that Ms. Murray\n20 asked you about, how about that one. How much of the 18\n21 million comes from the 77 million?\n22 A. I don't know.\n23 Q. Were you asked to look?\n24 A. No.\n25 Q. All right. How about the 13 million that goes to Lamp\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 Capital right next to it, how about that?\n2 A. I don't know.\n3 Q. Were you asked to look?\n4 A. I wasn't instructed to perform a tracing analysis.\n5 Q. So the five million that goes to Greenwich Land, same\n6 answer?\n7 A. Same answer.\n8 Q. So even though there are arrows connecting the ACA Capital\n9 box and those entities we just talked about and arrows\n10 connecting the farms and ACA Capital, you don't actually know\n11 if any of that $77 million accounts for these transfers, right?\n12 A. I haven't traced the funds through to their ultimate uses,\n13 that's correct.\n14 Q. In fact, I believe you testified on direct that there are\n15 bank accounts that Brattle hasn't even looked at, right?\n16 A. That's correct.\n17 THE COURT: It's time for our 11:30 break. Members of\n18 the jury, we will come back in a half an hour. Remember that\n19 you're not allowed to discuss the case amongst yourselves.\n20 Don't permit anyone to discuss the case in your presence.\n21 Don't read, watch or listen to anything that has to do with\n22 this case.\n23 THE LAW CLERK: Jury exiting.\n24 (Jury not present)\n25 THE COURT: Sir, you may step out of the courtroom.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 Don't discuss your testimony.\n2 THE WITNESS: I will not.\n3 (Witness exited the courtroom)\n4 THE COURT: You may be seated. Is there anything\n5 before we return at noon?\n6 MS. MURRAY: One brief matter to raise, your Honor.\n7 With respect to certain of Mr. Kamaraju's questioning, in\n8 particular relating to the ACA Capital account at First Abu\n9 Dhabi Bank, this is on slide eight of the exhibit we were just\n10 looking at. Mr. Kamaraju pursued a line of questioning about\n11 this category reflected on the summary chart that is listed as\n12 other inflows where there's no date range or dollar amount\n13 associated with that. As the Court and Mr. Kamaraju are both\n14 aware, the First Abu Dhabi bank account records were apart of\n15 the government's collected evidence in this case. They were\n16 used in the course of the government's financial analysis over\n17 the period of several years. Ultimately, the Court excluded\n18 those from being admitted because of the issues we had with the\n19 Arab Emirates not giving us the certification that we could use\n20 to introduce those into evidence. But they are very\n21 corroborative of the flows that are on this chart.\n22 The government consistent with the Court's order\n23 stripped out any sourcing from any of those records. So we\n24 redid all of the financial analysis not tied to those records,\n25 but instead tied to counter-parties records. As a result, the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 numbers went down on the summary charts, and that's fine.\n2 That's been covered with Mr. Hinton on his direct. But this is\n3 not -- this is not fully inclusive of all of the flow of funds\n4 we see. And again, that's because the government consistent\n5 with the Court's order did not rely on those records. But for\n6 Mr. Kamaraju to imply very strongly with the witness here that\n7 this other inflows category was suggested by the government in\n8 what he appears to be suggesting an apparent effort to\n9 manipulate the summary of the financial flows, your Honor, we\n10 would submit that opens the door and we can question Mr. Hinton\n11 on redirect whether he did receive First Abu Dhabi bank account\n12 records from the government, and whether the transactions\n13 reflected therein are consistent with the information on these\n14 summary charts. And we can establish that he did not rely on\n15 those for purposes of the total amounts reflected on the\n16 charts, but we would like to acknowledge their existence as a\n17 way of explaining the purpose of this other inflows category\n18 now that the door has been open by Mr. Kamaraju.\n19 THE COURT: Well, how do you explain the absence?\n20 MS. MURRAY: The absence of what, your Honor?\n21 THE COURT: References to that bank?\n22 MS. MURRAY: Well, there are references to the bank\n23 because we have represented the transactions as they were\n24 established and sourced through the counter-parties, so we have\n25 up slide eight of Government Exhibit Z26. You can see the ACA\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 Capital FAB account. That's the first Abu Dhabi bank account,\n2 and I think Ms. Loftus is pulling that up. To the extent that\n3 there are transfers that are indicated here, we show -- if we\n4 could zoom out, Ms. Loftus, and show more of the context there.\n5 To the extent there are transfers that are shown flowing out\n6 from that account, that's from the accounts that are referenced\n7 here, the government exhibit cited in the appendix to this\n8 chart. I think with respect to the absence, it could just be a\n9 question to Mr. Hinton, Did you review records from that\n10 account? Are they consistent with the information on this\n11 summary chart? Did you rely on those records in sourcing the\n12 information on this chart? Why not? Is it because the\n13 government asked you not to rely on these as source records?\n14 And we could leave it at that.\n15 THE COURT: Mr. Kamaraju.\n16 MR. KAMARAJU: A couple of points, your Honor. Number\n17 one, Mr. Hinton is a summary witness. He can only summarize or\n18 speak to evidence that's admissible and admitted in the record.\n19 Your Honor has already decided that the First Abu Dhabi bank\n20 account is not admissible. They chose to present a chart that\n21 tried to link those funds to these transfers without the\n22 necessary evidentiary link. I was entitled to point that out.\n23 They've been on notice of this issue since your Honor decided.\n24 These charts all come after that.\n25 On top of that, your Honor, the concept that they\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 would say, well, you had these records. You reviewed them.\n2 They corroborate it, would necessarily open the door to us\n3 being able to say, in fact, the Court found that those records\n4 were not reliable enough to be entered into evidence in this\n5 case, and those records were hearsay, and that the government\n6 had failed to authenticate them. So I don't understand how the\n7 government can refer to evidence that's not been admitted at\n8 trial simply because I attack their summary chart and the\n9 material that they had. He still -- and I circle back to my\n10 original point -- a summary witness by rule has to testify to\n11 evidence that is in, that has been admitted. And your Honor's\n12 already ruled on this issue. They didn't have to present this\n13 chart this way. That was their choice.\n14 THE COURT: Ms. Murray.\n15 MS. MURRAY: Your Honor, I think at this point what\n16 we're facing is Mr. Kamaraju has created a Rule 403 problem.\n17 To the extent that the Court doesn't want the government to\n18 explore this line of questioning with Mr. Hinton, I guess we\n19 understand that. It does seem like a strategy in play by the\n20 defense to exploit the Court's ruling with respect to the ACA\n21 Capital records in particular, which as we indicated in the\n22 briefing leading up to trial are extremely important records\n23 for the purposes of the flow of funds. We did summarize the\n24 flow of funds using other admissible exhibits from other\n25 accounts that we collected, but that's accurately reflected on\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 these charts.\n2 However, to continue going down this line of\n3 questioning knowing what the parties know and the Court knows\n4 about those records and the status of those records risk\n5 prejudicing the jury and confusing the issues. At kind of the\n6 bottom, the government would ask that the Court request that\n7 Mr. Kamaraju move on from this line of questioning.\n8 MR. KAMARAJU: I'll just say this, your Honor. It is\n9 very emphatically the defense's strategy to point out the lack\n10 of evidence in the government's case. To the extent they are\n11 concerned about that, that is our strategy. Here, we are\n12 pointing out the fact that they do not have admissible evidence\n13 to link these bank flows, which is directly responsive to their\n14 attempt to say that this money was misused on Mr. Guo's family.\n15 The fact that they were not able to authenticate that record\n16 does not create a 403 problem. And my ability to attack that\n17 is fundamental to presenting a defense. I've never heard of a\n18 case where undermining the government's evidence creates a 403\n19 issue. And there's no prejudice to the jury, as Ms. Murray\n20 said. The jury can understand what's going on. They can make\n21 arguments about the tracing if they want. But the jury is the\n22 one who gets to decide that.\n23 They don't get to say, well, Mr. Kamaraju shouldn't\n24 pursue questions that show a weakness in our case because we\n25 know about inadmissible records. I know about inadmissible\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - Cross\n1 information also that I would love to refer to in Mr. Guo's\n2 defense, but I can't do it because it's not admitted into\n3 evidence.\n4 THE COURT: So I am not going to permit the government\n5 to go into these Abu Dhabi records.\n6 MR. KAMARAJU: Thank you, your Honor.\n7 THE COURT: That's it.\n8 (Recess)\n9\n10\n11\n12\n13\n14\n15\n16\n17\n18\n19\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Cross\n1 AFTERNOON SESSION\n2 12:00 p.m.\n3 THE COURT: Please have the jurors brought in.\n4 (Jury present)\n5 THE COURT: Please be seated.\n6 Sir, remember that you're still under oath.\n7 THE WITNESS: Yes.\n8 THE COURT: You may continue the inquiry.\n9 MR. KAMARAJU: All right. Could we have those two\n10 exhibits back up, or I think we were looking at GX Z26 when we\n11 broke, please. Slide 8.\n12 BY MR. KAMARAJU:\n13 Q. Okay. Now just go through this slide quickly. The Savio\n14 Law account you looked at before with Ms. Murray, you remember\n15 that?\n16 A. Yes.\n17 Q. Okay. That was a U.S. bank account, correct?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. Okay. The IDB account for HCHK Technologies, U.S. bank\n20 account, correct?\n21 A. Yes.\n22 Q. The IVB account for Leading Shine, U.S. bank account,\n23 right?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. All the Lamp Capital bank accounts, U.S. bank accounts,\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Cross\n1 right?\n2 A. Yes.\n3 Q. Same with the Greenwich Land account, right?\n4 A. Yes.\n5 Q. Same for the Signature accounts reflected for Lamp Capital?\n6 A. Yes.\n7 Q. Same for the IDB accounts, correct?\n8 A. Yes.\n9 Q. And the same for the DCB account, correct?\n10 A. Yes.\n11 Q. For Lexington Property?\n12 A. Yes, I believe so.\n13 MR. KAMARAJU: Now could we pull up alongside this\n14 Exhibit GX Z27, please.\n15 Q. All right. So Ms. Murray took you through this. Do you\n16 remember that?\n17 A. I do.\n18 Q. Okay. So on GX Z27, which is on the right side, the total\n19 number of accounts that Brattle identified was 681 accounts,\n20 correct?\n21 A. Yes.\n22 Q. Processed accounts, 450, right?\n23 A. Yes.\n24 Q. Okay. So that means that——is processed and analyzed the\n25 same subset?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. Well, it depends on what you mean by processed and\n2 analyzed. Analyzed sometimes we think of as including the\n3 processing, right? That's part of the analysis in a broad\n4 sense.\n5 Q. Okay. I guess what I'm trying to ask, sir——and maybe doing\n6 it inartfully——is: The 450 accounts that are reflected there,\n7 those are ones that Brattle actually looked at and reviewed and\n8 attempted to provide evidence on? Sorry. Withdrawn.\n9 Those are accounts that Brattle actually reviewed and\n10 kind of dove into, the 450?\n11 A. Right. Those are the ones that we extracted the\n12 transaction data from, put them in the database, and that was\n13 the starting point for various exhibits that were developed for\n14 testimony, but——but not all of the transactions and accounts\n15 that are in the database end up in the exhibits.\n16 Q. Got it. Understood. Thank you, sir. That's helpful.\n17 So then the 231 that's reflected there, those accounts\n18 never made it to the database, right?\n19 A. We did not process those; that's correct.\n20 Q. Okay. So no data from those 231 bank accounts is reflected\n21 in the summary chart anywhere, right?\n22 A. That's correct.\n23 Q. And it's not reflected in any of the summary charts that\n24 you've testified about today other than this little entry that\n25 we're looking at, right?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Cross\n1 A. Correct.\n2 Q. So the chart reflects——withdrawn.\n3 MR. KAMARAJU: We can take GX Z27 down. And I'd like\n4 to put up DX 10339 alongside, which is in evidence, so we can\n5 publish it, please.\n6 Okay. Can we go to page 3, please.\n7 Q. Okay. Do you see at the bottom there, three transfers,\n8 May 2nd?\n9 A. Yes.\n10 MR. KAMARAJU: Okay. Actually, I'm sorry. Can we\n11 zoom out real quick.\n12 Q. I think it would be helpful to establish the date. Do you\n13 see the Line Service Charge Summary? Can you read that,\n14 please.\n15 MR. KAMARAJU: Maybe we can highlight it.\n16 A. Yes. \"Service Charge Summary from April 1, 2018 thru\n17 April 30, 2018.\"\n18 Q. So that's the period of this bank statement, correct?\n19 A. Yes.\n20 Q. Okay. And now let's look down at those transfers. You see\n21 the ones from May 2nd?\n22 A. Yes.\n23 Q. Okay. So that's $300,000 over the course of those three\n24 transfers, correct?\n25 A. Yes.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Cross\n1 Q. And who were those transfers from?\n2 A. They're from ACA Capital.\n3 MR. KAMARAJU: Okay. And let's zoom back out.\n4 And let's go to the top. And let's see whose bank\n5 account this is, please.\n6 Q. Do you see Golden Spring (New York) there?\n7 A. Yes.\n8 Q. Okay. That's the bank account holder, correct?\n9 A. I believe so.\n10 Q. All right. Now these three transfers of $300,000 are not\n11 reflected in your summary chart, correct?\n12 A. That's correct.\n13 MR. KAMARAJU: Let's go to page 13, please.\n14 Q. All right. And do you see a transaction on July 19th, for\n15 $2 million?\n16 MR. KAMARAJU: Maybe we can blow that up.\n17 A. I do.\n18 Q. Who is that from?\n19 A. That is from ACA Capital also.\n20 Q. That's not reflected on your summary chart, right?\n21 A. That's correct.\n22 MR. KAMARAJU: Okay. Let's go to page 18, please.\n23 Q. All right. And do you see the transfer on August 20, 2018,\n24 for $500,000?\n25 A. I do.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Cross\n1 Q. Who is that from?\n2 A. ACA Capital.\n3 Q. That's not reflected on your chart, right?\n4 A. That's correct.\n5 MR. KAMARAJU: So let's go to page 45, please.\n6 Q. All right. And do you see a transfer on January 14, 2019,\n7 for approximately $4,499,000?\n8 A. I do.\n9 Q. Okay. Who is that from?\n10 A. ACA Capital.\n11 Q. That's not reflected on your chart, right?\n12 A. That's correct.\n13 MR. KAMARAJU: Let's go to page 89.\n14 Q. All right. And do you see a transfer of $3 million on\n15 August 8, 2019?\n16 A. I do.\n17 Q. Who is that from?\n18 A. This one's from ACA Capital.\n19 Q. Okay. That's not reflected on your chart either, right?\n20 A. That's correct.\n21 MR. KAMARAJU: Okay. Let's take down 10339 and put up\n22 10381. Alongside, please.\n23 Okay. And let's flip to the next page, please. Keep\n24 going.\n25 All right. Actually, let's go to page 23.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Cross\n1 Q. All right. Let's start at the top. Can you tell us who\n2 the account holder is.\n3 A. Leading Shine NY Ltd.\n4 MR. KAMARAJU: All right. And let's scroll back down.\n5 Q. And do you see a transfer on January 22, 2019, for almost\n6 $3 million?\n7 A. I do.\n8 Q. Okay. Who is that from?\n9 A. Well, it's from a——it's from ACA Capital.\n10 Q. Okay. And what bank?\n11 A. First Abu Dhabi Bank.\n12 Q. All right. That's not reflected on your chart, right?\n13 A. That's——that's correct.\n14 MR. KAMARAJU: All right. Can we go to page 41,\n15 please.\n16 Q. And do you see a transfer on August 8, 2019, for\n17 $3 million? Do you see that?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. Who is that from?\n20 A. It's from ACA Capital also.\n21 Q. What bank account?\n22 A. From the First Abu Dhabi Bank account.\n23 Q. That's not reflected on your chart either, is it,\n24 Mr. Hinton?\n25 A. That's correct.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 MR. KAMARAJU: No further questions at this time, your\n2 Honor.\n3 THE COURT: Redirect.\n4 MS. MURRAY: Thank you, your Honor.\n5 REDIRECT EXAMINATION\n6 BY MS. MURRAY:\n7 Q. Mr. Hinton, you were asked some questions on\n8 cross-examination about some of the transactions reflected on\n9 slide 8 of Z26.\n10 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, if we could please pull that\n11 up.\n12 Q. In particular, you were asked about certain of the\n13 transactions reflected going into and out of the ACA Capital\n14 account depicted here. Do you recall those questions?\n15 A. I do.\n16 Q. And Mr. Hinton, the government asked you to conduct a check\n17 of summary charts that it directed; is that correct?\n18 A. That's correct.\n19 Q. Is it accurate that the government did not ask that you do\n20 a detailed flow-of-funds analysis for the various accounts that\n21 are reflected here?\n22 A. That's correct.\n23 Q. Or a flow-of-funds analysis for any of the bank records\n24 that the government had provided to Brattle in the course of\n25 this case?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 A. That's correct.\n2 Q. Looking at the outflows from the ACA Capital account, those\n3 numbers flowing out to the various different entities' bank\n4 accounts, are those accurate?\n5 A. They are.\n6 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, if we could now go to slide\n7 12, please.\n8 Q. There is a subset, kind of a zoom-in view of the prior\n9 chart; is that correct?\n10 A. That's correct.\n11 Q. So for example, the flows, the collective flows of\n12 $29 million from the ACA Capital account to these Lamp Capital\n13 accounts, that's accurate based on the records, correct?\n14 A. Yes, we verified those transactions into the Lamp Capital\n15 accounts are reflected in the underlying source documents.\n16 MS. MURRAY: And then Ms. Loftus, next slide, please.\n17 Q. And these expenses, these transactions reflected here then\n18 from those Lamp Capital accounts out to these different\n19 expenses, these are accurate as well, right, Mr. Hinton?\n20 A. That's correct.\n21 Q. Including luxury car-related expenses depicted in red here?\n22 A. Yes.\n23 Q. Including yacht-related expenses depicted in blue here?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. Including aircraft-related expenses depicted in the black\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 here?\n2 A. Yes.\n3 Q. And including, for example, $20 million going to a Swiss\n4 bank account held in the name of Qiang Guo depicted on the\n5 right here?\n6 A. That's correct.\n7 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, if we could go to slide 15 of\n8 this exhibit, please.\n9 Q. Mr. Hinton, Mr. Kamaraju asked you some questions about the\n10 different boxes that are depicted on this summary chart. Do\n11 you recall those questions?\n12 A. I do.\n13 Q. In particular, for example, he asked you whether the\n14 government had requested that the Crane Advisory Group boxes on\n15 the right, in the light blue, be reflected in separate boxes\n16 rather than aggregated into one. Do you remember that?\n17 A. I do.\n18 Q. Looking at those Crane Advisory Group boxes, let's start on\n19 the top left. What bank account does that reflect?\n20 A. The top left is a Citibank account, Crane Advisory account,\n21 5278.\n22 Q. And then tracing to the right, what bank does the next one,\n23 the 5522 account, reflect?\n24 A. It's at Signature Bank, 5522.\n25 Q. Going right again, what bank is reflected by the third box?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 A. It's a different bank again; it's Capital One, 0887.\n2 Q. Let's go now, middle at the left, there are a series of MSS\n3 accounts. What banks are those accounts in the name of Crane\n4 Advisory Group held?\n5 A. Morgan Stanley accounts. There's four of them.\n6 Q. To the right here, IDB, what bank does that represent?\n7 A. I think it's an Israel Deposit Bank.\n8 Q. So these five different boxes on this summary chart, is it\n9 correct that those represent accounts held at five different\n10 banks in the name of Crane Advisory Group?\n11 A. It does.\n12 Q. And the flow of funds depicted among and between those\n13 accounts reflected on this chart, those are accurate, correct?\n14 A. They are.\n15 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, if we could go to the same\n16 exhibit, and let's go to slide 4, please.\n17 Q. Mr. Hinton, you were asked some questions about time\n18 periods reflected on various of the summary charts. Do you\n19 recall that?\n20 A. I do recall.\n21 Q. In particular, with respect to this slide, Mr. Kamaraju\n22 asked you whether expanding a time period would account for a\n23 larger amount of funds shown on a summary; is that correct?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. Now, Mr. Hinton, these summary charts that we've been going\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 through, these only reflect certain of the processed\n2 transactions that Brattle had been given bank records for; is\n3 that right?\n4 A. That's correct.\n5 Q. And the government selected what information, if any, to\n6 include in these summary charts?\n7 A. That's correct.\n8 Q. And I believe you testified, sir, that the summary charts\n9 were underinclusive of transactions based on the bank records,\n10 even just the bank records that Brattle processed; is that\n11 right?\n12 A. That's correct.\n13 Q. So looking here at the GTV/VOG Overview, and I'm going to\n14 ask you, sir, to do a little bit of quick and dirty math on the\n15 spot.\n16 So we have 286.9 million going to Saraca. Do you see\n17 that?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. If we add the approximately 29.6 million on the right and\n20 the 72.9 million on the left——and you may approximate——can you\n21 let me know what the total aggregate amount would be for\n22 GTV/VOG.\n23 A. Yes. Well, adding the approximately 30 million to the 286,\n24 that would get you 316, and then adding 73 would get you to\n25 403.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 Q. Try it one more time.\n2 A. Sorry. 309. Yeah, 309 or 310 million. Sorry.\n3 410 million.\n4 Q. Let's break it down one more time. And again, I'm sorry to\n5 put you on the spot.\n6 So the 286 plus the 30 million or so gets us to 316;\n7 is that right?\n8 A. Yeah.\n9 MR. KAMARAJU: Objection. Asked and answered.\n10 A. Yeah, 316, and then 72 onto 316 is 400——406.\n11 THE COURT: Overruled.\n12 Q. So fair to say approximately 400 million or so, give or\n13 take?\n14 A. Yes.\n15 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, can you please put up\n16 alongside this Government Exhibit Stip 19.\n17 Q. Mr. Hinton, have you seen this exhibit before, on the\n18 right?\n19 A. On the right, no.\n20 Q. This is a stipulation between the parties that, if called\n21 to testify, an employee of the SEC, or Securities and Exchange\n22 Commission, would state the following, among other things:\n23 MS. MURRAY: And going to page 2 of Stip 19, please,\n24 Ms. Loftus.\n25 Q. If you could read the first sentence in paragraph 3 there,\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 please, Mr. Hinton.\n2 A. Pursuant to the agreement——\n3 Q. I'm sorry. If you could just read slowly and read each of\n4 the words in that text.\n5 A. Certainly. \"Pursuant to the Settlement Agreement, Saraca,\n6 GTV, and VOG have sent to the SEC $455,211,346.39 related to\n7 the GTV Private Placement, including $69,713,578.6 from\n8 Saraca's investment in Hayman Capital Management.\"\n9 Q. And you can stop there for a moment.\n10 And then going to the next sentence, \"As of the date\n11 of this Stipulation,\" can you please read that portion as well.\n12 A. \"As of the date of this Stipulation, Saraca and GTV\n13 together (on a joint and several basis) owe an additional\n14 $31,488,392.52 to the SEC, and VOG owes an additional $45,324\n15 to the SEC.\"\n16 Q. Now, Mr. Hinton, the entity names reflected in the\n17 stipulation on the right, are those the same entity names we\n18 see in the summary chart on the left?\n19 A. They are.\n20 Q. So that's VOG, GTV, Saraca?\n21 A. Yeah. I mean, Hayman Capital is not mentioned, but the\n22 others are.\n23 Q. Understood. And in the summary chart, which reflects a\n24 subset of the bank records that Brattle was provided, I think\n25 we said the aggregate amount for this overview of GTV/VOG\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 Sources of Funds was approximately 400 million; is that right?\n2 A. Yes.\n3 Q. The initial amount in the stipulation on the right, what's\n4 the approximate amount of that, in the second line?\n5 A. 455 million.\n6 Q. Plus there's an additional amount in the second to last\n7 line. What is that amount?\n8 A. 31 million.\n9 Q. Is 480 million more than 400 million?\n10 A. Yes.\n11 MS. MURRAY: All right. Ms. Loftus, we can take down\n12 Stip 19.\n13 We could go to slide 27 of Z26.\n14 Q. Mr. Hinton, you were also asked various questions about\n15 some of the date ranges reflected on this Himalaya Exchange\n16 flow slide. Do you recall those questions?\n17 A. Yes.\n18 Q. In particular, Mr. Kamaraju pulled up a document and he\n19 indicated to you that the launch date of the exchange was\n20 November of 2021. Do you recall that?\n21 A. Yes.\n22 Q. And then pointed to some of the flows here that included an\n23 earlier time period, and in particular, if we're looking at the\n24 Sources of Funds, the 473.8 million begins on the summary chart\n25 on June 2, 2021, right?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 A. Yes.\n2 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, if we could pull up\n3 Government Exhibit Z9, and go to page 93.\n4 Q. Mr. Hinton, what is the date in the leftmost column on this\n5 Government Exhibit?\n6 A. May 20, 2021.\n7 MS. MURRAY: And if we could zoom in on the top\n8 portion, Ms. Loftus, through to the end of the second\n9 paragraph.\n10 Q. Mr. Hinton, there's a bracket with a date and then some\n11 text in bold on the top of the screenshot. Can you please read\n12 that.\n13 A. \"[May 20, 2021] Miles Guo's Gettr (3rd).\"\n14 Q. All right. And let's read the first paragraph here,\n15 starting with, \"There is another issue.\" Can you read that\n16 carefully please for the jury.\n17 A. \"There is another issue I want to mention to my brothers\n18 and sisters. I want to reiterate that all those who have\n19 bought G-Club membership cards must hurry up and finish a\n20 series of actions, including KYC and reconciliation, as quickly\n21 as you can. This is a race against time. I don't want to talk\n22 about other things anymore.\"\n23 Q. All right. And then let's go to the next paragraph. You\n24 could start the beginning of that paragraph.\n25 MS. MURRAY: And Ms. Loftus, I may ask you to\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 highlight some of the text as we go.\n2 Q. But go ahead, Mr. Hinton.\n3 A. \"More importantly, fellow fighters who want to buy Himalaya\n4 Coins and Himalaya Dollars must complete their KYC carefully\n5 and thoughtfully. Read the instructions carefully, contact the\n6 Himalaya farms if you need help. You must not waste any time\n7 completing your KYC.\"\n8 Q. If you could pause there, please, Mr. Hinton.\n9 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, if you could highlight those\n10 two points, the text at the beginning, \"buy Himalaya Coins\"\n11 through to \"Dollars.\" And then the sentence, \"You must not.\"\n12 Q. And Mr. Hinton, again, looking at the left, with respect to\n13 the text that's written here, \"You must not waste any time,\" on\n14 what date was this summary posted online, according to this\n15 exhibit?\n16 A. May 20, 2021.\n17 Q. And then let's go just to the last couple of lines here.\n18 MS. MURRAY: Ms. Loftus, if you could highlight\n19 starting with, \"please try your best,\" the third to last line,\n20 through to the end.\n21 Q. Can you read that, please, Mr. Hinton.\n22 A. \"Please try your best to pay with the Himalaya Dollar (HDO)\n23 account that you will get after you have passed KYC. Soon you\n24 can buy G Fashion products through your HDO account.\"\n25 MS. MURRAY: Thank you, Ms. Loftus. You can take that\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 down.\n2 Q. Mr. Hinton, Mr. Kamaraju also asked you some questions\n3 about whether the information reflected in your summary charts\n4 is helpful to Miles Guo. Do you recall those questions?\n5 A. Yes.\n6 Q. Do you know what's helpful to Miles Guo?\n7 A. I do not.\n8 Q. Do you know what's helpful to the government?\n9 A. I do not.\n10 Q. Do you know any of the government's other witnesses in this\n11 case?\n12 A. I do not.\n13 Q. Do you know any of the government's other evidence other\n14 than materials that the government has provided to you for\n15 purposes of Brattle's work in this case?\n16 A. I do not.\n17 Q. Have you been told anything about the underlying facts of\n18 this case by the government?\n19 A. I have not.\n20 MS. MURRAY: May I have a moment, your Honor.\n21 THE COURT: Okay.\n22 MS. MURRAY: I'm not sure if we have this, Ms. Loftus.\n23 If not, I might request the defense pull up Defense\n24 Exhibit 10339.\n25 MR. KAMARAJU: Jorge, do you mind pulling that up.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 MS. MURRAY: And we can go page 29.\n2 BY MS. MURRAY:\n3 Q. Mr. Hinton, this is one of the documents that Mr. Kamaraju\n4 asked you about on cross-examination.\n5 MS. MURRAY: Sorry. Maybe it's a couple of pages\n6 past. It was the $3 million transaction that Mr. Kamaraju\n7 inquired about.\n8 Sorry. Page 89, please. Thank you.\n9 All right. And if we could zoom in on the bottom\n10 portion. There are a couple of entries for August 8. Thank\n11 you.\n12 BY MS. MURRAY:\n13 Q. Mr. Hinton, you were asked questions about this $3 million,\n14 the first funds transfer that's depicted here. Do you recall\n15 those questions?\n16 A. Yes.\n17 Q. And that's a wire from ACA Capital Group; is that correct?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. A wire into this Golden Spring account, right?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. Do you then see two lines down that there is a debit or an\n22 outgoing transaction from the same Golden Spring account?\n23 A. I do.\n24 Q. And what is the amount of that transaction?\n25 A. It's also $3 million.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect\n1 Q. And is that the same day that the $3 million came in from\n2 the ACA Capital Group?\n3 A. Yes, it is.\n4 MS. MURRAY: Thank you so much. I appreciate it. We\n5 can take that down.\n6 Ms. Loftus, let's puts up Z26. And let's go to\n7 page 33.\n8 Q. Mr. Hinton, this is kind of the high-level summary of the\n9 flow of funds contained within this summary exhibit; is that\n10 correct?\n11 A. It is.\n12 Q. And looking at the Himalaya Exchange category the\n13 government identified, what is the amount of Sources of Funds\n14 into the Himalaya Exchange account based on the processed\n15 accounts that Brattle looked at here?\n16 A. Yeah, grouping all of the Himalaya accounts together, the\n17 total is 517 million of inflows from Sources of Funds.\n18 Q. Mr. Hinton, are you aware that the government seized\n19 approximately $640 million from bank accounts that were held in\n20 the name of the Himalaya Exchange or entities that controlled\n21 it, including Hamilton?\n22 A. No.\n23 Q. And 640 million is more than 517 million, correct?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 MS. MURRAY: We can take that down. Thank you.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Recross\n1 Q. Finally, Mr. Hinton, are you aware that Miles Guo filed for\n2 bankruptcy in 2022?\n3 A. No.\n4 Q. Are you aware that he reported that he had less than\n5 approximately $500,000 in assets?\n6 A. I do not.\n7 Q. Are you aware that he——withdrawn.\n8 Are you aware that G|CLUBS purchased a mansion in New\n9 Jersey for approximately $24.5 million, of the funds that were\n10 analyzed during the flow of funds reflected on these summary\n11 charts?\n12 MR. KAMARAJU: Object to form.\n13 A. I have seen——\n14 THE COURT: Can you break that down.\n15 MS. MURRAY: Sure.\n16 Q. In the course of reviewing bank records, Mr. Hinton, did\n17 those include bank records relating to the transfer of\n18 $24.5 million to title services and other companies?\n19 A. Yes.\n20 Q. And was the source of those funds G|CLUBS accounts?\n21 A. I believe so.\n22 MS. MURRAY: If I may have a moment, your Honor?\n23 THE COURT: Okay.\n24 MS. MURRAY: Thank you, Mr. Hinton.\n25 Nothing further, your Honor.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 THE COURT: Recross?\n2 MR. KAMARAJU: Very briefly, your Honor.\n3 Could I have Z26, please, slide 12.\n4 RECROSS EXAMINATION\n5 BY MR. KAMARAJU:\n6 Q. Mr. Hinton, Ms. Murray asked you about this slide on\n7 redirect, correct?\n8 A. Yes.\n9 Q. And she asked you whether you'd been asked by the\n10 government to do a——I believe the phrase was detailed\n11 flow-of-fund analysis, correct?\n12 A. I believe——I believe that's what she said.\n13 Q. Okay. Now you weren't asked to do that, right?\n14 A. That's correct.\n15 Q. And because you weren't asked to do a detailed flow-of-fund\n16 analysis, you can't say whether any part of that $77 million\n17 accounts for any part of that $13 million that goes to Lamp,\n18 right?\n19 A. Right. If you——if you wanted to know precisely how much\n20 flowed through the accounts, you'd have to do a tracing\n21 analysis.\n22 Q. And you didn't do that, right?\n23 A. I haven't done that.\n24 MR. KAMARAJU: Okay. No further questions.\n25 THE COURT: All righty. Thank you, sir. You may step\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 out.\n2 (Witness excused)\n3 THE COURT: And the prosecutor may call its next\n4 witness.\n5 MR. FINKEL: The government calls Wei Chen.\n6 (Witness sworn)\n7 THE COURT: Please state your name and spell it, and\n8 speak into the microphone.\n9 THE WITNESS: My name is Wei Chen, spelled as W-E-I,\n10 and C-H-E-N.\n11 THE COURT: So I need you to speak even louder than\n12 that so that everyone can hear you.\n13 You may inquire.\n14 MR. FINKEL: Thank you, your Honor.\n15 WEI CHEN,\n16 called as a witness by the Government,\n17 having been duly sworn, testified as follows:\n18 DIRECT EXAMINATION\n19 BY MR. FINKEL:\n20 Q. So Ms. Chen, further to what the judge was saying, you can\n21 just point the microphone directly actually at your mouth so it\n22 picks up the sound, okay? Feel free to move it. You can move\n23 that top piece so it's pointed directly at your mouth. Thank\n24 you.\n25 Ms. Chen, where were you born?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 A. I was born in China.\n2 Q. And when did you come to the United States?\n3 A. I came to the United States in 2007.\n4 Q. Why did you come to the United States?\n5 A. For a master degree.\n6 Q. Did you obtain a master's degree?\n7 A. Yes.\n8 Q. In what?\n9 A. Master of business administration.\n10 Q. What state do you live in now?\n11 A. Virginia.\n12 Q. What do you do for work?\n13 A. I work in a bank. I help the bank manage the risk,\n14 including operational risk, financial risk, and reputational\n15 risk.\n16 MS. SHROFF: I'm sorry. I didn't catch the last one.\n17 MR. FINKEL: Reputational risk.\n18 Q. Ms. Chen, were you ever a follower of Miles Guo?\n19 A. Yes.\n20 Q. Are you a follower of Miles Guo today?\n21 A. No.\n22 Q. Why not?\n23 A. Because he's a liar; he's a fraudster.\n24 Q. Ms. Chen, when did you first learn about Miles Guo?\n25 A. In 2007.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 Q. 2007?\n2 A. Sorry. 2017.\n3 MR. FINKEL: Your Honor, could we approach for a\n4 moment.\n5 THE COURT: All right.\n6 (Continued on next page)\n7\n8\n9\n10\n11\n12\n13\n14\n15\n16\n17\n18\n19\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 (At the sidebar)\n2 MR. FINKEL: Your Honor, I'm hearing a tremendous\n3 amount of scoffing and cackling from the gallery, more than\n4 normal. I don't know why that is, but it's not appropriate.\n5 And I don't want to do this in public, in front of everyone,\n6 but at some point I'd ask the Court to just remind the gallery\n7 to settle down.\n8 THE COURT: I have heard the same thing, and I'm going\n9 to tell them to stop vocalizing.\n10 MR. FINKEL: Thank you.\n11 MS. SHROFF: Your Honor, is the Court planning to tell\n12 them in front of the jury? I would——\n13 THE COURT: The jury is sitting here listening to them\n14 make remarks and laugh and ridicule.\n15 MS. SHROFF: Your Honor, I just walked in. I have not\n16 been here all morning. So I was not focused——I actually\n17 couldn't see the person so I was trying to get that thing down,\n18 but——\n19 MR. FINKEL: It's happened throughout this trial.\n20 It's never been a big deal. This is to a different degree.\n21 That's why I wanted to tell your Honor.\n22 THE COURT: Yes. I am going to let them know that\n23 right now. I have been very upset with the way that some\n24 individuals have been chatting and making faces. Some have\n25 even come in with sunglasses on. So I am going to say\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 something now.\n2 (In open court)\n3 THE COURT: I'm now addressing myself to those of you\n4 who are sitting in the gallery, in the audience, on the\n5 benches. I do not want to hear laughing or any chatter. If\n6 you cannot be quiet, you will have to leave.\n7 Please go ahead.\n8 MR. FINKEL: Thank you, your Honor.\n9 BY MR. FINKEL:\n10 Q. Ms. Chen, you said you first learned about Miles Guo in\n11 2017. How did you first learn about Miles Guo?\n12 A. My husband was listening to his YouTube videos and\n13 introduced him to me.\n14 Q. And did you yourself start listening to Miles Guo's YouTube\n15 videos?\n16 A. Yes.\n17 Q. And when did you start watching Miles Guo's videos?\n18 A. About end of 2018 or beginning of 2019, around that time\n19 period.\n20 Q. And in that time period, 2018 to 2019, what, generally\n21 speaking, was Miles Guo's message?\n22 A. He was talking about bringing American values to China.\n23 MS. SHROFF: Objection, your Honor. I think she can\n24 only testify to her understanding of Mr. Guo's message.\n25 THE COURT: She can testify as to what he stated.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 You may continue.\n2 BY MR. FINKEL:\n3 Q. Let me reask the question. Ms. Chen, when you started\n4 watching Miles Guo's videos, what was his message in 2018,\n5 2019?\n6 A. My understanding, the messaging I take away is bringing\n7 American values to China.\n8 Q. Did you agree with that message?\n9 A. Yes.\n10 Q. I want to direct your attention, Ms. Chen, to June of 2020.\n11 Around that time did Miles Guo mention something called the GTV\n12 Private Placement?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. And did you invest in the GTV Private Placement?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 Q. Approximately how much money?\n17 A. At the very beginning, approximately $200,000.\n18 Q. What did Miles Guo say, if anything, that caused you to\n19 invest at that time, around June 2020, in the GTV Private\n20 Placement?\n21 A. Miles Guo promoted it as a very rare opportunity. He\n22 promoted it as a prepublic offering, that the followers can buy\n23 at $8 a share, and then when it goes to the public, the value\n24 would go up to ten or hundred, even a thousand. So have very\n25 large returns. He also said the GTV investment is because the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 GTV business would have a bright future. It would be better\n2 than YouTube, Amazon. It is not just a social media platform,\n3 it would also allow connections, like you can buy things from\n4 Amazon.com or eBay.com. It is going to be a very powerful\n5 platform. It's going to be successful. They're going to have\n6 huge returns.\n7 Q. Around that time, Ms. Chen, did Miles Guo say anything\n8 about whether it was risky or not risky to invest in the GTV\n9 Private Placement?\n10 A. Not at all. Only returns, huge returns, zero risk.\n11 Q. That's what Miles Guo said?\n12 A. That's exactly right.\n13 Q. And Ms. Chen, when you decided to invest in the GTV Private\n14 Placement, what was your understanding, based on what Miles Guo\n15 said, about how that money that you invested would be used?\n16 A. My understanding is that the money will be used to develop\n17 and grow GTV business, including acquiring the software,\n18 building of the structure to make the business successful, to\n19 be a competitor like YouTube, Amazon, eBay, and so on.\n20 Q. Ms. Chen, prior to your decision to invest in the GTV\n21 Private Placement, had you invested very much in the stock\n22 market?\n23 A. No. I don't do risky investment.\n24 Q. Why did you decide to invest in the GTV Private Placement\n25 if you don't normally invest in stocks?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 A. Because——\n2 MS. SHROFF: Objection. That is not what she said.\n3 MR. FINKEL: It's a question.\n4 Q. Why did you decide to invest in the GTV Private Placement\n5 if you don't normally invest in stocks?\n6 MS. SHROFF: She didn't say——\n7 THE COURT: She didn't mention stocks specifically.\n8 MS. SHROFF: Yes, she did, and she said she doesn't\n9 invest in risky stock.\n10 THE COURT: Correct.\n11 A. I can clarify.\n12 Q. Let me ask the question, if I can.\n13 Ms. Chen, why did you decide to invest in the GTV\n14 Private Placement if you don't generally invest in risky\n15 stocks?\n16 A. Because there's no risk. And I want to clarify. In my\n17 opinion, stock is a risky investment, so I don't invest in\n18 stock.\n19 MR. FINKEL: We can pull up what's in evidence as\n20 GX VK5.\n21 Q. Ms. Chen, prior to investing in the GTV Private Placement——\n22 A. Sorry. I don't see anything showing up.\n23 Q. I know. I'm asking a question.\n24 A. Oh, okay.\n25 Q. Okay. It should be on everyone's screen now.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 A. Yeah, I see it now.\n2 Q. Have you seen this document before, Ms. Chen?\n3 A. Yes.\n4 Q. Did you see this document before you invested in the GTV\n5 Private Placement?\n6 A. Yes, I did.\n7 Q. Did you review it?\n8 A. Yes, I did.\n9 Q. By the way, how did you get this document?\n10 A. Miles Guo sent a link to this document to my husband via\n11 the WhatsApp chat.\n12 Q. After you reviewed——well, withdrawn.\n13 MR. FINKEL: We could turn to page 10.\n14 Q. Do you see where it says 4. Use of Proceeds?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 Q. What was your understanding, after reviewing this Use of\n17 Proceeds, how money invested in the GTV Private Placement would\n18 be used?\n19 A. It would be used according to the chart here, of the\n20 percentage of the money to those activities as outlined in\n21 page 10.\n22 Q. And do you see where it says Other, approximately\n23 5 percent?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. What was your understanding of what Other meant?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 A. My understanding is some overhead costs, administrative, HR\n2 hiring.\n3 MR. FINKEL: If we can go to page 15.\n4 Q. Ms. Chen, when you were considering investing in GTV, what\n5 was your understanding of what the G in GTV stood for?\n6 A. My understanding was that's Guo TV.\n7 Q. And when you were considering whether to invest in the GTV\n8 Private Placement, what was your understanding of what——well,\n9 withdrawn.\n10 Do you see at the bottom where it says 6.3 Sponsor and\n11 Adviser of GTV Media?\n12 A. Yes.\n13 Q. Can you read what it says.\n14 A. \"The Sponsor and Adviser of GTV Media, Mr. Wengui Guo\n15 (a/k/a Miles Guo, Ho Wan Kwok or Miles Kwok), is a billionaire,\n16 a successful businessman, and a dissident in China.\"\n17 Q. You can stop there. Ms. Chen, it says here that Mr. Guo is\n18 a billionaire. What factor, if any, did Miles Guo's claims of\n19 wealth influence your decision to invest in the GTV Private\n20 Placement?\n21 A. It played a critical influence in my decision. That made\n22 me believe that he is a wealthy person and he has resources,\n23 and he emphasized about institutional investors investing GTV;\n24 that will make it successful.\n25 Q. It says here, Ms. Chen, that Mr. Guo is the sponsor and\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 adviser of GTV Media. That's what it says in this document.\n2 Based on your review of broadcasts that Mr. Guo had made, what\n3 was your understanding of Guo's role, if any, with GTV?\n4 A. My understanding of his role is he owns it, he controls it,\n5 and he created it.\n6 Q. And that's based on the broadcasts you watched.\n7 A. Yes.\n8 MR. FINKEL: If we can go to page 18.\n9 Or actually——excuse me——let's go to page 13.\n10 Page 12.\n11 Q. Okay. You see where it says Executive Directors?\n12 A. Yes.\n13 Q. What's the name of the first executive director listed?\n14 A. Yvette Wang.\n15 MR. FINKEL: Could we go to the next page, please.\n16 Q. And what's the name of the next executive director listed?\n17 A. Max Krasner.\n18 Q. At the time you were considering whether to invest in GTV,\n19 did you have an understanding of what the relationship was, if\n20 any, between Miles Guo and Max Krasner?\n21 A. No, I have no idea.\n22 MR. FINKEL: Okay. Could we go to page 15,\n23 Ms. Loftus.\n24 Q. Can you read who's listed as nonexecutive directors.\n25 A. Darren Blanton and Aaron Mitchell.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 MR. FINKEL: If we could go back one page to 14,\n2 please, Ms. Loftus.\n3 Q. And can you read the nonexecutive directors listed here.\n4 A. Steve Bannon, Kyle Bass.\n5 MR. FINKEL: If we can go, please, to page 17.\n6 Q. Ms. Chen, at the time that you invested in the GTV Private\n7 Placement, what was your understanding about whether or not you\n8 and your husband were an accredited investor?\n9 A. My understanding is we met the accredited investor\n10 requirements, and qualified for it.\n11 Q. And as a result——well, withdrawn.\n12 MR. FINKEL: Could we go to the next page, please,\n13 Ms. Loftus.\n14 Q. So you see where it says Risk Factors at the bottom?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 MR. FINKEL: Can you flip through that, please,\n17 Ms. Loftus.\n18 Q. Did you review those risk factors before you invested in\n19 GTV?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. And what impact, if any, did the risk factors have on your\n22 decision to invest?\n23 A. Not any impact.\n24 Q. Why not?\n25 A. Because in my view back then, those were standard language\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 and that I trusted what Miles Guo said in the video, there are\n2 no risk, only huge returns.\n3 THE COURT: What do you mean by \"standard language\"?\n4 THE WITNESS: Like in a legal document, it oftentimes\n5 would have the language talk about risk.\n6 MR. FINKEL: We can take that down, Ms. Loftus.\n7 Q. What was more important to you, the memo that we just\n8 looked at or what Miles Guo said in his videos?\n9 A. What's more important to me?\n10 Q. When you were considering whether to invest in the GTV\n11 Private Placement, what was more important, the memo we just\n12 looked at or what Miles Guo said in his videos?\n13 A. Miles Guo said in his videos.\n14 Q. Why?\n15 A. Because I trusted him, I trusted what he said, I trusted\n16 that he is a wealthy person, and I trusted that he's a\n17 trustworthy person. I trusted what he said, that I am just his\n18 sisters, he want me to be rich. I trusted that he never lied,\n19 he's a very truthful person, so I trusted every single word he\n20 said about GTV investment.\n21 Q. Ms. Chen, if you had known that the money you sent for the\n22 GTV Private Placement would be used as part of a\n23 hundred-million-dollar investment in a hedge fund in the name\n24 of Miles Guo's son, would you have sent any money to GTV?\n25 A. No, absolutely not.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 Q. If you had known that your investment wasn't guaranteed\n2 despite what Miles Guo said in his videos, would you have sent\n3 any money to GTV?\n4 A. No, absolutely not.\n5 Q. Did you receive any stock certificates?\n6 A. I was able to log in to a website to be able to pay for two\n7 papers that would have the share amounts on the paper.\n8 Q. And did you order those papers?\n9 A. Yes.\n10 Q. How much did they cost?\n11 A. A hundred dollars.\n12 Q. Where exactly did you send your GTV——well, how much money\n13 did you invest in the GTV Private Placement?\n14 A. Close to $200,000.\n15 Q. And to what entity did you send that money to?\n16 A. Saraca Media.\n17 Q. What instructions did you——well, how did you know to send\n18 to Saraca Media?\n19 A. Because Miles Guo sent a document link to my husband\n20 through the WhatsApp chat, and when we click the web app——or\n21 the link, it takes you to a document that has wire instruction\n22 information.\n23 MR. FINKEL: Your Honor, may I approach the witness.\n24 THE COURT: Yes.\n25 MR. FINKEL: Your Honor, I've handed Ms. Chen a binder\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 which contains the following documents in the VB series: 14,\n2 24, 26, 27, 29, 31, and 33.\n3 Q. Ms. Chen, can you please flip through that binder and let\n4 me know when you're done.\n5 A. Yes, I did.\n6 Q. Do you recognize the documents in that binder?\n7 A. Yes, I do.\n8 Q. What are they?\n9 A. Those are the documents I provided.\n10 Q. And what do those documents relate to?\n11 A. Related to Miles Guo's fraud scam.\n12 MR. FINKEL: Ms. Loftus, if we can pull up Stip 21.\n13 Your Honor, the government offers the stipulation into\n14 evidence, Stip 21.\n15 THE COURT: It is admitted.\n16 (Government's Exhibit Stip 21 received in evidence)\n17 MR. FINKEL: Stip 21 reads, \"It is hereby stipulated\n18 and agreed——\"\n19 MS. SHROFF: Your Honor, could Mr. Finkel slow down\n20 because I think the translator is having trouble.\n21 MR. FINKEL: I'm happy to slow down.\n22 THE INTERPRETER: Thank you.\n23 THE COURT: Go ahead.\n24 MR. FINKEL: \"It is hereby stipulated and agreed by\n25 the parties: In the below chart, the exhibit listed under\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 Column A contains text, audio, or video in a foreign language.\n2 \"In the below chart, the exhibit listed under column B\n3 and their subparts is a true and accurate translation of the\n4 audio or text contained in the exhibit and their subparts\n5 listed under column A.\"\n6 And if we can go to the next page, please, Ms. Loftus.\n7 And in column A, there is listed VB24, 13, 10, 27, and\n8 24T, 13T, 10T, 27T.\n9 Your Honor, at this time the government offers the\n10 documents in the binder, which are VB13, 14, 24, 26, 27, 29,\n11 31, 33, and their corresponding translations as stipulated to\n12 by the parties, which are VB24-T, 13-T, 10-T, 27-T.\n13 THE COURT: They are admitted.\n14 (Government's Exhibits VB13, VB14, VB24, VB26, VB27,\n15 VB29, VB31, VB33 received in evidence)\n16 (Government's Exhibits VB10-T, VB13-T, VB24-T, VB27-T\n17 received in evidence)\n18 MR. FINKEL: We can take that down, Ms. Loftus.\n19 BY MR. FINKEL:\n20 Q. Ms. Chen, when did you first learn about something called\n21 G|CLUBS?\n22 A. I first learned about it in around about——around about\n23 October 2020.\n24 Q. And at first, Ms. Chen, what did Miles Guo say, if\n25 anything, about G|CLUBS?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 A. If I remember, I think he talk about it as a membership.\n2 Q. Did you send money for a G|CLUBS membership?\n3 A. No, never ever.\n4 Q. Did you send money to a company called Crane?\n5 A. Yes.\n6 Q. Why did you send money to a company called Crane?\n7 A. Because Miles Guo promoted opportunities to add more GTV\n8 share, and in order to do so, Miles Guo asked us to contact the\n9 farm to complete investment into additional GTV share. So we\n10 contacted the MOS farm and was given a bank account of Crane.\n11 Q. What's MOS?\n12 A. Mountains of Spice Farm.\n13 Q. And what was your understanding of who the leader of the\n14 Mountains of Spice Farm is?\n15 A. Back then it was Lo——\n16 MS. SHROFF: Are you asking who the leader is now or\n17 in what year?\n18 Q. What is your understanding of——yeah, what is your\n19 understanding of who the Mountains of Spices leader is,\n20 Ms. Chen?\n21 MS. SHROFF: Same objection.\n22 THE COURT: Are you asking is or was?\n23 MR. FINKEL: Well, I think it's the same, but——\n24 Q. At the time that you were considering sending money to\n25 Crane, who was the leader of the Mountains of Spice farm?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 A. Back then it was Long Island Brother.\n2 Q. Did you see Long Island Brother and Miles Guo appear\n3 together in videos?\n4 A. Yes, all the time.\n5 Q. What is a farm?\n6 A. The farm, in my opinion, is the entity that Miles Guo asked\n7 people to form to help the followers to join the farm to\n8 complete the investment.\n9 Q. At the time you were considering, Ms. Chen, sending money\n10 to Crane for additional GTV shares, what was Miles Guo saying,\n11 if anything, in his videos about the value of GTV?\n12 A. Miles Guo said he had independent valuation company did a\n13 valuation of the GTV business, it has already been——it has\n14 already been appreciated. I don't remember the exact how many\n15 times, maybe ten times or so, but it is high enough to attract\n16 me to send more money for additional GTV shares.\n17 Q. And did Miles Guo explain why, in order to get additional\n18 GTV shares, you had to go through the farms and Crane instead\n19 of just sending it to Saraca as you had previously done?\n20 A. I don't recall he did so.\n21 MR. FINKEL: If we can pull up what's in evidence, on\n22 the left side, VB24, and on the right side, VB24-T.\n23 All right. And as stipulated by the parties, the\n24 translations are on the right side of the screen.\n25 Q. Ms. Chen, do you recognize the document that's on the left\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 side of the screen?\n2 A. Yes.\n3 Q. And it says at the top, Crane. Do you see that?\n4 A. Yes.\n5 Q. All right. Where is this document from; what entity?\n6 A. This document was provided to us by the MOS Farm volunteer.\n7 I don't know where it's coming from, but it's sent to us\n8 through Discord chat by an MOS volunteer.\n9 Q. What's Discord?\n10 A. Discord is a social media platform that the farm and the\n11 Himalaya Alliance are using to gather followers.\n12 MR. FINKEL: Could we go to the next page of each of\n13 these, please, Ms. Loftus.\n14 Q. And so Ms. Chen, what was your understanding of what this\n15 document was, VB24?\n16 A. When we signed this document, we thought, this is the\n17 document that is required to complete this investment.\n18 Q. And this particular document on the screen, is this the\n19 document you signed?\n20 A. My husband signed it.\n21 Q. What is the red text at the top? What is your\n22 understanding of what the red text at the top is?\n23 A. The red text top says to the G Club customer, meaning the\n24 person who made the payment, and put a name on there.\n25 Q. Were these instructions that the farm provided through the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 Discord channel?\n2 MS. SHROFF: Objection. The farm did not provide\n3 instructions. The farm provided a document.\n4 THE COURT: Sustained.\n5 Q. Was it your understanding that this document provided by\n6 the farm were instructions on how to process the payment to\n7 Crane?\n8 A. Yes, that's my understanding.\n9 MR. FINKEL: We can pull up, please, VB26.\n10 Q. Whose name is at the top of this document?\n11 A. My name.\n12 Q. And it says below that G|CLUBS reference number. Do you\n13 see that?\n14 A. Yes.\n15 Q. What is that number for?\n16 A. That's a number that my husband obtained when he created an\n17 order on the G|CLUBS website.\n18 Q. And Ms. Chen, what was your understanding, if any, about\n19 the relationship between G|CLUBS and these additional GTV\n20 shares that you wanted to purchase?\n21 A. My understanding is what Miles Guo promoted in his\n22 broadcasting video, that those G|CLUBS membership are free as a\n23 benefit, if we are buying additional GTV shares.\n24 Q. Do you see at the top it says Crane Advisory Group,\n25 Ms. Chen?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 A. Yes.\n2 Q. Did you in fact send money to Crane Advisory Group?\n3 A. Yes.\n4 Q. Approximately how much?\n5 A. About a hundred thousand dollars.\n6 Q. And where did that hundred thousand dollars come from?\n7 A. The hundred thousand dollars are coming from my home\n8 equity.\n9 Q. What do you mean by that?\n10 A. Meaning the second loan on my house.\n11 Q. Did you get a second loan on your house for the purpose of\n12 trying to purchase additional GTV shares?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. Why?\n15 A. Because I trusted Miles Guo that the GTV shares would\n16 provide huge returns, that would provide the return that\n17 offsetting the cost of borrowing from my home equity.\n18 Q. Ms. Chen, what was your understanding, if any, about how\n19 many G|CLUBS memberships you would get for the hundred thousand\n20 dollars you sent to Crane?\n21 A. My understanding is that will be two free G|CLUBS\n22 memberships of tier 5.\n23 Q. And what was that understanding based on?\n24 A. Based on what Miles Guo emphasized and repeated over and\n25 over again in his YouTube, in his broadcasting videos, that if\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 you buy GTV shares, you get G|CLUBS membership for free, and\n2 that's a benefit he's giving to his fellow followers.\n3 Q. Did you ever send money to an entity called HCHK?\n4 MR. FINKEL: Ms. Loftus, we can take that down.\n5 A. Yes.\n6 MR. FINKEL: If we can pull up what's in evidence as\n7 VB29.\n8 Q. What is this document?\n9 A. This is the wire receipt or confirmation of the money I\n10 sent to HCHK Technology.\n11 Q. And is that you and your husband's name under Debit Party?\n12 A. Yes.\n13 Q. And how much did you send to HCHK Technologies?\n14 A. A hundred and ten thousand.\n15 Q. Why did you send 110,000 to HCHK Technologies?\n16 A. To purchase additional GTV shares.\n17 Q. And did these additional GTV shares, based on your\n18 understanding from Miles Guo's videos, come with G|CLUBS\n19 memberships as well?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. Ms. Chen, did you need multiple G|CLUBS memberships?\n22 A. No. I don't need any G|CLUBS membership because it doesn't\n23 offer anything.\n24 Q. What is HCHK Technologies?\n25 A. I have no idea what HCHK Technologies is.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 Q. Around this time, Ms. Chen——I think this document is dated\n2 August 2021——what, if anything, was Miles Guo saying about\n3 whether there was an urgency to purchase additional GTV shares?\n4 A. The urgency is the opportunity window is closing down. If\n5 you want to get more GTV shares, you got to hurry up.\n6 Q. And this urgency that Miles Guo talked about, what impact,\n7 if any, did that have on your decision to try to purchase more\n8 GTV shares?\n9 A. That stipulated me sending to this account as soon as\n10 possible. I believe we received a bank account August 15 and\n11 we sent the money on August 16, the next day.\n12 Q. At the bottom of this document it says, REF: MOS. Do you\n13 see that?\n14 A. Yes.\n15 Q. What does MOS stand for?\n16 A. Mountains of Spice.\n17 MR. FINKEL: We can take that down, Ms. Loftus.\n18 Q. When you were considering——did you visit the G|CLUBS\n19 website?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. And what did you see?\n22 A. I see Miles Guo smoking cigar and on his yacht.\n23 Q. Did you ever get additional GTV shares for the 110,000 you\n24 sent to HCHK and the approximately hundred you sent to Crane?\n25 A. No, I don't think so.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 MR. FINKEL: If we could put up VB14, which is in\n2 evidence.\n3 If you had known, Ms. Chen, that you wouldn't receive\n4 shares for the money you sent to HCHK and the money you sent to\n5 Crane, would you have sent that money?\n6 A. Of course not.\n7 Q. What are we looking at here in VB14?\n8 A. This is my husband's G|CLUBS membership account that he was\n9 logging into his account and it showed up in his account\n10 information.\n11 Q. And did you see this account information on the computer\n12 online?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. And Ms. Chen, did there come a time, if ever, where you or\n15 your husband used a G Fashion discount from your G|CLUBS\n16 membership?\n17 A. We did.\n18 Q. And how much in G Fashion clothing did you purchase,\n19 approximately?\n20 A. I paid about $2,000.\n21 Q. And what was the discount you received?\n22 A. 50 percent.\n23 Q. Ms. Chen, if you had known that all you would get for the\n24 money you sent to HCHK Technologies and Crane Advisory Group\n25 was a 50 percent discount on G Fashion items, would you have\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 sent that money?\n2 A. Sorry. Can you repeat that question again.\n3 Q. Sure. If you had known that for sending $200,000 to Crane\n4 and HCHK all you would get is a 50 percent discount on G\n5 Fashion, would you have sent that money?\n6 A. No. The 50 percent G Fashion discount is nothing. The\n7 2,000 I paid for, even after discount, is not well worth the\n8 money I paid for it.\n9 Q. Did G|CLUBS, to your knowledge, offer any hotel discounts?\n10 A. I'm not aware.\n11 Q. Did you receive anything in the mail from G|CLUBS?\n12 A. I received one time a Christmas gift.\n13 Q. What was in the Christmas gift?\n14 A. Some cookies, coffee, and a coffee mug.\n15 MR. FINKEL: You can take that down. And Ms. Loftus,\n16 if you can display, just for the witness, VB35.\n17 Q. What is this?\n18 A. That's the coffee mug I received.\n19 MR. FINKEL: Government offers VB35.\n20 MS. SHROFF: No objection, your Honor.\n21 THE COURT: It is admitted.\n22 (Government's Exhibit VB35 received in evidence)\n23 Q. Ms. Chen, if you had known that all you would receive from\n24 G|CLUBS was a coffee mug, some cookies, coffee, and the G\n25 Fashion discount, would you have sent money to HCHK and Crane?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 A. No.\n2 Q. Did you learn anything, or did you hear anything from\n3 G|CLUBS about a discount for an F1 race?\n4 A. No.\n5 MR. FINKEL: You can take that down.\n6 If we can pull up, please, Ms. Loftus, on the left\n7 side VB27 and on the right side, 27-T.\n8 Q. So on the right side is the stipulated translation.\n9 Ms. Chen, do you recognize the document on the left\n10 side of your screen?\n11 A. Yes.\n12 Q. Can you just describe to the jury what your understanding\n13 of what this document is.\n14 A. My understanding of this document is the form the MOS Farms\n15 asked us to complete to calculate the total of the GTV shares.\n16 Q. What do you mean the total of GTV shares?\n17 A. Because all the investments, including donations, has GTV\n18 share tied to it. Miles Guo said in the videos and emphasized\n19 all different investments plus donation would entitle the\n20 follower equivalent GTV share.\n21 Q. So what was your understanding of why there needed to be a\n22 calculation?\n23 A. Because the investments are very complex, they are\n24 different investment programs, that starting to lose track of\n25 how many investments each member have completed, so we need to\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 submit this form, including the amount and the payment receipt\n2 for the MOS Farm to verify and then calculate a total of GTV\n3 shares for each member.\n4 Q. And did you and your husband fill out this form for that\n5 purpose?\n6 A. Yes.\n7 Q. Okay. It says here, No. 2, \"This form is for requirements\n8 for the reconstruction project.\" Do you see that, Ms. Chen?\n9 A. Yes.\n10 Q. What is your understanding of what the reconstruction\n11 project is?\n12 A. My understanding is because of the SEC litigation, Miles\n13 Guo said about a new GTV platform, restructuring the old one,\n14 so it's called restructuring the GTV.\n15 Q. What do you mean the SEC litigation?\n16 A. My understanding back then, there was a charge by the SEC\n17 and some litigations ongoing with the GTV investment we made\n18 back in June 2020.\n19 Q. Ms. Chen, did you receive money from the SEC?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. And was that part of the Fair Fund distribution?\n22 A. Yes.\n23 Q. What do you recall, if anything, Ms. Chen, about what Miles\n24 Guo said on his broadcasts about what people should do with the\n25 money they received from the Fair Fund from the SEC?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 A. Miles Guo asked people to send back the distribution of the\n2 Fair Funds to Miles Guo-related entities.\n3 Q. And did Miles Guo say anything about whether the people who\n4 received the Fair Fund distribution should do so quickly or\n5 slowly?\n6 A. Miles Guo said they should do it quickly and set a timeline\n7 of 45 days within the receipt of the Fair Fund distribution.\n8 Q. And what did Miles Guo say, if anything, about why there\n9 was a 45-day timeline?\n10 A. I don't remember exactly what he said, but my understanding\n11 is, there are Himalaya H Coin tied to the investments that are\n12 part of the Fair Funds. If you don't send back the money\n13 within the 45-day timeline, the Himalaya H Coin that is\n14 allocated to the members, based on the investment that they\n15 were able to purchase at 10 cents per coin, will be gone.\n16 MR. FINKEL: Ms. Loftus, if we can go to page 3 of\n17 these documents.\n18 Q. And looking at the English version, Ms. Chen, do you see at\n19 the bottom it says \"Apple Coin, G1, Have you successfully\n20 purchased G1 Apple Coin?\"\n21 A. Yes.\n22 Q. What was that?\n23 A. My understanding, that was an initial version of the\n24 digital coin that is available to purchase from Apple Store.\n25 Q. Had you purchased the G1 Apple Coin?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 A. No, I did not.\n2 MR. FINKEL: Okay. Could we go to the next page of\n3 each, Ms. Loftus.\n4 Q. And so is this form that we're looking at, Ms. Chen, the\n5 answers you provided to the questions on this form? \"No,\" for\n6 example, under G Dollar?\n7 A. Sorry. Can you repeat your question again.\n8 Q. Absolutely. You see where it says \"No\" under \"Did you\n9 successfully purchase G2 and not ask for a refund or already\n10 get a refund?\" Do you see that?\n11 A. Yes.\n12 Q. That \"No,\" is that you and your husband's response?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. Okay. And then for No. 4, it says, \"Old Chair. Are you an\n15 owner of an old chair?\" And you selected \"Yes\"; is that\n16 correct?\n17 A. Yes.\n18 Q. What's an Old Chair?\n19 A. So the Old Chair, in my understanding, were the initial GTV\n20 shares investors. We were in contact directly with Miles Guo\n21 to get the wire instructions to send the money to the Saraca\n22 Media, and there was a minimum investment requirement of a\n23 hundred thousand dollars, and to meet that requirement, it is\n24 considered one of the Old Chair, and then across all the farms,\n25 there are about a total of 1300 Old Chairs.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 Q. And that number at the bottom, the 198,700, what does that\n2 number represent?\n3 A. That number represents the money I sent to Saraca Media for\n4 a total of 90——90——yeah, for this dollar amount here.\n5 Q. Okay. Ms. Chen, did you participate in the farm loan\n6 program?\n7 A. No, I did not.\n8 MR. FINKEL: Okay. Could we go to the next page,\n9 please, Ms. Loftus.\n10 And over here——does that not work?\n11 Q. Okay. It says \"GC Order Number.\" What order number did\n12 you place there?\n13 A. This is an order number that is the same as the one we\n14 completed for that Crane compliance package, so that's a number\n15 my husband obtained after he created order at the G|CLUBS\n16 website.\n17 MR. FINKEL: Could we go to the next page, please,\n18 Ms. Loftus.\n19 Q. And so here, for No. 8, it says G Club Card, do you see\n20 that, at the bottom?\n21 A. Yes.\n22 MR. FINKEL: Okay. And Ms. Loftus, we could go to the\n23 next page.\n24 Q. And you selected \"No,\" correct?\n25 A. Yes.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 Q. Okay. Why did you select \"No\"?\n2 A. Because I'm buying additional GTV shares, not purchase G\n3 Club membership.\n4 MR. FINKEL: Go to the next page, please.\n5 Q. And then for 12 it says Summary. Do you see that?\n6 A. Yes.\n7 Q. And it says, \"Your Total Investment (USD). Total\n8 investment = G1 + G2 + Old Chair + Original VOG/Phoenix +\n9 Borrowing from Himalaya New York MOS + Borrowing from Other\n10 Farms + Actual Purchase of G Club + Frozen Amount in Other\n11 Farms + Donation Amount.\" Do you see all that?\n12 A. Yes.\n13 Q. What was your understanding of what that math equation was\n14 for?\n15 A. To calculate total GTV share.\n16 Q. And what did it mean, \"Frozen Amount in Other Farms\"; do\n17 you know?\n18 A. My understanding is there are certain farm loans called\n19 frozen by the local government, so they are defined as \"Frozen\n20 Amount in Other Farms\" outside MOS Farm.\n21 MR. FINKEL: Could we go to the next page, please,\n22 Ms. Loftus.\n23 Q. And here, for 13-2, right in the center, it says, \"Your\n24 plan for investment.\" Do you see that?\n25 A. Yes.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 Q. And what did you select?\n2 A. I selected to participate in investment through card\n3 project. So the translation here is not accurate. It's not\n4 purchase card and equities. It's distribute cards and\n5 equities.\n6 MS. SHROFF: Objection. She has no qualification to\n7 translate. The document speaks for itself and the document——\n8 THE COURT: I'm going to sustain the objection.\n9 Q. What is your understanding of why you selected that third\n10 button?\n11 A. Because I read the Chinese version. In the Chinese\n12 version, it said to participate in investment through card\n13 project. In Chinese version, it means distribute card and\n14 equity shares.\n15 Q. And the other two selections, only purchase G Club card or\n16 only for investment, can you explain what you understood those\n17 options to mean.\n18 A. Yes. Those option means it's a GTV share investment, and\n19 the G Club card is a benefit provided for free, and you have\n20 the option of voluntarily giving up this benefit of free G Club\n21 membership, so therefore, the second option, meaning only GTV\n22 shares, you're giving up the free benefits of G Club\n23 membership.\n24 Q. So you thought that you were buying shares——\n25 MS. SHROFF: Objection to the leading.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 MR. FINKEL: I didn't finish my question.\n2 THE COURT: He hasn't gotten to the question yet.\n3 Go ahead.\n4 Q. Ms. Chen, you sent money to HCHK and Crane, correct?\n5 A. Yes.\n6 (Continued on next page)\n7\n8\n9\n10\n11\n12\n13\n14\n15\n16\n17\n18\n19\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 BY MR. FINKEL:\n2 Q. And what was your understanding of what you would get for\n3 sending money to those two entities?\n4 A. GTV shares.\n5 Q. Would you get anything else in addition?\n6 A. G/Club membership for free.\n7 Q. You can take that down, Ms. Loftus.\n8 Ms. Chen, did you ever join a farm?\n9 A. Yes.\n10 Q. Which one?\n11 A. MOS farm.\n12 Q. Did you volunteer for that farm?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. What were the nature of the work you did as a volunteer for\n15 the MOS farm?\n16 A. My work was to reverify the Himalaya H Coin that was\n17 allocated to each member at ICO price at 10 cent per coin to\n18 confirm if that allocation was accurate.\n19 Q. How many hours did you spend volunteering for the MOS farm?\n20 A. On average about 40 hours a week.\n21 Q. Were you also working at this time?\n22 A. Yes.\n23 Q. Do you have children?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. How did you find time to do all that?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 A. I don't sleep and I take vacation hour from work to do this\n2 volunteer work.\n3 Q. Why did you decide to spend so much time volunteering for\n4 the MOS farm?\n5 A. Because Miles Guo ask us to volunteer. He ask us not just\n6 invest, but also to do volunteer work. And also back then my\n7 H Coin allocation, there's a miscount of my past investment, so\n8 I had concerns of other members' investment could got miscount\n9 for the H Coin they are deserving for.\n10 I know every dollar those fellow followers sent to\n11 Miles Guo are hard earn money, and I don't want them to have\n12 the same situation as me of their hard earn money got sent to\n13 Miles Guo and they're miscounted.\n14 Q. When did you start volunteering for the MOS farm?\n15 A. In March 2022.\n16 Q. When approximately did you stop?\n17 A. March 2023.\n18 Q. Did Miles Guo say where he was located during the various\n19 videos that you watched about him talking about these\n20 investment projects?\n21 A. My understanding is the rooftop condo at the Netherland\n22 Sherry hotel in Manhattan, and also his house in Greenwich,\n23 that house he has bought long time ago.\n24 Q. Ms. Loftus, can you pull up C205 which is in evidence.\n25 While that's being pulled up, Ms. Chen, did you ever see Miles\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 Guo appear in a video with a car?\n2 A. Yes.\n3 Q. What did the car look like?\n4 A. A red color sports car.\n5 Q. What kind of car was it, do you know?\n6 A. I know it's a sports car, looks very expensive, but I don't\n7 know exact what it is.\n8 Q. What did Miles Guo say, if anything, about that car?\n9 A. That's his car.\n10 Q. Can you scroll down a little bit, Ms. Loftus.\n11 Do you recognize the individual in the sunglasses and\n12 the hat?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. Who is it?\n15 A. Miles Guo.\n16 Q. Do you recognize that flag in the back?\n17 A. Yes.\n18 Q. What is it?\n19 A. The flag of New Federal State of China.\n20 Q. Based on what Miles Guo would say in his videos, do you\n21 have an understanding of where this video was recorded from?\n22 A. My understanding this is from the rooftop condo at the\n23 Sherry Netherland, that expensive hotel in Manhattan.\n24 Q. We can take that down. What is G Bank?\n25 A. G Bank is another investment opportunity Miles Guo promoted\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 as the bank that has the digital currency license that can\n2 compliment the Himalaya Exchange to settle between digital\n3 currency and the fiat currency. It is very lucrative, and they\n4 were able to acquire it because William Je is very influential\n5 in the finance world. He has his connections to be able to\n6 allow them to purchase this G Bank successfully.\n7 Q. Did you participate in any video conferences about the G\n8 Bank?\n9 A. Yes.\n10 Q. And was Miles Guo apart of those conferences?\n11 A. Yes.\n12 Q. Was William Je?\n13 A. William Je attended separate Webex call from Miles Guo.\n14 Q. What, if anything, did Miles Guo about G Bank?\n15 A. Miles Guo said the G Bank is the bank that has the digital\n16 currency license. It's very rare to get digital currency\n17 license. It's going to forming the future of the H Coin\n18 Himalaya Exchange ecosystem to compliment it. It's going to be\n19 very lucrative, have a very bright future, and that is the type\n20 of assets you can passing down to your kids and your kids' kids\n21 for many generations. It's a rare opportunity that can only\n22 appear one time in your life. You will become initial\n23 shareholder of the G Bank if you make that investment.\n24 Q. Did Miles Guo mention anything about a casino in the\n25 context of the G Bank?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 A. Yes.\n2 Q. What did he say about a casino?\n3 A. I don't remember clearly what he said, but I think\n4 opportunity presented at the beginning including G Bank and the\n5 casino investment, and later the casino investment didn't go\n6 through, so it dropped.\n7 MS. SHROFF: I didn't get that last part.\n8 MR. FINKEL: Didn't go through so it dropped.\n9 Q. Ms. Chen, what did Miles Guo say, if anything, about\n10 whether he was investing his own money into the G Bank?\n11 A. Miles Guo said the institutional investors have lot of\n12 money to purchase the G Bank. They have already completed the\n13 G Bank acquisition with all the money. They don't need our\n14 money at all. They have way more enough money, that our money\n15 is nothing to the institutional investors he has to acquire the\n16 G Bank.\n17 Q. Did you invest in G Bank?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. How much money did you invest into G Bank?\n20 A. $300,000.\n21 Q. To what entity did you send that $300,000?\n22 A. Hamilton Opportunity Fund.\n23 Q. You ever heard the song, Ms. Chen, H Coin to the Moon?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. Where have you heard it?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 A. I heard it on Gettr. I heard it on Apple Itunes.\n2 Q. Did you purchase it on Apple Itunes?\n3 A. Yes.\n4 Q. How many times did you purchase H Coin to the Moon on Apple\n5 Itunes?\n6 A. About 600 or 700 times.\n7 Q. Why did you purchase it so many times?\n8 A. Because Miles Guo ask us to download many, many times of\n9 this song to boost up the ranking in the Itunes chart.\n10 Q. What do you mean to boost up the ranking in the Itunes\n11 chart?\n12 A. So that it shows the top in Itunes that everyone would know\n13 H Coin to the Moon song.\n14 Q. What did that phrase mean to you, to the moon?\n15 A. Meaning the price will go skyrocketing.\n16 Q. What did Miles Guo say, if anything, in his videos about\n17 H Coin?\n18 A. Miles Guo said H Coin is better than Bitcoin.\n19 Q. What is Bitcoin?\n20 A. Bitcoin is a very valuable cryptocurrency.\n21 Q. What did Miles Guo say H Coin was?\n22 A. A cryptocurrency.\n23 Q. Did Miles Guo mention anything about H Coin being on the\n24 blockchain?\n25 A. Yes.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 Q. What did Miles Guo say, if anything, about H Coin in the\n2 blockchain?\n3 A. Miles Guo said H Coin is the most advance technology of\n4 blockchain. It's better than any current digital currency in\n5 the current markets.\n6 Q. And what impact did those statements about H Coin having\n7 the most advance blockchain technology have on you, if any?\n8 A. That influence my decision of buying H Coin, that make me\n9 believe that H Coin will be very valuable.\n10 Q. What, if anything, did Miles Guo say about whether H Coin\n11 was backed by gold?\n12 A. Miles Guo said H Coin has 20 percent gold as a reserved\n13 backup.\n14 Q. And what impact did those statements that H Coin has a 20\n15 percent gold reserve have on your consideration whether to buy\n16 H Coin?\n17 A. That is critical to me, that sold me the idea that what he\n18 promoted that H Coin is better than Bitcoin. It is going to be\n19 more valuable than Bitcoin because it has a gold reserve while\n20 Bitcoin does not.\n21 Q. What is your understanding of the association, if any,\n22 between the Himalaya Exchange and Miles Guo?\n23 A. Miles Guo created Himalaya Exchange and he owns it.\n24 Q. Did you invest in H Coin?\n25 A. Yes.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 Q. Approximately how much money did you spend purchasing\n2 H Coin?\n3 A. I spent about $530,000 to purchase H Coin.\n4 Q. Why did you decide to purchase H Coin?\n5 A. Because back then Miles Guo said the H Coin will go up to\n6 $100 in a few weeks very soon.\n7 Q. Ms. Chen, if it had turned out that instead of being backed\n8 by gold H Coin was backed by dollars instead of gold, would\n9 that have mattered to you?\n10 A. Of course it matters.\n11 Q. Why?\n12 A. Because if it's only backed by dollars, not the gold, it\n13 means it's not going to be better than Bitcoin. It's not going\n14 to be that valuable. It's not going to be worth me thinking\n15 about making investment in H Coin.\n16 Q. Did Miles Guo say anything about whether investing in\n17 H Coin or H dollar was guaranteed?\n18 A. Miles Guo said about, for people like me that purchase\n19 the H Coin at the very high price, and later on the price drop\n20 to even half or less than half, Miles Guo will compensate for\n21 all their losses we incurred through the purchasing the H Coin.\n22 Q. Did you visit the Himalaya Exchange website?\n23 A. Yes.\n24 Q. Did you see anything called white paper on the Himalaya\n25 Exchange website?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 A. I may have seen that.\n2 Q. Did you read it?\n3 A. I read it.\n4 Q. And what was your understanding of what the white paper\n5 meant?\n6 A. My takeaway from it is there are challenges out there in\n7 current cryptocurrency market.\n8 MS. SHROFF: I'm sorry. Could I have that respond\n9 read back.\n10 (Record was read)\n11 Q. What do you mean by challenges?\n12 A. Challenges about the price of the digital cryptocurrency,\n13 the challenges about the security, the current cryptocurrency\n14 are not that secured, the challenges about the cost, the\n15 current cryptocurrency are costly. So those are the challenges\n16 of the current cryptocurrency in the market, and H Coin is\n17 created to overcome all those challenges. It gone be the most\n18 secured affordable efficient currency that would be the future\n19 of all the cryptocurrency.\n20 Q. When you decided to purchase H Coin, Ms. Chen, did you\n21 think you were purchasing cryptocurrency or credits?\n22 A. I was thinking I was purchasing cryptocurrency.\n23 Q. Were the farms involved in your purchase of H Coin?\n24 A. They are involved when I purchased the H Coin at the ICO,\n25 the initial currency offering at 10 cents per coin.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 Q. What is the H Coin lockup?\n2 A. The H Coin lockup in my understanding is the ICO of the\n3 initial currency offering at 10 cent per coin are locked up for\n4 a period of time, that the fellow followers are not allowed to\n5 sell them.\n6 Q. If we can pull up what's in evidence as VB33. Do you\n7 recognize this, Ms. Chen?\n8 A. Yes.\n9 Q. What is it?\n10 A. That's my Himalaya Exchange account.\n11 Q. What is your understanding, if anything, of why it says\n12 130,000 HDO and zero HCN?\n13 A. That's the balance of my account.\n14 Q. What is your understanding, if any, of the difference\n15 between HDO and HCN?\n16 A. Back then my understanding that HDO is one-to-one to U.S.\n17 dollars, and HCN is the cryptocurrency.\n18 Q. And when you sent money into -- how did you send money into\n19 the Himalaya Exchange?\n20 A. I log into the account and it provide you payment\n21 instructions of the bank account to send the money, and it also\n22 include a reference number that is specifically for me to add\n23 that reference number when I wire the number to that bank\n24 account.\n25 Q. What state were you in when you logged into the Himalaya\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 Exchange to send money?\n2 A. I use the virtual private network, the VPN.\n3 MS. SHROFF: The question was what state she was in.\n4 Move to strike.\n5 THE COURT: If you can answer what state.\n6 A. I live in Virginia.\n7 Q. Were you in Virginia?\n8 A. Yes.\n9 Q. What's a VPN?\n10 A. Virtual private network.\n11 Q. Why did you use a VPN to log into the Himalaya Exchange?\n12 A. Because Miles Guo ask us to VPN to log into Himalaya\n13 Exchange.\n14 Q. What is your understanding Miles Guo asked you to use a VPN\n15 to log into the Himalaya Exchange from the United States?\n16 A. Because my understanding is I need to log in from a country\n17 outside of US to get into the Himalaya Exchange account.\n18 Q. When you sent money to the Himalaya Exchange, did you think\n19 you were buying H dollar or H Coin?\n20 A. I send in U.S. dollars that become equivalent HDO, and I\n21 use HDO to purchase HCN.\n22 Q. You can take that down. If we can put up Z10 at page two.\n23 Ms. Chen, what did Miles Guo say, if anything, about\n24 A10?\n25 A. Miles Guo promoted another investment called A10. I don't\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 understand what it is. Miles Guo said it include five percent\n2 of Gettr and five percent of Himalaya Exchange.\n3 Q. If you can just scroll up a little bit, Ms. Loftus, just to\n4 the date.\n5 When you first learned about A10, in what manner did\n6 you first learn about A10?\n7 A. Sorry. When you ask me what matters?\n8 Q. How did you first learn about A10?\n9 A. Miles Guo broadcasting video on Gettr.\n10 Q. After learning about A10, Ms. Chen, what impact did that\n11 have on you?\n12 A. When he promoted A10, I'm confused.\n13 Q. Why?\n14 A. Because why is another investment. It feels to me that\n15 just keep asking us to give money to investment, just keep\n16 draining out our pocket, is always giving, giving, investment,\n17 investment, but where is the return? Why keeping giving money\n18 out? When is the money coming in as a return?\n19 Q. Did you invest in the A10?\n20 A. No.\n21 Q. Did you try to get your money back from the other\n22 investments that you had made from Miles Guo's videos?\n23 A. Yes.\n24 Q. What steps did you take to try to get your money back?\n25 A. For the G Bank investment, I contacted the farm manager of\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 Hamilton Opportunity Fund David Fallon.\n2 Q. And what did David Fallon tell you, if anything?\n3 A. David Fallon did not respond. His lawyer in UK James\n4 responded to me.\n5 Q. What did James say?\n6 A. James said.\n7 MS. SHROFF: All of this is hearsay.\n8 THE COURT: Overruled. You may answer.\n9 A. Sorry.\n10 Q. You can answer, what did James said?\n11 A. Jim said your money is part of the DOJ freeze order.\n12 Q. And what response did you have to that, if anything?\n13 A. My response is, I don't believe so because I sending the\n14 money back in January 2022. The money was not frozen till\n15 September 2022. There are eight months in between the time I\n16 send in the money till the time the money is frozen. I believe\n17 there are money outflows. The money I sent to the account is\n18 no longer in that account when DOJ freeze that account.\n19 Q. Did you try to get your money back from G/Club?\n20 A. I contact G/Club for refund.\n21 Q. What did G/Club tell you?\n22 A. The G/Club customer services provided me an email address\n23 to contact the legal department of G/Club.\n24 Q. Did you contact that email address?\n25 A. I contact the email address and completed the forms that\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 requested to cancel the G/Club membership.\n2 Q. What did G/Club tell you, if anything?\n3 A. G/Club legal team did not respond to my request at all.\n4 Q. Did you contact anyone else trying to get your money back?\n5 A. I contacted Mulan to ask about the G Bank investment.\n6 Q. What did Mulan tell you?\n7 A. Mulan told me that my money is frozen as part of the DOJ\n8 order.\n9 Q. Did you try to redeem and get cash out of the Himalaya\n10 Exchange?\n11 A. Yes.\n12 Q. What happened then?\n13 A. I request a redemption I believe back in May 2023, and two\n14 months later I receive a notice that the request is canceled,\n15 no more redemption.\n16 Q. You can take that down, Ms. Loftus.\n17 Ms. Chen, did Miles Guo ever talk in his videos about\n18 being targeted by the Chinese Communist Party, the CCP?\n19 A. Yes.\n20 Q. What, if anything, would he say about being targeted by the\n21 CCP?\n22 A. He said he's a target.\n23 Q. Did you invest in the Miles Guo investments because he said\n24 he was being targeted by the CCP?\n25 A. No.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 Q. Why did you invest in the Miles Guo's investments?\n2 A. Because I want to make money. He promise huge return with\n3 no risk.\n4 Q. Of the money that you invested, how much have you gotten\n5 back?\n6 A. I got back the SEC fair fund distribution about 180,000 or\n7 something.\n8 Q. In total how much money did you invest?\n9 A. I invest almost 1.3 million.\n10 Q. So how much are you still owed?\n11 A. About 1.1 million.\n12 MS. SHROFF: Objection to the word \"owed.\"\n13 THE COURT: Overruled.\n14 Q. Ms. Chen, if it were true that Miles Guo was targeted by\n15 the CCP, would you still want your $1.1 million back?\n16 A. Yes.\n17 Q. If it were true that Miles Guo was targeted by the CCP,\n18 does that change your view on whether you're still owed $1.1\n19 million?\n20 A. No, it would not change my view.\n21 Q. What does Miles Guo's being targeted -- withdrawn.\n22 Ms. Chen, does the fact that the CCP may have targeted\n23 Miles Guo, what impact, if any, does that have on your\n24 experience investing in the Miles Guo projects?\n25 A. It has no impact. Fraud is a fraud. It has no impact with\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 anything else.\n2 Q. If it's true that Miles Guo was targeted by the CCP, does\n3 it make what he did to you okay?\n4 MS. SHROFF: Objection, assumes facts not in evidence.\n5 THE COURT: Overruled. You may answer.\n6 THE WITNESS: Sorry, am I answer or --\n7 THE COURT: Yes, you answer.\n8 A. Can you repeat the question. And I couldn't hear that\n9 attorney very well. Do you mind putting the mic closer to you.\n10 MS. SHROFF: Most people don't have trouble not\n11 hearing me, but, sure. I objected and the judge overruled my\n12 objection.\n13 A. Okay, then, I got distracted. Do you mind repeating the\n14 question again.\n15 Q. No problem. Ms. Chen, if it is true that Miles Guo was\n16 targeted by the CCP, does that make what he did to you okay?\n17 A. No, he damaged my life.\n18 Q. How so?\n19 A. He lied to me by --\n20 THE COURT: All right. I have to interrupt now. I\n21 have told the members of the audience I do not want laughing.\n22 I do not want noise. You must be respectful in this courtroom\n23 or I will have you ejected. Go ahead, please. You were\n24 answering. I interrupted. You can read back what she has\n25 already stated.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Direct\n1 (Record was read)\n2 A. Miles Guo lied to me and gain my trust by emphasizing and\n3 repeating over and over again that he's very honest,\n4 trustworthy person. He never lied. He brainwash me into\n5 believing him by telling his story that made me believe that\n6 he's a very nice, kind, carrying person. He lied to me to make\n7 me believe that he cares about me as his sister. He lied to me\n8 to make me believe that he's willing to share his wealth with\n9 me as his sister.\n10 And he took advantage of my hope, of my hope for\n11 providing a better life for my older parents and young children\n12 by promising huge returns with zero risk. He depicted a\n13 beautiful future for my family that deceived me in giving all\n14 my money, all my hard earned money and all my hard saved money\n15 to him to pay for his families, his daughters, his sons, lavish\n16 and extravagant life. Miles Guo is a liar. He's a cheater.\n17 He's shameless and heartless cheater and fraudster.\n18 Q. Do you see Miles Guo in the courtroom here today?\n19 MS. SHROFF: Your Honor, I stipulate Mr. Guo is seated\n20 to my left.\n21 THE COURT: All right.\n22 Q. Is that Miles Guo?\n23 A. Yes.\n24 MR. FINKEL: Nothing further.\n25 THE COURT: Cross-examination.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 CROSS-EXAMINATION\n2 BY MS. SHROFF:\n3 Q. Good afternoon, Ms. Chen.\n4 A. Good afternoon.\n5 Q. How are you?\n6 A. I'm good. How are you?\n7 Q. I'm a little tired, but let's see.\n8 Ms. Chen, could you tell the ladies and gentlemen of\n9 this jury who is IvyIvy6538?\n10 A. That's my nickname at MOS farm.\n11 Q. Let me show you --\n12 MR. FINKEL: Your Honor, can we approach for a moment?\n13 THE COURT: Yes.\n14 (Continued on next page)\n15\n16\n17\n18\n19\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 (At sidebar)\n2 MR. FINKEL: Maybe this isn't an issue, but especially\n3 in light of what's been happening in the gallery today. I\n4 certainly hope that Ms. Shroff is not just going to go through\n5 personal identifying information of the victim from the witness\n6 which would be inappropriate and just a way to harass her. So\n7 I raise this only at sidebar to make sure there will be nothing\n8 else in terms of her personal identifying information.\n9 THE COURT: I feel confident that she would not do\n10 that. Isn't that correct, Ms. Shroff?\n11 MS. SHROFF: I should hope so, your Honor. I have\n12 deep respect for the Court's ruling, and I'm happy to lay out\n13 what I was trying to do. What I was going to do is show the\n14 handles that she used during the time that she was active in\n15 the community. And before I forget, I just want to say that\n16 what the audience does, we don't have control over. There are\n17 certain people in this audience that we have specifically\n18 asked, do not be here, for example. We've even tried to\n19 communicate with those people's lawyers that they should not be\n20 here. So to attribute anything to us is really, I don't know\n21 where that's going, but I'm just putting it out there. We're\n22 not friends. We have no control over who's in the audience.\n23 Let me get back to Ivy. Ivy is a handle that she\n24 used. I'm going to show her a photo of the handle. I'm also\n25 going to show her the photo of the handle of her husband. The\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 government knows this because the government has emails from\n2 somebody name All Well. I plan to show a handle photo of\n3 somebody named Octopus. I plan to show a photo of somebody\n4 name Faithfully. They're open handles. I'm never going to ask\n5 her if she's XXXXX. I don't intend to ask her that. I have no\n6 intention of helping the jury feel sympathetic for her. That's\n7 not my role. I think all of this is proper cross-examination.\n8 And if the government doesn't know of these handles, I\n9 apologize, but that's not my responsibility.\n10 MR. FINKEL: First, before I forget, we ask that we\n11 seal the answer of her name XXXXX and just put the witness.\n12 MS. SHROFF: That's fine. You can just take out the\n13 name from the sidebar. I do note this, your Honor, her last\n14 name is Chen. When the jury was picked, XXXXX was one of the\n15 names we cited. If somebody really wanted to put two and two\n16 together, it's not going to take a rocket scientist to do that.\n17 MR. FINKEL: We don't have to help people do it. We\n18 should protect the victims. They have a statutory right to\n19 such protection.\n20 THE COURT: It's also an extremely common name.\n21 MR. FINKEL: If I could respond to what Ms. Shroff\n22 said?\n23 THE COURT: Go ahead.\n24 MR. FINKEL: I don't think there's any relevance of\n25 going through the various handles that she used with the farms\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 about which she is now testifying and telling things about what\n2 happened in the farms. It should be excluded because it's just\n3 designed to harass the witness. It's entirely fine for\n4 Ms. Shroff to say, Did you use handles? Did you use different\n5 log-in names, and I suspect the answer to those questions would\n6 be yes. If she wants to put Fay Fay's user name in front of\n7 her, fine. If she wants to put Octopus's name in front of her,\n8 fine. And make the point, I'm sure it's a very important one,\n9 that she used handles just like Octopus and Fay Fay. But to\n10 use the specific names that this witness used, which I think is\n11 in our 3500. It says that she's nervous about being found out\n12 of her handles. And in fact --\n13 MS. SHROFF: There's no such thing.\n14 MR. FINKEL: Please don't interrupt me. Your Honor\n15 may recall that in one of the bank records it said MOS, and\n16 there is a line redacted. The line redacted was her MOS, her\n17 Mountain of Spices ID number because she doesn't want the\n18 Mountain of Spices people to go after her, like they went after\n19 Luc Despins and his daughter and his son-in-law. And so I\n20 object to the use of these user names and questioning as to\n21 specificity because it was just designed to harass this victim.\n22 MS. SHROFF: It is not.\n23 THE COURT: Let me understand something, are you\n24 saying that all of these user names are associated with her?\n25 MR. FINKEL: I don't know, but apparently Ms. Shroff\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 believes that these two user names are associated with her.\n2 It's not the association that Ms. Shroff is trying to draw out\n3 based on what she just represented to your Honor, it's the\n4 point that she used user names as opposed to her true name. So\n5 that point is fine to make and it could be made in a generic\n6 fashion and have the same dramatic impact on the jury as using\n7 the specific ones.\n8 THE COURT: How is it that you know that these fake\n9 names will enable members of the public to identify her?\n10 MR. FINKEL: Because that's how the community knows\n11 her, in the same way that the community knew Ya Li as Mulan.\n12 The community knows her by this identity. And I know it is her\n13 identity because Ms. Shroff asked the question and she said\n14 yes. And I suspect that there's going to be a slew of this.\n15 This is the government's objection. If we're overruled, we're\n16 overruled. That's fine. But this is a point that we felt is\n17 important to make.\n18 MS. SHROFF: May I just clarify?\n19 THE COURT: Yes.\n20 MS. SHROFF: So the handler is linked to the name\n21 under which she is testifying. She's testifying under her own\n22 name, right?\n23 MR. FINKEL: Yes.\n24 MS. SHROFF: That's what it's linked to. She engages\n25 with people under that handle. She sends out text under that\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 handle. She sends out emails with that handle. She filled out\n2 her volunteer hours with that handle. She talks to H Coin\n3 people with that handle, and I intend to very properly march\n4 through that evidence with this witness. I will never say that\n5 this person is associated with XXXXX, which is what the Court\n6 prescribe me from doing.\n7 THE COURT: Is there anything that links any of those\n8 names to XXXXX?\n9 MR. FINKEL: Your Honor, I'm not sure. That's the\n10 candid answer. What I do know is that the community uses these\n11 handles to identify people, and that's how they find people.\n12 That's how all this works. That's how the enterprise is\n13 structured. Everyone is known by Fay Fay or Feather or Octopus\n14 or Saturn or what have you. If Ms. Shroff wants to put\n15 specific statements to her, okay. But to go through each and\n16 every ID we object because we think that's harassment.\n17 THE COURT: How many IDs do you think that she has?\n18 MS. SHROFF: I don't think she has more than Ivy Ivy\n19 and the number. That's her ID. That's how she communicated\n20 with her everyone, and it's not linked through the name XXXXX.\n21 I have exhibits to show her with that ID, and I have exhibits\n22 to show her with that handle. That is her handle. She also\n23 uses multiple Gmail accounts, right. So the government has\n24 literally redacted the entire account. We ask that at least it\n25 make clear, the document make clear, that she's copied on the\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 email. They refused, so I don't care that her actual email\n2 shows. Some of the evidence, the truthfulness of the evidence\n3 is, she got a copy of that document.\n4 THE COURT: So what I understand you to be saying is\n5 that you want to ask whether she goes by a particular handle,\n6 one handle?\n7 MS. SHROFF: That's it, one handle.\n8 THE COURT: You also want to ask whether she is really\n9 affiliated with other handles?\n10 MS. SHROFF: No, her interactions with the other\n11 handles.\n12 THE COURT: I find that to be acceptable.\n13 (Continued on next page)\n14\n15\n16\n17\n18\n19\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 (In open court)\n2 THE COURT: Go ahead.\n3 BY MS. SHROFF:\n4 Q. I was asking you about IvyIvy 6538, correct?\n5 A. Yes.\n6 Q. Is that a handle you use, ma'am?\n7 A. That's just a nickname that I had for the MOS farm\n8 registration.\n9 Q. And did you tell the government about that MOS farm\n10 registration that you used?\n11 A. I did not.\n12 Q. Let's pull it up just for the government and the witness,\n13 please. Do you recognize Defense Exhibit 7010?\n14 A. That's my discord registration.\n15 MS. SHROFF: Your Honor, the offense moves DX-7010\n16 into evidence.\n17 MR. FINKEL: I object for the reasons described at\n18 sidebar.\n19 THE COURT: It is admitted.\n20 (Defendant's Exhibit 7010 received in evidence)\n21 MS. SHROFF: If I could publish to the jury.\n22 Q. Who is All Well 5921?\n23 A. That's my husband discord registration number.\n24 Q. And let me show you DX7011. Do you recognize that\n25 document?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 A. Yeah.\n2 Q. Is that DX7008?\n3 A. Yes.\n4 Q. And what do you recognize it to be?\n5 A. That's my husband's discord registration number as being\n6 are registering on any social media platform they use a\n7 nickname.\n8 MS. SHROFF: And we move DX-7008 into evidence.\n9 MR. FINKEL: Your Honor, can we approach?\n10 THE COURT: All righty.\n11 (Continued on next page)\n12\n13\n14\n15\n16\n17\n18\n19\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 (At the sidebar)\n2 MR. FINKEL: Your Honor, I'm sorry to belabor this,\n3 but this is different from what Ms. Shroff had told your Honor.\n4 MS. SHROFF: Those are the two handles.\n5 MR. FINKEL: Ms. Shroff is doxing this witness. What\n6 this community does in this enterprise is they attack people\n7 online, on Twitter, on Discord and other social media channels.\n8 She's putting into evidence just the handle to make it a point\n9 so all the people in the courtroom and everyone else know how\n10 to go after her and her husband. This is entirely\n11 inappropriate. This has nothing to do with the reasons that\n12 Ms. Shroff articulated here at the sidebar just a moment ago.\n13 This is pure harassment and doxing.\n14 THE COURT: Mr. Finkel, if I don't let her confront\n15 this witness and you get a conviction, it's going to get\n16 overturn. She needs to be able to confront the witness. She\n17 has come here freely. She's stated her name. You may go\n18 forward.\n19 (Continued on next page)\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 (In open court)\n2 MS. SHROFF: And we move 7008 into evidence.\n3 THE COURT: It is admitted.\n4 (Defendant's Exhibit 7008 received in evidence)\n5 BY MS. SHROFF:\n6 Q. And may we publish to the jury.\n7 Ms. Chen, do you know somebody named Octopus?\n8 A. Yes.\n9 Q. And who is she?\n10 A. She's the current farm owner of MOS farm.\n11 Q. And let me show you what is marked as Defense Exhibit 7011.\n12 Do you recognize that document?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. And what is it?\n15 A. That's Octopus's discord information.\n16 MS. SHROFF: And we like to move 7011 into evidence.\n17 MR. FINKEL: No objection.\n18 THE COURT: It is admitted.\n19 (Defendant's Exhibit 7011 received in evidence)\n20 BY MS. SHROFF:\n21 Q. Could you tell the members of the jury who is Faith Night?\n22 A. Faith Night is working at MOS farm.\n23 Q. And let me show what you is marked as DX7009. Do you\n24 recognize that?\n25 A. Yes.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. Is that the handle for Ms. Faith Night?\n2 A. Yes, discord registration information.\n3 MS. SHROFF: And we like to move DX7009 into evidence\n4 and publish it to the jury.\n5 MR. FINKEL: No objection.\n6 THE COURT: It is admitted.\n7 (Defendant's Exhibit 7009 received in evidence)\n8 BY MS. SHROFF:\n9 Q. Can you tell me who Fay Fay is?\n10 A. Fay Fay is someone who is also part of the movement.\n11 Q. And how about Little Sarah?\n12 A. Same here, also part of the movement.\n13 Q. And, Ms. Chen, did you interact with Octopus?\n14 A. When you say interact, do you mean I communicated with her?\n15 Q. Did you talk to her over Discord?\n16 A. Yes, I talk to her over Discord.\n17 Q. How about Faith Night?\n18 A. Yes, I talk to her over Discord.\n19 Q. And we're going to come back to that, but you were in a\n20 group with them, correct?\n21 A. I explain earlier I was doing volunteer work.\n22 Q. We will come back to that too, but those are the three\n23 people who were in the group with you, right?\n24 A. In volunteer work, there are certain aspects that I\n25 communicate to them about my volunteer work.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. We'll come back to that. Let's just talk for a moment\n2 about your background.\n3 You testified on direct that you came to the United\n4 States, was it in 2007?\n5 A. Yes.\n6 Q. And you were a student in China before you came, correct?\n7 A. Yes.\n8 Q. You studied at the Shanghai Institute of Foreign Trade,\n9 correct?\n10 A. Yes.\n11 Q. And you studied international business, correct?\n12 A. That's not correct.\n13 Q. Well, tell me what did you study?\n14 A. I studied English.\n15 Q. And did you then study and have a business education?\n16 A. So when you say I studied and have a business education, do\n17 you mean I came to the U.S. for the business education or can\n18 you clarify?\n19 Q. Sure. Did you have any studies in business while you were\n20 a student in China?\n21 A. I studied English and it's considered business English.\n22 Q. And did you also study accounting while you were in China?\n23 A. No, I did not.\n24 Q. And then you graduated from Shanghai Institute of Foreign\n25 Trade in 2006, correct?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 A. Yes.\n2 Q. You graduated with honors, correct?\n3 A. Yes.\n4 Q. And you worked in China for a year following graduation,\n5 right?\n6 A. Yes.\n7 Q. You worked as an internal audit analyst; is that right?\n8 A. No, that's not correct.\n9 Q. You tell me in what capacity you worked?\n10 A. I worked as assistant.\n11 Q. Assisted to what?\n12 A. To a department manager back then.\n13 Q. And was that at Huntsman Polyurethanes in Shanghai?\n14 A. Yes.\n15 Q. And you stayed there until July of 2007, correct?\n16 A. Yes.\n17 Q. What did you do for Huntsman?\n18 A. I was doing some assistant type of job.\n19 Q. Did it include accounting?\n20 A. No.\n21 Q. You came to the United States in 2007, right?\n22 A. Yes.\n23 Q. And you attended Louisiana State University; is that right?\n24 A. Yes.\n25 Q. You came here for graduate school, correct?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 A. Yes.\n2 Q. Were you a full scholarship student, Ms. Chen?\n3 MR. FINKEL: Object to relevance.\n4 THE COURT: You may answer.\n5 A. Yes.\n6 Q. You were part of the MBA program at LSU, correct?\n7 A. Yes.\n8 Q. You graduated with a masters in business administration,\n9 correct?\n10 A. Yes.\n11 Q. Your specialization while you attended school and got an\n12 MBA was internal auditing, correct?\n13 A. That's correct.\n14 Q. Your husband has a Ph.D. in computer science, correct?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 Q. And he has a Ph.D. from a university in the United States,\n17 correct?\n18 A. That's correct.\n19 Q. And you are presently employed, correct?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. You work at a bank, correct?\n22 A. Yes.\n23 Q. And after LSU and before you started working at this bank,\n24 you worked at Deloitte, correct?\n25 A. Yes.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. What is Deloitte?\n2 A. It's one of the Big Four accounting firms.\n3 Q. And what did you do for them?\n4 A. I do consulting work.\n5 Q. Did you do risk assessment as a consultant?\n6 A. I do advisory on the processing improvement and risk\n7 management related work.\n8 Q. Let's break that down. Did you have experience in insuring\n9 compliance at Deloitte?\n10 A. No.\n11 Q. Did you have expertise in assessing risk when you worked at\n12 Deloitte?\n13 MR. FINKEL: Scope, relevance, cumulative.\n14 THE COURT: Overruled. You can answer.\n15 A. Can you repeat that question.\n16 Q. While you worked at Deloitte and you were there until 2011,\n17 correct?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. Was part of your job duties assessing risk?\n20 A. It's helping the clients managing the risk.\n21 Q. And what is it that you mean when you say helping clients\n22 manage risk?\n23 Describe your job for the jury?\n24 A. So the clients that I work for, they may have different\n25 risk out there, so my job is to helping them to identify what\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 those risk are and be able to prioritize in managing them.\n2 Q. And these are the risk of investment, correct?\n3 A. Of course not.\n4 Q. Well, you tell me what risk you're helping them evaluate?\n5 A. So the client that have was in oil and gas company.\n6 Q. I'm sorry.\n7 A. The client I have is in oil and gas industry, so there are\n8 potential operational risk, and this is where I'm helping them\n9 to evaluate.\n10 Q. You help them evaluate financial risk and --\n11 A. Operational risk.\n12 Q. Operational risk. And after that you worked as a senior\n13 auditor, correct?\n14 A. Yes.\n15 Q. And you worked as a senior auditor -- and can you just tell\n16 the jury generally what a senior auditor does?\n17 A. The auditor will go to the business, asking for the\n18 processes, how it works to pinpoint the potential risk; and\n19 then from there identify the controls and then develop an audit\n20 plan to audit the business processes.\n21 Q. And part of your job duties was to right out that process,\n22 correct?\n23 A. Yes.\n24 Q. And then you testified you now work at a bank, right?\n25 A. Yes.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. And what is your job title at the bank?\n2 A. I'm manager.\n3 Q. Manager of what?\n4 A. Of risk.\n5 Q. Of compliance risk, correct?\n6 A. Yes.\n7 Q. So your exact title is you're the manager of compliant\n8 risk, right?\n9 A. Yes.\n10 Q. How many people do you manage?\n11 A. I manage five people.\n12 Q. And part of your job includes conducting annual compliance\n13 risk assessments, correct?\n14 A. Yes.\n15 Q. And there is a process to conducting annual compliance risk\n16 assessment, isn't there?\n17 A. Yes.\n18 Q. And to do the work that you do, you have to pay attention\n19 to detail, correct?\n20 MR. FINKEL: Objection, the Court has made a ruling on\n21 this issue.\n22 THE COURT: Ms. Shroff, I want you to be mindful of my\n23 ruling, please.\n24 MS. SHROFF: I'm simply asking what her processes is.\n25 Q. To do your assessment, regardless of where you do it, and\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 please don't tell me where, you have to assess operational\n2 risk, correct?\n3 MR. FINKEL: It's an objection, and asked and\n4 answered.\n5 THE COURT: Asked and answered.\n6 Q. And you have to idea responsible parties, correct?\n7 MR. FINKEL: Objection, Court's ruling.\n8 THE COURT: I'm going to allow this. Go ahead.\n9 A. When you say identify responsible party, can you clarify\n10 what are you asking me?\n11 Q. Which parties are undertaking the risk?\n12 A. That's not necessarily my job. That's not my job.\n13 Q. Okay. Is it your job to review related policies?\n14 A. No, that's not my job.\n15 Q. How about to set procedures in place?\n16 A. That's not my job.\n17 Q. How about to consider audits?\n18 A. That's not my job.\n19 Q. How about to evaluate reports?\n20 A. That's not my job.\n21 Q. How is it, would you tell the jury, that you ensure that\n22 compliance controls are in place?\n23 MR. FINKEL: Objection, relevance, Court's ruling.\n24 THE COURT: I'll allow the answer. Go ahead.\n25 A. The assessment we do is more top down risk assessment\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 coming from the enterprise level to identify what are the top\n2 risk out there, so it does not involve the processes you just\n3 spoke about.\n4 Q. Well, you tell me what processes are involved?\n5 A. I have explained. It's a top down risk assessment.\n6 Q. And what is the risk that you're evaluating?\n7 MR. FINKEL: Objection, relevance.\n8 THE COURT: You may answer.\n9 A. Evaluating the risk of consumer compliance from the\n10 consumer protection bureaus to protect the customers from\n11 potentially being deceived into the bank practice.\n12 Q. Thank you. Is it also part of your job to create a plan of\n13 action?\n14 A. No.\n15 Q. And how about to make recommendations as to how compliance\n16 can improve?\n17 A. No.\n18 Q. And for how long have you been doing this work, Ms. Chen?\n19 A. For about 14 or 15 years.\n20 Q. You testified on direct, correct, that you first heard of\n21 Miles Guo in 2017, right?\n22 A. Yes.\n23 Q. And before you heard of Miles Guo, your husband, you\n24 testified, was listening to the videos of Miles Guo; is that\n25 right?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 A. Yes.\n2 Q. And when Miles Guo's videos were being watched by your\n3 husband, did he tell you what about his videos interested your\n4 husband?\n5 MR. FINKEL: Objection, hearsay.\n6 MS. SHROFF: I'm not offering it for the truth.\n7 THE COURT: You may answer.\n8 A. Talk about bringing American value of China.\n9 Q. I'm sorry.\n10 A. Talk about bringing American value to China.\n11 Q. In 2017, was Mr. Miles Guo talking about bringing American\n12 values to China?\n13 A. That's what my husband told me.\n14 Q. Do you know if in 2017 Mr. Guo was talking about\n15 disinformation coming from the CCP?\n16 MR. FINKEL: Objection.\n17 THE COURT: You may answer.\n18 A. I did not watch back then. I don't know.\n19 Q. When you first started listening to Mr. Guo, do you recall\n20 him talking about corruption in China?\n21 A. I did.\n22 Q. And did you hear about him talking about the lack of\n23 freedom in China?\n24 A. I don't remember.\n25 Q. Do you remember if he talked about the lack of property\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 rights in China?\n2 A. I don't remember.\n3 Q. Do you remember if he talked about the lack of choice in\n4 China?\n5 A. I don't remember.\n6 Q. Do you recall if his videos talked about how one could not\n7 choose their own jobs in China?\n8 MR. FINKEL: Same objection.\n9 THE COURT: Overruled. You may answer.\n10 A. I don't remember.\n11 Q. In what year, Ms. Chen, did you start listening to Miles\n12 Guo's videos?\n13 A. End of 2018.\n14 Q. And I'm not going to go through the whole list with you,\n15 but were any of those topics that I mentioned before topics\n16 that you recall in 2018?\n17 A. It's been so long, I don't remember.\n18 Q. Do you ever recall Mr. Guo talking about the state of\n19 affairs in Hong Kong?\n20 A. I think so.\n21 Q. And what do you recall him saying about Hong Kong?\n22 A. I don't remember.\n23 Q. Sitting here today, Ms. Chen, would you agree that speaking\n24 against the CCP whether in 2017 or in 2024 is risky?\n25 A. You're asking my opinion?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. Yes, ma'am.\n2 A. If it's risky?\n3 Q. Yes, ma'am.\n4 A. I don't know.\n5 Q. And when you were interacting on Discord -- you know what.\n6 I'll withdraw that.\n7 You decided at some point to join what is called the\n8 whistleblower movement, correct?\n9 A. I join the farm in 2022.\n10 Q. And before you joined the farm in 2022, is it your\n11 understanding that you did not join any movement at all?\n12 A. So I ask -- can you clarify that question in a simple way?\n13 Q. I'll try it this way. What was your first step towards the\n14 whistleblower movement?\n15 A. My first step towards the whistle -- I have nothing to do\n16 with the whistleblower movement.\n17 Q. Did you have anything to do with the goals of the Rules Of\n18 Law Foundation?\n19 A. I donated money.\n20 Q. I was asking you about the goals of the Rule of Law\n21 Foundation, were you familiar with that?\n22 A. My understanding is helping the people that needs help.\n23 Q. And with that understanding, did you know if Rules of Law\n24 Foundation helped bring people to the United States from China?\n25 A. That I don't know.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. Do you know if they helped people in the Ukraine war?\n2 A. That is my understanding, so I donated money for that help.\n3 Q. And how about providing Covid mask and other mask to\n4 people?\n5 A. That part I'm not sure.\n6 Q. Now, you donated money to Rule of Law Foundation, correct?\n7 A. Yes.\n8 Q. How much did you donate?\n9 A. About $30,000.\n10 Q. And do you recall what year you donated in?\n11 A. So it's between 2020 and 2022.\n12 Q. Well, let's talk about that. In 2020, how much did you\n13 donate according to you?\n14 A. My husband donated a couple of hundred dollars.\n15 Q. 400 to be precise, right?\n16 A. I said a couple of hundred. I don't remember exactly how\n17 much he donated.\n18 Q. How much did you donate in 2020?\n19 A. Back then it's a joint donation.\n20 Q. How about in 2021?\n21 A. I don't remember, maybe also a couple of hundred dollars.\n22 Q. And how about in 2022?\n23 A. About $30,000.\n24 Q. And you donated that in September of 2022, correct?\n25 A. That's correct.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. And before you made that donation, you familiarized\n2 yourself with who was on the board of the Rule of Law\n3 Foundation, correct?\n4 A. No, I don't know who's on the board of the Rule of Law\n5 Foundation.\n6 Q. So you did not check the Rule of Law Foundation website?\n7 A. I just open the website, and I don't know where to find the\n8 board of directors and I don't think that matters to me at that\n9 point.\n10 Q. It did not matter to you who was part of the foundation?\n11 A. You said the board of directors specifically, right?\n12 Q. Yes.\n13 A. At that time?\n14 Q. The board did not matter?\n15 A. When you say at that time, what time are you referring to?\n16 Can you clarify?\n17 Q. When you made the $30,000 donation in September of 2022.\n18 A. I did not check who is the board of directors when I made\n19 that investment back in September 2022.\n20 Q. Well, let's shift courses if we may, and let's talk about\n21 the GTV investment that you testified here on direct testimony.\n22 Okay.\n23 A. Okay.\n24 Q. Now, was it your husband who first decided to invest in GTV\n25 or was it you?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 A. It's a joint decision.\n2 Q. And was it a joint decision from the very first moment?\n3 A. Yes.\n4 Q. And would it be fair to say that you heard of the private\n5 placement for GTV in April of 2020?\n6 A. Yes.\n7 Q. And would it also be fair to say that you and your husband\n8 were involved in the full process of the investment?\n9 A. Yes.\n10 Q. And you understood at the time that you were evaluating\n11 investing in GTV that the private placement was scheduled to\n12 close on June 2 of 2020, correct?\n13 A. So you say evaluate to investing, so meaning I was\n14 assessing? Can you clarify that question?\n15 Q. You tell me if you assessed.\n16 A. We trusted Miles Guo so we invested.\n17 Q. So you did not assess anything other than the trust you had\n18 in Miles Guo, that's your testimony?\n19 A. We trusted Miles Guo said about what the GTV would look\n20 like, and we read the documents and confirmed what Miles Guo\n21 said would be its competitors and what they're going to use the\n22 money for.\n23 Q. Finish your answer, please. Sorry.\n24 A. I was not sure what you were asking, that's why I was\n25 trying to make sure I understand what you're asking there.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. Let me try again. You first heard about GTV more than a\n2 month before you invested, correct?\n3 A. Yes.\n4 Q. And you told Mr. Finkel that, right, that you had a whole\n5 month to talk about it with your husband between the time you\n6 heard about GTV and the time that you actually invested in GTV,\n7 correct?\n8 A. I did not say that. I think what happened is, there's a\n9 process it takes to be approved for a GTV investor, so there is\n10 certain criteria you have to meet to be able to get the payment\n11 information because it was considered privileged. Miles said\n12 you have to meet certain requirement to be allowed for this\n13 investment, and that requirement validation took about that\n14 much time to be validated to be approved.\n15 Q. So it took a whole month from the start of the application\n16 for you to be approved, correct?\n17 A. For us to obtain the bank account information.\n18 Q. So it took a month, right?\n19 A. That's long time ago. If you say it's a month, about a\n20 month.\n21 Q. Let's see if we can help you out. Let me show you what is\n22 3602-30 at page two, and just for Ms. Chen over there. Please\n23 just only for the witness. Okay.\n24 MR. FINKEL: Is there a failure of recollection?\n25 MS. SHROFF: That's what she said.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. Does that document refresh your recollection about a month\n2 passing between -- you know what, I'll leave you to read the\n3 document and then ask my question.\n4 A. Is this --\n5 Q. The only question, ma'am, is if this document refreshes\n6 your recollection?\n7 THE COURT: As to the time period?\n8 MS. SHROFF: As to the timing, your Honor.\n9 THE COURT: Don't read from it, just say whether this\n10 helps you remember.\n11 A. You mean about the month, is that what you ask me, about\n12 the month?\n13 As I explain, you have a process between you heard\n14 about the ATO. You are able to obtain a bank account, send the\n15 money, so that's about a month.\n16 Q. And for that month you were waiting for information to come\n17 to you, correct?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. Nobody from GTV was blasting you and saying we've sent you\n20 documents, get back to us, right?\n21 A. There is a deadline about the investment.\n22 Q. My question wasn't whether there was a deadline. My\n23 question was whether anybody from GTV contacted you and said\n24 where is your application?\n25 A. You're asking me --\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. If you could please listen to my question.\n2 Did anyone from GTV investments ask you where is your\n3 application? For the month that you were waiting, did GTV\n4 reach out to you?\n5 MR. FINKEL: I object to the form. What people from\n6 GTV investments. What does that mean?\n7 THE COURT: Overruled. You may answer.\n8 A. I'm sorry. I still don't quite understand. You're asking\n9 are there any people from GTV investment contact me about my\n10 application or --\n11 Q. Yes.\n12 A. Yeah, there are people contact me about an application.\n13 Q. And which people were those?\n14 A. So the broadcasting said about reaching out --\n15 Q. No. No. Which people at GTV investment?\n16 MR. FINKEL: Ms. Shroff should not interrupt the\n17 witness.\n18 THE COURT: Let her answer.\n19 Q. Did you understand my question, Ms. Chen?\n20 A. Sorry, I think for this question, are there any people from\n21 GTV investment contacting me?\n22 Q. The company.\n23 A. Company contacting me?\n24 Q. Yes.\n25 A. So Miles Guo contacted us.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. Miles Guo never contacted you, correct?\n2 A. Miles Guo contacted my husband.\n3 Q. You do not know if Miles Guo contacted your husband,\n4 correct? You were not part of that contact, right?\n5 A. My husband --\n6 Q. You only know --\n7 THE COURT: You have to allow her to answer. You\n8 cannot talk over her. Allow her to answer. Go ahead.\n9 A. My husband was chatting directly with Miles Guo on\n10 Whatsapp, and I am next to him hearing Miles Guo voice mail\n11 from the Whatsapp messaging.\n12 Q. Okay. So then it's you were physically present when you\n13 hear a voice mail from Mr. Guo, correct?\n14 A. Yes.\n15 Q. And regardless of his voice mail, you were still waiting\n16 for 30 full days to get an account number where you could get\n17 your money, correct?\n18 A. That's not correct.\n19 Q. Okay. How long did you wait between the first time you\n20 heard his voice and to the time that somebody actually sent you\n21 a bank account number? How long was the wait?\n22 A. So it's been a while I wanted to say that we did not first\n23 get contacted with Miles Guo. So when I say the full month, it\n24 started sending application to Sara Wei first telling her that\n25 we have an interest in investment and it's above 100,000. And\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 we waited a while to hear back, and then Sara told us we pass\n2 the qualification test, and then we were given Miles Guo\n3 contact information, so that has been some time pass to your\n4 question earlier on that one month.\n5 So by the time we receive Miles Guo contact and he\n6 send us the information to make the GTV investment, we made the\n7 GTV investment in sending the money very quickly. I think only\n8 a couple of days as soon as we receive the wire instruction\n9 information.\n10 Q. So let's break that down. You contacted Sara Wei, correct?\n11 A. Because Miles Guo said in the video to contact Sara Wei to\n12 get the information for completing GTV investment.\n13 Q. Miles Guo told you, we've heard that before. I understand.\n14 My question is, you contacted Sara Wei. Did you\n15 contact her or did your husband contact her?\n16 A. My husband contacted her.\n17 Q. And how long did your husband wait to hear back from Sara\n18 Wei?\n19 A. It's been sometime. I want to say it's been a couple of\n20 weeks, maybe two or three weeks if I remember correctly, but\n21 it's been sometime, maybe between his first contact and got\n22 approval.\n23 Q. And for the couple of weeks that you were waiting, do you\n24 recall your husband telling you that he had tried to reach\n25 Mr. Guo himself?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 A. He doesn't have information to contact Miles Guo.\n2 Q. So your husband did not tell you that; is that right?\n3 A. He told me -- what do you mean he did not tell me that?\n4 What's your question again? Are you asking me -- can you\n5 repeat your question again?\n6 Q. Sure. By the time that you're waiting to hear back from\n7 Sara Wei, right, does your husband tell you that he is\n8 impatient and trying to reach Mr. Guo?\n9 A. He did not say that to me.\n10 Q. Now, when you were evaluating what GTV was, did you do any\n11 research at all?\n12 MR. FINKEL: Object on the basis of the Court's\n13 ruling.\n14 THE COURT: You may inquire as to whether she did any\n15 research. You can answer.\n16 A. When you say research, oh, I listen to his broadcasting\n17 video, and then I heard his like blueprint about the GTV and\n18 then that's it.\n19 Q. Was it important to you that Kyle Bass was on the board of\n20 GTV?\n21 A. It had some influence.\n22 Q. And you knew who Kyle Bass was, right?\n23 A. I don't know that well in details, but I know he's a\n24 investor.\n25 Q. You know him to be an investor?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 A. I know him being a successful institution investor private\n2 equity. He's successful in investments.\n3 Q. And you testified on direct that you started the GTV\n4 investment process on May 11 of 2020, right?\n5 A. When you say I started a process, can you clarify what you\n6 mean when you say --\n7 Q. Contacting Sara Wei, that was on May 11?\n8 A. I don't remember that date.\n9 Q. You don't remember that date?\n10 MR. FINKEL: Asked and answered.\n11 THE COURT: She has asked the question.\n12 MS. SHROFF: Sometimes I just can't understand so I\n13 repeat the response.\n14 THE COURT: So speak into the microphone, please.\n15 Q. On May 12, 2020 is when you received the private placement\n16 memorandum, right?\n17 A. I don't remember the date.\n18 Q. Did you receive the GTV first private placement memorandum\n19 or was it your husband?\n20 A. Miles sent the link to that document and we open a link and\n21 look at them together.\n22 Q. And along with the PPM, you were also sent a\n23 confidentiality agreement, correct?\n24 A. We follow the instruction provided and send in whichever\n25 document that's required for.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. I'm asking you whether you recall receiving the\n2 confidentiality agreement?\n3 A. I think so.\n4 Q. Do you recall receiving the subscription agreement?\n5 A. I think so.\n6 Q. And do you recall receiving the shareholders agreement?\n7 A. Maybe. I don't remember exactly what it is.\n8 Q. Do you remember receiving the note along with those\n9 documents that said old friends and perspective investors who\n10 receive this agreement, please read it carefully?\n11 A. I don't remember that.\n12 Q. Do you recall being told that the private placement would\n13 end at 11 a.m. New York time on May 26 of 2020?\n14 A. I don't remember the detail date.\n15 Q. Let me ask you something, when your husband was responding\n16 or corresponding with Mr. Guo, you said you were right there,\n17 correct?\n18 A. Yes.\n19 Q. So you recall your husband telling Mr. Guo that he would go\n20 and carefully review the agreement and meticulously follow all\n21 the requirements stated in it, do you recall your husband\n22 saying that?\n23 MR. FINKEL: Objection, hearsay and the Court's\n24 ruling.\n25 THE COURT: Overruled. You may answer.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 A. I don't remember that.\n2 Q. Do you recall after that your husband confirming that he\n3 had read the conditions for GTV private placement?\n4 A. I don't remember that.\n5 Q. You testified on direct about what it is to be an\n6 accredited investor, correct?\n7 A. Yes.\n8 Q. And to be an accredited investor, you tell me what was your\n9 understanding of that?\n10 A. A joint income of above $300,000 and in equity of more than\n11 a million excepting the primary home.\n12 Q. And you had that, right?\n13 A. Yes.\n14 Q. Do you recall when you first transferred the money after\n15 noting that you were an accredit investor?\n16 A. Yes, I'm accredited investor.\n17 Q. Do you recall sitting here today whether the investment was\n18 made in your name, your husband's name or both your names?\n19 A. We sent a couple wires. Some of them are in my name. Some\n20 of them are in his name, and some of them are in our joint\n21 name.\n22 Q. And, Ms. Chen, just for a moment if I could ask you, you\n23 testified on direct, right, that you -- well, let me ask you\n24 this. Before you invested in GTV, you had bought stock,\n25 correct?\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 A. No, I have not.\n2 Q. Your testimony is that -- not shares, stock?\n3 MR. FINKEL: Asked and answered.\n4 THE COURT: Sustained.\n5 Q. Did you ever have an investment where you had lost money,\n6 do you recall that?\n7 A. I don't remember that.\n8 Q. Well, let me show you 3530 at page three. See if reading\n9 that document refreshes your recollection.\n10 A. I don't remember, so.\n11 Q. So you do not remember investing in stock or losing money?\n12 MR. FINKEL: Asked and answered. She doesn't\n13 remember.\n14 THE COURT: Sustained.\n15 Q. You can take that down. Was it your understanding that GTV\n16 was an investment in a startup?\n17 A. My understanding of the GTV that Miles promoted is private\n18 placement.\n19 Q. Private placement of what?\n20 A. You can buy a share before it goes to the public market.\n21 Q. But for what?\n22 A. For it to go --\n23 Q. For a startup, right?\n24 MR. FINKEL: Objection. She didn't finish the answer.\n25 THE COURT: Sustained.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. Go ahead, finish.\n2 A. For it to go up 10 times or 100 times, that's what Miles\n3 Guo promoted and I believed back then.\n4 Q. He promoted a private placement and you believed; is that\n5 what you said?\n6 A. He promoted a private placement that could go up to 10\n7 times a hundred times that I believe in what he said.\n8 Q. You said that before. My question is whether you knew what\n9 he was talking about was it a startup?\n10 MR. FINKEL: Asked and answered.\n11 THE COURT: You already asked the question about the\n12 startup.\n13 Q. Let me show you what Mr. Finkel there showed you on your\n14 direct, the private placement itself. Do you recognize GXVK-5?\n15 A. Yes.\n16 Q. And this is the private placement memorandum, correct?\n17 A. Yes.\n18 Q. And I just want to be sure. I'm asking you did you read\n19 it?\n20 A. Yes.\n21 Q. You read it page to page, correct?\n22 A. I read this document.\n23 Q. Entirely?\n24 MR. FINKEL: Asked and answered.\n25 THE COURT: Sustained.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 Q. Let's take a look at it. Let's go to page nine. And if we\n2 could just have the full page shown to her first. You see that\n3 page?\n4 A. Yes.\n5 Q. And you see the bottom paragraph there?\n6 A. Yes.\n7 Q. It tells you, right, what the next page is going to be\n8 about, right?\n9 A. Yes.\n10 Q. And what is your understanding of what they're talking\n11 about in terms of the 200 million new shares?\n12 A. My understanding is it was holding by Saraca Media 100\n13 percent. Now Miles Guo want us to be rich, so he's taking 10\n14 percent and then giving his share to us to acquire at a dollar\n15 per share.\n16 Q. Where do you read Miles Guo wants us to be rich in the\n17 paragraph I've shown you?\n18 MR. FINKEL: Misstates the testimony. The question\n19 was, what was her understanding, not what it said.\n20 THE COURT: Sustained.\n21 Q. My question to you what does that paragraph state -- and I\n22 would move to strike and I will start the question all over\n23 again.\n24 THE COURT: Let's move on.\n25 Q. The offering that is on that piece of paper is for 200\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 million shares in exchange for $200 million, correct?\n2 A. So you're talking about the one you highlighted there you\n3 ask me?\n4 Q. I'm happy to take the highlight off.\n5 A. You're asking me if I'm reading it as 200 million for 200\n6 million shares?\n7 Q. That's my question.\n8 A. So my understanding is that talk about it issue the share\n9 at a dollar for a total of 20 million new share and maximum can\n10 be 200 million new share.\n11 Q. And it tells you, that document told you, right, that it\n12 was Saraca that was looking to sell 200 million shares,\n13 correct?\n14 A. My understanding back then was not Saraca selling it. My\n15 understanding back then is Miles told us he is finding this\n16 opportunity for us for a dollar a share, not saying Saraca is\n17 selling it to us.\n18 Q. I understand you've told us many times about your\n19 understanding. My question really relates to the document,\n20 right, Ms. Chen?\n21 A. I understand you're asking me about this document, but what\n22 I'm telling you is, I agree with you said. I read this\n23 document. And when I read this document, I have an\n24 understanding of what Miles said about it. So when I read it,\n25 I interpret it the way as Miles Guo said and broadcast it in a\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 video, that's why I'm explaining to you my understanding about\n2 it based on the time when I read it, based on the time I got\n3 influence from Miles Guo, from his broadcasting video.\n4 THE COURT: All right. This is the end of the day, so\n5 we're going to have to stop. Members of the jury, don't\n6 discuss the case amongst yourselves or with anyone else. Don't\n7 permit anyone else to discuss the case in your presence. Don't\n8 read, watch, listen to any source that touches upon the subject\n9 matter on this case. Have a good evening.\n10 THE LAW CLERK: Jury exiting.\n11 (Continued on next page)\n12\n13\n14\n15\n16\n17\n18\n19\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 (Jury not present)\n2 THE COURT: You may step out. Don't discuss your\n3 testimony.\n4 (Witness temporarily excused)\n5 THE COURT: Please be seated. Is there anything that\n6 either party would like to raise before we get started tomorrow\n7 morning?\n8 MS. SHROFF: Your Honor, I just had one matter to\n9 raise if I may. Thank you. Your Honor, given the Court's\n10 admonition to the audience during the time the jury was here, I\n11 respectfully request that the Court just reiterate it now\n12 because there is no jury present. And we would have no\n13 objection just so that the future testimony is not interrupted\n14 in any way, and hopefully things will go smoother. And I don't\n15 have to worry about prejudice to the jury, so I would rather it\n16 happen now.\n17 THE COURT: Under our system of law, a defendant is\n18 entitled to a public trial. That means that anyone can come\n19 and sit and listen. However, you must observe courtroom\n20 decorum. That means not talking, not laughing, not making\n21 faces, not making gestures, just sitting quietly and politely.\n22 Anything further from either side?\n23 MS. SHROFF: No, your Honor.\n24 MR. FINKEL: Your Honor, just briefly. There were two\n25 of the Court's orders that I was referring to in my objection.\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 One was from the robing room the other day, the other -- and I\n2 think the Court recognized this -- is about the sophistication\n3 of the investor issue. And specifically your Honor's ruling at\n4 Docket 319 at page 17, quoting your Honor, \"There is a fine\n5 line between properly asking about an investor's\n6 sophistication, and improperly implying to the jury that the\n7 investor should have found out the truth about the alleged\n8 misrepresentations.\" Granting the government's motion and\n9 permitting the government \"may object at the appropriate time\n10 if the defendants' questions verges to the latter,\" meaning\n11 implying that the victim should have realized that she was\n12 being scammed.\n13 And so the objections for today were overruled.\n14 That's fine. Tomorrow if there's additional lines of\n15 questioning on that, the government will object. The\n16 government reiterates that it would be appropriate in light of\n17 the questioning towards Ms. Chen and other victims and other\n18 witnesses, we ask the Court to consider instructing the jury as\n19 to that, which is that an investor's sophistication is not at\n20 issue. Investors are not held to having to find out that they\n21 were being defrauded. And so we would ask the jury so that\n22 they are not confused as this trial continues and we move into\n23 the defendant's case that your Honor instruct them as to that\n24 matter.\n25 THE COURT: So you have my proposed jury charge which\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - Cross\n1 contains a very clear instruction on that issue. Ms. Shroff\n2 has not crossed the line. I feel confident that she will not.\n3 MR. FINKEL: Thank you, your Honor.\n4 THE COURT: Good evening.\n5 MR. FINKEL: Can I ask a question. How much time does\n6 Ms. Shroff have left on the cross?\n7 THE COURT: Ms. Shroff?\n8 MS. SHROFF: Honestly, I'm having difficulty with the\n9 witness, so it could easily be two, two and a half more hours.\n10 THE COURT: How much did you say?\n11 MS. SHROFF: Two hours.\n12 THE COURT: Oh my goodness. That sounds excessive,\n13 really.\n14 MS. SHROFF: She's very combative, your Honor. So I\n15 have to be careful. She could implode at any moment.\n16 THE COURT: I don't have that sense. She comes across\n17 as an intelligent, thoughtful, calm person, so I have no fear\n18 of implosion, so I would ask that you reach for efficiency.\n19 MS. SHROFF: I will try my very best, your Honor.\n20 MR. FINKEL: If it's two hours, two and a half\n21 realistically, your Honor, we're not resting until Friday at\n22 that point. Tuesday, there is no Friday.\n23 THE COURT: We'll have to see. Good evening.\n24 (Adjourned to June 27, 2024, at 9 a.m.)\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\n1 INDEX OF EXAMINATION\n2 Examination of: Page\n3 PAUL HINTON\n4 Direct By Ms. Murray . . . . . . . . . . . . .4355\n5 Cross By Mr. Kamaraju . . . . . . . . . . . .4399\n6 Redirect By Ms. Murray . . . . . . . . . . . .4444\n7 Recross By Mr. Kamaraju . . . . . . . . . . .4458\n8 WEI CHEN\n9 Direct By Mr. Finkel . . . . . . . . . . . . .4459\n10 Cross By Ms. Shroff . . . . . . . . . . . . .4509\n11 GOVERNMENT EXHIBITS\n12 Exhibit No. Received\n13 VB13, VB14, VB24, VB26, VB27, VB29, . . . . .4474\n14 VB31, VB33\n15 VB10-T, VB13-T, VB24-T, VB27-T . . . . . . .4474\n16 Stip 21 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4473\n17 VB35 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4483\n18 DEFENDANT EXHIBITS\n19 Exhibit No. Received\n20 DX-11124 through 11129, DX-11255, . . . . . .4401\n21 DX-11432 through 11436,\n22 DX-10299 through DX-10301,\n23 DX-13005 through DX-10329,\n24 DX-10526, DX-10528 through\n25 DX-10530, DX-10551 through\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\n1 DX-10562, DX-10564 through\n2 DX-10577, DX-11299 through\n3 DX-11300, DX-11302, DX-11304\n4 and DX-11305, DX-11485,\n5 DX-11486 through, DX-11488,\n6 DX-11489, DX-11491 through\n7 DX-11492, DX-11548 through\n8 DX-11549, DX-11552 through\n9 DX-11553, DX-11562 through\n10 DX-11570, DX-10430 through\n11 DX-10457, DX-10960 through\n12 DX-10971, DX-11073 through\n13 DX-11078, DX-11110 through\n14 DX-11121, DX-11493 through\n15 DX-11506, DX-10007, DX-10531,\n16 DX-10606 through DX-10626,\n17 DX-10008 through DX-10010,\n18 DX-10330 through DX-10356,\n19 DX-10578 through DX-10605,\n20 DX-11256 through DX-11257,\n21 DX-11281, DX-11517 through\n22 DX-11526, DX-11572 through\n23 DX-11573, DX-11581, DX-11585,\n24 DX-10357 through DX-10359,\n25 DX-10627 through DX-10631,\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\n1 DX-10972, DX-10013, DX-10017\n2 through DX-10028, DX-10360\n3 through DX-10373\n4 7008 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4519\n5 7009 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4520\n6 7010 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4516\n7 7011 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4519\n8\n9\n10\n11\n12\n13\n14\n15\n16\n17\n18\n19\n20\n21\n22\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300","body_zh":"O6Q1GUO1\nUNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT（美国联邦地区法院）\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK（纽约南区）\n------------------------------x\nUNITED STATES OF AMERICA（美利坚合众国）\n\n诉 23 Cr. 118 (AT)\n\nMILES GUO（郭文贵）,\n\n被告。 庭审\n------------------------------x\n纽约州纽约市\n2024年6月26日\n上午9:00\n\n审理法官：\n\nHON. ANALISA TORRES（阿娜丽莎·托雷斯阁下）,\n联邦地区法官\n-及陪审团-\n\n出庭人员\n\nDAMIAN WILLIAMS（达米安·威廉姆斯）\nUnited States Attorney for the Southern District of New York（纽约南区联邦检察官）\n代理人：MICAH F. FERGENSON（米卡·F·费根森）\nRYAN B. FINKEL（莱恩·B·芬克尔）\nJUSTIN HORTON（贾斯汀·霍顿）\nJULIANA N. MURRAY（朱莉安娜·N·默里）\n助理联邦检察官\nSABRINA P. SHROFF（萨布丽娜·P·施罗夫）\n被告辩护律师\n\nPRYOR CASHMAN LLP（普莱尔·卡什曼律师事务所）\n被告辩护律师\n代理人：SIDHARDHA KAMARAJU（西达尔塔·卡马拉朱）\nMATTHEW BARKAN（马修·巴肯）\nALSTON & BIRD LLP（奥斯顿·博德律师事务所）\n被告辩护律师\n代理人：E. SCOTT SCHIRICK（E·斯科特·希里克）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（南区法庭记录速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n其他在场人员：\nIsabel Loftus（伊莎贝尔·洛夫特斯），USAO（联邦检察官办公室）律师助理专员\nRobert Stout（罗伯特·斯托特），FBI（联邦调查局）特别探员\nJorge Salazar（豪尔赫·萨拉扎），辩方律师助理\nTuo Huang（黄拓），口译员（普通话）\nShi Feng（冯实），口译员（普通话）\nYu Mark Tang（唐马克），口译员（普通话）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n（庭审恢复；陪审团未入庭）\n法庭：大家早上好。\n全体律师：法官阁下早上好。\n法庭：请各位律师作正式出庭声明。\n费根森先生：法官阁下早上好。米卡·费根森与贾斯汀·霍顿代表合众国出庭。\n施罗夫女士：萨布丽娜·施罗夫与斯科特·希里克代表Ho Wan Kwok（郭文贵）先生出庭。法官阁下早上好。\n法庭：请就座。\n在我们在9:30正式开始之前，有什么事项需要处理吗？\n费根森先生：有的，法官阁下。我认为我们有两点事项。\n第一点，我不想提出合适辩护律师不在场而无法回应的事项，只是向法庭通报一个问题。也许我们可以在午餐时间处理。我们一直在与辩方就证据事实承认书、翻译事项进行非常顺畅的合作，我们很感谢辩方的协助，让本次庭审更具效率。有一份录音我们与辩方达成了一致。那是一份属于Shamel Medrano（沙梅尔·梅德拉诺）先生的大型视频汇总图表中的录音，我们此前对其进行了遮蔽涂黑，因为我们当时仍在处理该视频的翻译。我想我们已经就其翻译达成了一致，法官阁下，而且我们已经达成一致，就是实际上重新归入证据的部分，我们可以使用梅德拉诺先生图表的更新版本，其中包含该视频和翻译文本。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n翻译记录有一处我们存在争议。这不是翻译争议；这是联邦证据规则第403条（Rule 403）争议。我不会展开讲，因为我希望卡马拉朱先生或巴肯先生——我最近与他们讨论过此事——也在场来共同处理，但只是非常简要地预览一下。大约是两行文字，郭先生在其中说了大致如下内容：“美国绝不会冤枉你。听我说。美国绝不会冤枉你。”这番言论的背景是，在2020年针对GTV展开调查时，郭先生正在广播中宣称，向美国当局投诉的人基本上都是假受害者、中共间谍或叛徒，他们将被美国提起刑事指控，随后他发表了关于美国绝不会冤枉你的言论。我们的观点是，使用对方当事人不利于自身法律利益的陈述，并没有任何不公允的偏见性。这属于对方当事人自认的核心范畴。刑事被告人在某些情况下会供述，而供述在庭审中是可采的。因此我们的观点是，如果被告人的陈述明显具有可采性，这里实际上并不存在403条问题。但我不想操之过急。我们可以稍后处理——除非辩方希望现在处理。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n法庭：既然那两位律师都不在场，我们现在无需听取，但您的理解是辩方的立场认为该陈述具有不公允的偏见性？\n费根森先生：是的，法官阁下。\n法庭：好的。还有其他事项吗？\n费根森先生：霍顿先生还想处理另一件事项，鉴于我们很有希望但尚不能确定我们可能在今天完成举证，我让霍顿先生来陈述。\n霍顿先生：谢谢法官阁下。\n法官阁下上周有一天曾指出，法庭希望政府方面根据Geaney案判例提出正式申请，以采纳在庭审中提出的共谋者陈述，因此我想简要陈述一下。\n在大约六周的证言中——\n法庭：所以这是您目前要提出的动议吗？\n霍顿先生：如果法庭愿意，我很乐意现在提出该申请。\n法庭：请讲。\n霍顿先生：我们在庭审中听取了大约六周的证言和书证，涉及一系列庞大、相互关联的敲诈勒索与欺诈共谋，这些共谋具有全球性质、时间跨度长，而且确实以沟通作为其燃料和命脉。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n并且在巡回法院的Geaney案程序下，有相当数量的共谋者陈述及反映这些陈述的文件被作为证据提出，且以待补强关联性为条件。\n我就从最主要的说起，当然适用的标准是优势证据标准，因此法庭只需认定这些陈述人更有可能是与被告人共同参与共谋的成员，并且是在共谋进行期间以及为了推进这些共谋而作出的陈述。我将直接从最核心的王女士开始，她已经就以下罪名认罪——\n法庭：请稍等一下。\n霍顿先生：好的。\n法庭：您会明确指出具体人员，对吗？\n霍顿先生：我想我会这样处理，法官阁下，大致按某种顺序来进行，然后，鉴于这些共谋的性质，有若干共谋者和代理人并不完全处于边缘位置，他们与Yvette Wang（王雁平）不同。\n法庭：请把麦克风拉近一点。您刚才说有若干共谋者——\n施罗夫女士：法官阁下，很抱歉。我们团队有两名成员不在场，但我只想致歉并询问法庭我是否可以先向法庭提请注意一个问题。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n有一位证人预计今天下午作证，而我们不知道针对该证人将使用哪些具体的物证子集。我很乐意让霍顿先生继续，但关于陈女士，政府方面仅列出了一大批物证。我相信Tilton（蒂尔顿）女士昨天已向政府发邮件索取更小范围的子集。我们尚未收到。在霍顿先生向法庭进行此项辩论的同时——我再次为打断感到抱歉——如果负责陈女士主询问的律师能直接把物证编号发给我们，对我们将非常有帮助。谢谢。\n费根森先生：我们一定会做到的，法官阁下。我不太熟悉那组物证，但我们一定会向他们发送具体的物证。我们为受害者证人物证编号的方式是每位受害者证人都有自己的一套物证序列，所以，我的意思是，我们可以在其中明确具体的物证，但至少它已经按物证序列予以了确定。\n法庭：那么请立即办理。\n费根森先生：我们会照办的，法官阁下。\n施罗夫女士：法官阁下——\n法庭：稍等。\n施罗夫女士：噢，抱歉。\n法庭：您还有其他事项吗，施罗夫女士？\n施罗夫女士：是的，法官阁下。我知道辛顿先生仍在继续，但关于陈女士，我们也收到了一些带有新Bates编号的第3500条材料，因此如果在昨天到今天之间有任何额外的3500材料，我们也希望能收到。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n就这些。谢谢法官阁下。\n法庭：谢谢。\n好的。刚才我打断了霍顿先生，如果您想退回重新讲，您可以讲。我特别想确保我掌握了具体的姓名。\n请讲。请讲。\n霍顿先生：在法官阁下于本案中所见到的证据中，有若干经常参与其中的共谋者。\n首先是王女士，法官阁下在庭审初期注意到，曾就她某些陈述的可采性与辩方律师进行过正式交涉，休庭时我们谈到了她实际上已就与被告人共谋认罪的事实，因此她的陈述在庭审其余阶段得以作为证据采纳。\nWilliam Je（余建明），一名核心共谋者。有证据表明他代表被告人拥有和控制某些关键实体，代表被告人在这些实体之间转移资金，包括由他本人截留的犯罪所得，以及他与其他共谋者的合作，包括我接下来要提到的Mileson Guo（郭美）。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1\n有证据表明郭美使用欺诈犯罪所得购买奢侈品。有书证证明郭美代表G企业旗下的实体进行沟通联络。郭美与Haoran He（何浩然）存在联系。\n有大量证据，包括来自直接与何先生打交道的证人的证据，表明他是大量重要G企业实体的名义所有人兼运营者，当然，通过Reyes（雷耶斯）女士的证言以及法官阁下看到的许多文件，他在G|CLUBS（G俱乐部）中占据了核心位置，在这些文件中他表面上作为G俱乐部的所有人下达指示，当然其他证据表明他这样做是与被告人及被告人的其他共谋者相联系且共同共谋的。\n以上就是本案中的核心共谋者。当然还有其他证据被采纳。其中一部分当时已实时解决。那属于只出场一次或几次的人。所以我们——\n法庭：所以是Yanping Wang（王雁平）、William Je（余建明）、Mileson Guo（郭美）和Haoran He（何浩然），对吗？\n霍顿先生：正是。我把他们称为核心共谋者。当然，还有关于Aaron Mitchell（亚伦·米切尔）、Victor Cerda（维克多·塞尔达）等人的证据。我只想提请法庭注意两点。即共谋者与代理人——\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\n当然，共谋者例外只是801(b)(2)针对一般代理人陈述所作规定的更具体形式。当某人被提及且他们并非所谓的常客时，我们通常会进行边裁商议并在现场进行辩论，向法庭指出已经采纳或即将采纳的证据，法庭在审理过程中作出了裁决。\n\n因此，为了做好铺垫并重申证明标准是优势证据标准，我们认为已有排除合理怀疑的证据表明符合各项要素，即如果存在共谋，共谋陈述者与被告同为该共谋的成员，并且我们所提交的陈述，在我们就其真实性而提交的范围内——当然法庭也看到了，并非所有这些共谋者和代理人的陈述都是因其真实性而提交的；其中一些是因其虚假性而提交的，一些是因其对证人或其他人的影响而提交的，但就其是因真实性而提交的范围而言——我们主张，过去六周以来的证据已经超过了法庭在作出Geaney（吉尼）认定所使用的优势证据标准。正如Fergenson（弗格森）先生所言，我们有望在今天完成举证，并且我们主张法庭拥有今天作出该认定所需的足够证据。\n\n法庭：我认为判例法要求我在检方举证结束后作出任何认定，我只是不想偏离这一法定程序。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nMR. HORTON（霍顿先生）：法官阁下，我只是想为您做好铺垫。仅此而已。\n\n法庭：好的。还有其他事项吗？\n\nMS. SHROFF（什罗夫女士）：法官阁下，我不确定法庭是希望听取我们的意见，还是允许我们在政府举证终结时或在政府举证结束后正式提出该问题时再作回应。显然，我们事先没有收到任何通知表明政府今天上午会提出这一问题。我认为Kamaraju（卡马拉朱）先生也没有收到通知。因此，我们希望获得额外的时间。\n\n在此我想提两点简短的意见。第一，共谋必须在陈述被采纳之前就已经存在，而政府律师关于在为期六周的——我想是六周，虽然我已经记不清了——庭审中存在共谋的一般性陈述，我认为甚至达不到优势证据标准。而且政府至少在今天上午只是泛泛地提到了Wang（王）女士、Mileson（迈尔森）、He（何）先生以及William Je（余建明）。我认为其他人作出的陈述也存在争议，包括Dara Lawall（达拉·拉沃尔）。我们希望有机会确保为法庭准备好庭审笔录页数，并在讨论该问题之前做好更充分的准备。既然这应该在政府举证结束后进行，我们将努力做好准备。\n\n法庭：你刚才提到的那个人的名字怎么拼写？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nMS. SHROFF（什罗夫女士）：名字是D-A-R-A，姓氏是L-A-W-A-L-L。为方便法庭起见，法官阁下，她是执业律师Aaron Mitchell（亚伦·米切尔）的配偶，她的证词是在Amy Buck（艾米·巴克）作证期间被引出，或者说涉及她的问题是在那时被提出的。\n\n法庭：当然，我会在检方举证结束后给辩方机会来处理这些问题。\n\nMS. SHROFF（什罗夫女士）：谢谢您，法官阁下。\n\nMR. FERGENSON（弗格森先生）：我很乐意就Lawall（拉沃尔）女士一事作出回应，但如果法官阁下认为更合适，我们也可以留到稍后讨论。\n\n法庭：我认为这样更好。\n\nMR. FERGENSON（弗格森先生）：好的。关于Shroff（什罗夫）女士提出的另一个问题，仅做一项最新说明。关于具体的物证，实际上，我查了邮箱，另一位AUSA（联邦助理检察官）已经发送过去了，所以那一项已经办妥了。\n\n法庭：好的。那么我们将让证人在9点29分重新出庭作证，并在9点30分正式开始。\n\nMS. SHROFF（什罗夫女士）：法官阁下，我们确实在今天上午9点06分收到了该邮件。谢谢。\n\n（休庭）\n\n（在边裁席）\n\n法庭：我只是想明确一点，政府必须具体说明涉及Geaney（吉尼）申请的所有个人，当然还要论证为什么应当准许采纳这些陈述。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nMR. HORTON（霍顿先生）：明白了。谢谢您，法官阁下。\n\nMR. KAMARAJU（卡马拉朱先生）：谢谢您，法官阁下。\n\n（在公开法庭）\n\n法庭：请带陪审员入庭。\n\n（接下页）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\n（陪审团在场）\n\n法庭：请就座。\n\n陪审员们，早上好。\n\n陪审员们：早上好。\n\n法庭：我们将继续对证人进行直接询问。\n\n证人先生，请记住您仍处于宣誓状态。\n\n您可以继续发问。\n\nMS. MURRAY（默里女士）：谢谢您，法官阁下。\n\nPAUL HINTON（保罗·欣顿），恢复作证。\n\n直接询问\n\n主问人：MS. MURRAY（默里女士）：\n\n问：早上好，Hinton（欣顿）先生。\n\n答：早上好。\n\nMS. MURRAY（默里女士）：Loftus（洛夫特斯）女士，能否请调出政府物证Z26并翻到第5张幻灯片。\n\n问：Hinton（欣顿）先生，在我们等待的过程中，您能否向陪审团解释一下什么是资金追踪。\n\n答：可以。按我使用该词的含义，追踪是指随着时间的推移跟踪资金流经一系列账户的情况。\n\n问：如果有的话，您是如何追踪资金流经一系列账户的？\n\n答：是这样的，您要查看进入某个账户的流入资金以及随后从该账户流出的资金，然后如果存在流向另一个账户的流出资金，例如通过电汇，您就必须跟踪资金到达后续账户，并在那里做同样的事情。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\n问：如果有的话，在核对这些汇总幻灯片中信息的准确性过程中，您是如何使用资金追踪的？\n\n答：严格来说，没有人要求我做任何追踪。\n\n问：在评估这些汇总图表中所包含信息的准确性时，您是否评估了流入和流出情况？\n\n答：是的。对于每一笔交——单笔交易，我都查看了资金流动的时间、资金流动的金额以及资金是在哪些账户之间流动的。\n\n问：我们昨天谈到了一些关于汇总图表中包含的资金来源情况。您还记得吗？\n\n答：记得。\n\n问：具体而言，政府针对G|CLUBS（G俱乐部）如何界定资金来源。关于GTV和Voice of Guo（郭媒体，即VOG），政府如何指示Brattle（布拉特尔）为这些账户的目的定义资金来源？\n\n答：对于这些账户，我们只是识别未以其他方式被确定为与我们昨天谈到的、展示在我图表上不同类别中的任何实体相关的个人的所有资金流动。\n\n问：关于农场，出于农场分析目的的资金来源，政府是否向Brattle（布拉特尔）提供了一份应当被归类为农场资金来源的实体或个人名单？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\n答：是的，有一长串与农场相关的实体，这些实体在图表上显示为通过图表上的农场类别贡献资金。\n\n问：最后是Himalaya Exchange（喜马拉雅交易所）。为了汇总Himalaya Exchange（喜马拉雅交易所）资金的目的，政府是否为您指明了与入账资金来源相关的某些公司或银行账户？\n\n答：是的。同样，就属于Himalaya（喜马拉雅）类别的实体而言，这些实体都是由政府为我们定义并列出的，因此我们将它们与交易进行了匹配，然后任何——流入这些实体账户的任何资金来源都来自未以其他方式与这些已分类实体中的任何一个相关的个人。\n\n问：在等待的过程中，您能否再次解释一下，您用来确认图表中所含信息的准确性（正如您审阅的原始银行记录所反映的那样）的另外几种方法？\n\n答：可以。归根结底，在政府确定了他们希望在图表上显示哪些财务交易和交易组之后，我们使用我们的数据库来确定将被汇总并显示在图表上的基础单笔交易是什么，然后对于这些交易中的每一笔，我们都能够查看基础的政府物证，即显示交易金额的银行记录。\n\n问：好的。我们现在已经调出了政府物证Z26的第5张幻灯片。这张幻灯片的标题是什么，Hinton（欣顿）先生？\n\n答：这张幻灯片的标题是GTV/VOG：精选资金流动。\n\n问：查看第一级实体或第一级银行账户（如果我可以这样称呼它们的话），从资金来源进入每个第一批箭头，您能否读出GTV和VOG的资金流向的实体名称。\n\n答：好的。从左侧的资金来源看，我们看到第一个账户是Voice of Guo Media（郭媒体），这是一个Bank of America（美国银行）账户，7226。\n\n第二个账户也是Voice of Guo Media, Inc.（郭媒体公司）的账户，这个在Wells Fargo（富国银行），5536。\n\n第三个账户是Saraca Media Group, Inc.（萨拉卡媒体集团公司）在JPMorgan（摩根大通）的账户，5601。\n\n第四个账户是GTV Media Group, Inc.（GTV媒体集团公司）在Capital One（第一资本银行）的账户。\n\n第五个账户是GTV Media Group, Inc.（GTV媒体集团公司）在JPMorgan（摩根大通）的账户，3335。\n\n问：那么在这五个账户中，它们是否分别开设在四家不同的银行？\n\n答：是的。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\n问：看中间的箭头，向下指向JPMorgan（摩根大通）5601的Saraca Media（萨拉卡媒体）账户，截至2020年6月4日，通过资金来源流入该账户的资金有多少？\n\n答：2.759亿。\n\n问：然后如果我们看一下流出该账户的资金。您能否读出资金流出该账户的金额以及日期范围。\n\n答：可以。本图表显示该Saraca（萨拉卡）账户向其他实体有三笔资金流出。\n\n左侧，在6月3日至6月10日之间，有1.255亿转账至Saraca Media Group, Inc.（萨拉卡媒体集团公司）尾号为2038的JPMorgan（摩根大通）账户。\n\n6月3日转账2亿至GTV Media Group（GTV媒体集团）尾号为6691的Citibank（花旗银行）账户；并在2020年5月13日向GTV Media Group, Inc.（GTV媒体集团公司）尾号为7000的Capital One（第一资本银行）账户转账1000万。\n\n问：Hinton（欣顿）先生，为了明确起见，这些汇总图表是否反映了政府向您提供的银行记录中所包含的全部交易？\n\n答：没有。这只是所选定的一部分交易。\n\n问：提供给您的银行记录是由政府选定的吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：Brattle（布拉特尔）最终是否仅处理了那些银行记录的一部分，并将它们反映在这些图表上？\n\n答：是的。我们识别了大量记录，并且\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton（欣顿）- 直接询问\n\n政府指示我们——指示我们处理其中的一部分。\n\n问：你能否描述一下政府与 Brattle（布拉特尔）商讨优先处理哪些账户的过程？\n\n答：可以。最初他们交给我们非常大量的文档，我们必须识别这些文档中包含了哪些账户。随后我们生成了这些账户的清单并呈交给政府，政府指示我们其中哪些账户具有最高优先级、是我们需要处理的。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：Loftus（洛夫特斯）女士，麻烦请切换到下一张幻灯片。\n\n问：欣顿先生，这张幻灯片的标题是什么？\n\n答：这张幻灯片的标题是 VOG: Select Flows（VOG：精选资金流）。\n\n问：看左上方，有一个名为 Other Inflows（其他资金流入）的类别。如果它代表某种含义的话，它代表什么？\n\n答：嗯，这展示了在 2020年5月26日 至 2020年6月6日 这一时间段内，除来自 Sources of Funds（资金来源）的 26.7 million 之外，此处列出的流入 Voice of Guo Media（郭媒体）账户的所有资金流。\n\n问：这里还提到了一位名为 Lihong Wei Lafrenz（魏丽红·拉弗伦茨）的个人。你知道那是谁吗？\n\n答：不知道。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：好的。洛夫特斯女士，请切到下一张幻灯片。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭书记员公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 欣顿 - 直接询问\n\n问：欣顿先生，我们现在转到 Farms（农场）。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：麻烦请切到幻灯片 8。\n\n问：看一下这里，顶部大致有两个类别。左边绿色的 Farms（农场），右边灰色的 Sources of Funds（资金来源）。\n首先，显示资金流的农场类别，是否涵盖了政府提供并向布拉特尔指明为与农场相关的公司或个人？\n\n答：是的，没错。有一份很长的名单列出了这些对象。\n\n问：那么这 77 million 从农场流向了哪些账户？\n\n答：流入了 First Abu Dhabi Bank（第一阿布扎比银行）的 ACA Capital（ACA资本）账户。\n\n问：第一阿布扎比银行位于何处？\n\n答：我认为在 Abu Dhabi（阿布扎比）。\n\n问：根据你对政府提供的银行记录的审查，你是否了解该 ACA资本账户是由谁（如果有的话）控制的？\n\n答：不了解。\n\nKAMARAJU 律师：反对。\n\n问：我们现在看一下——\n\n法庭：反对无效。\n\n问：我们现在来看一下从 ACA资本账户流出的资金走向。我们从左边开始。\n麻烦你为陪审团宣读一下金额以及资金流向的账户持有人。\n\n答：好的。首先，19 million 被转入 Lexington Property & Staffing LLC（莱克星顿物业与人事有限责任公司）的两个账户，即 DCB 0625 和 Signature 3545。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 欣顿 - 直接询问\n\n问：抱歉。你能把 Signature（标志银行）的那个账号再读一遍吗？\n\n答：Signature 3945。抱歉。\n\n问：谢谢。\n\n答：显示的下一笔转账是向 William Je（余建明）和 Sing Ting Rong（容幸庭）转入的 11.2 million。接收该笔款项的有三个不同的银行账户——两个 Barclays（巴克莱银行）账户和一个 HPB 账户。\n\n问：下一笔资金流呢？\n\n答：下一笔资金流是向 Hudson Diamond（哈德逊钻石）转入的 18 million。\n\n问：时间跨度是多久？\n\n答：从 2021年2月2日 到 2021年2月10日。\n\n问：那么，这 16 million 最终从哈德逊钻石的控股账户流向了哪里？\n\n答：是的，在 5月 到 6月 期间，哈德逊钻石账户中的 16 million 被转入了 Lamp Capital LLC（朗普资本有限责任公司）。\n\n问：为了明确这笔总计 $16 million 的交易的日期范围，该笔资金流的具体日期范围是什么？\n\n答：2021年5月28日 至 2021年7月30日。\n\n问：好的。继续沿着 ACA资本账户往下看，我们刚刚看过了流向哈德逊钻石的。汇总表上反映的下一笔资金流是什么？\n\n答：嗯，有一笔从 ACA资本直接转入朗普资本账户的 $13 million 转账。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 欣顿 - 直接询问\n\n问：然后最后——好吧，不是最后，而是向右看的下一笔。\n\n答：是的，下一笔是流向 Greenwich Land LLC（格林威治地产有限责任公司）的 5 million。\n\n问：然后我们看到的最后一笔走向大致在 3 点钟方向的资金流。\n\n答：是流向 Savio Law（萨维奥律师事务所）的 32 million。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：洛夫特斯女士，麻烦请调出政府证物 GX PNC39 的第 3 页。\n\n问：聚焦于你刚才提到的最后一笔交易，或者你刚才提到的最后一笔资金流，欣顿先生，即流向萨维奥律师事务所的 32 million。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：好的。洛夫特斯女士，麻烦请翻到第 3 页。其实——抱歉——请翻到页面顶部。\n\n问：欣顿先生，这是本案中政府向你提供的银行记录之一吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：这是你审查过的用以确认我们一直在讨论的图表（包括 Z26）准确性的记录之一吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：看左上方，黑体粗字列出的是什么，以及在其正下方最左上方写的是什么？\n\n答：上面写着 IOLTA，IOLTA Checking（IOLTA 支票账户）。\n\n问：其下方呢？\n\n答：PNC Bank（PNC银行）。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 欣顿 - 直接询问\n\n问：这份特定银行对账单涵盖的时间段是？\n\n答：2020年10月31日 至 2020年11月30日。\n\n问：在其下方，你能读一下与该账户关联的实体名称和地址吗？\n\n答：萨维奥律师事务所，地址为 3 Dale Court, Hazlet, New Jersey（新泽西州哈兹利特戴尔法院路3号）。\n\n问：在 Savio Law LLC 下方有一行描述。请读给陪审团听一下。\n\n答：IOLTA Attorney Trust Account（IOLTA 律师信托账户）。\n\n问：你是否有独立的依据知晓 Savio Law LLC 是否为一家律师事务所？\n\n答：没有。\n\n问：看右侧，我们在此看到的账号后四位是多少？\n\n答：8162。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：好的。洛夫特斯女士，我们现在可以去第 3 页了。\n我们重点看一下 Activity Details, Deposits and Other Additions（活动详情、存款及其他存入项）。\n\n问：欣顿先生，你看到这里列出的该账户的“存款及其他存入项”交易了吗？\n\n答：看到了。\n\n问：最上面四笔交易的日期范围是什么？\n\n答：11月12日 至 11月16日。\n\n问：从上往下看，每一笔的金额分别是多少？\n\n答：是的。9.5 million、8.5 million、7.5 million 以及 6,499,935。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 欣顿 - 直接询问\n\n问：欣顿先生，这四笔交易总共是否代表了我们刚才看到的从 ACA资本流向萨维奥律师事务所的 32 million？\n\n答：是的。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：洛夫特斯女士，麻烦请切回到 Z26。\n我们刚才在第 8 页。\n\n问：好的。欣顿先生，这是农场资金流的更宏观汇总。我现在想进一步深入探讨其中的几笔资金流。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：洛夫特斯女士，麻烦请翻到下一页。\n\n问：看萨维奥律师事务所和 ACA资本下方，也就是现在的空白处——麻烦请切到下一张幻灯片——欣顿先生，这里反映的发生于 2020年10月15日 的两笔资金流是什么？\n\n答：有一笔向格林威治地产有限责任公司转入的 $5 million 转账，以及一笔向朗普资本转入的 $5 million 转账。\n\n问：接收 2020年10月15日 这两笔 $5 million 转账的账户开立在哪个银行？\n\n答：Bank of Princeton（普林斯顿银行）。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：好的。洛夫特斯女士，现在麻烦请切到下一张幻灯片。\n\n问：欣顿先生，我们在这里看到的从 ACA资本流向格林威治地产、然后向右流出的资金流反映了什么？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 欣顿 - 直接询问\n\n问：向右的资金流？\n\n答：对的。在 10月，2020年10月21日 至 23日 之间，有 $5 million 从 ACA资本转至格林威治地产，随后在 10月——2020年10月26日 至 11月20日 之间，有 9 million 从格林威治地产转至朗普资本。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：好的。洛夫特斯女士，麻烦请切到下一张幻灯片。\n\n问：欣顿先生，这是我们刚才看过的更宏观农场图表的另一部分。从农场开始，一直到黄色高亮显示的账户，你能不能大体解释一下，我们在本汇总中看到的是哪种类别的资金流？\n\n答：好的。这只是展示了前一张图表中从农场流出的资金走向：77 million 转入 ACA资本，然后从 ACA资本转至两个不同的实体，哈德逊钻石接收了 18 million，朗普资本从 ACA资本接收了 13 million；在这些——随后哈德逊钻石控股还向朗普资本转账了 16 million。\n\n问：为了确保我们的理解完全无误，如这些交易所示，农场的 77 million 流入 ACA资本，最终是否有 $29 million 流入了 Lamp Capital LLC 账户？\n\n答：是的，最终从农场接收了 $77 million 的账户随后向朗普资本转账了 13 million，并向哈德逊转账了 18 million；哈德逊钻石随后又向朗普资本转账了 16 million；因此合计有 29 million 流入朗普资本。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 欣顿 - 直接询问\n\n答：向朗普资本流入了 29 million。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：洛夫特斯女士，麻烦请切到下一张幻灯片。\n\n问：欣顿先生，在这张幻灯片上，我们从上一张幻灯片的终点——朗普资本账户开始；对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：这张幻灯片的标题是什么？\n\n答：是 Farms: Select Expenses from Lamp Capital Accounts（农场：朗普资本账户精选支出）。\n\n问：欣顿先生，这张幻灯片是否仅反映了从朗普资本 Signature 银行账户流出的部分支出？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：是谁挑选了反映在这张幻灯片上的交易？\n\n答：政府。\n\n问：我想看一下作为这些交易基础的部分记录。但首先，欣顿先生，能否请你从左到右依次宣读气泡中显示的这些资金流类别。\n\n答：可以。精选支出包括车辆相关支出、Yachtzoo LLC 支出、ACASS Canada Ltd.（加拿大ACASS有限公司）、Cirrus Design Corporation（西锐设计公司）、Mei Guo（郭美）以及 Qiang Guo（郭强）。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 欣顿 - 直接询问\n\nMURRAY 检察官：好的。洛夫特斯女士，我们看一下政府证物 SIG102 并翻到第 4 页。\n\n问：我想看一下在我们刚才看到的幻灯片（幻灯片 13）上所反映的车辆相关支出之一。\n实际上，请聚焦在第一页——谢谢，洛夫特斯女士——仅看对账单本身，欣顿先生，我们在此看到的对账单周期是多久？\n\n答：对账单周期为 5月1日 至 31日——\n\n问：哪一年？\n\n答：——2021年。\n\n问：抱歉，我打断你了。哪一年？\n\n答：2021年。\n\n问：这是政府向你提供的、你用于核对汇总图表准确性所审查的银行记录之一吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：看左边，该特定银行账户的名称和地址是什么？\n\n答：是 Lamp Capital LLC，地址为 667 Madison Avenue, New York, New York（纽约州纽约市麦迪逊大道667号）。\n\nMURRAY 检察官：好的。洛夫特斯女士，我们缩小该画面并翻到第 4 页。\n谢谢。麻烦高亮标出 5月27日 这一笔较大的分录。\n\n问：欣顿先生，你看到这里所反映的那笔交易了吗？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct（直接询问）\n1 在这份银行记录中？\n2 答：是的。\n3 问：看那里，这里反映的是什么类型的交易，\n4 针对2021年5月27日，从这个Lamp Capital（灯塔资本）账户支出的？\n5 答：是一笔转出电汇。\n6 问：往下看两行，这笔转出电汇是发给谁的？\n7 答：该电汇支付至富国银行（Wells Fargo）账号\n8 8296，该账户是以Miller Motorcars, Inc.（米勒汽车公司）为受益人。\n9 问：从Lamp Capital向Miller\n10 Motorcars发出的这笔转出电汇的美元金额是多少？\n11 答：是$294,306。\n12 默里女士（MS. MURRAY）：跳过一些支出项，如果我们\n13 可以看同一页，洛夫特斯女士（Ms. Loftus），第二笔分录，\n14 2021年5月19日。\n15 问：欣顿先生（Mr. Hinton），这里反映的是什么类型的交易？\n16 答：这也是一笔转出电汇。\n17 问：往下看两行，这笔转出电汇是发给谁\n18 的？\n19 答：是发给Mei Guo（郭美）。\n20 问：2021年5月19日从Lamp\n21 Capital发给Mei Guo的这笔转出电汇的美元金额是多少？\n22 答：是$500,000。\n23 默里女士：好的。洛夫特斯女士，我们现在\n24 请再次转到Z26的第13张幻灯片。\n25 问：我只是想回顾一下我们在哪里看到这些交易\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭记录公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct（直接询问）\n1 我们刚才看到反映在该图表上的。\n2 那么，欣顿先生，Miller Motorcars，如果有的\n3 话，在这一汇总图表的什么地方包含了那笔金额？\n4 答：在标题为“汽车相关\n5 费用”的红线气泡中。\n6 问：给Mei Guo的$500,000，如果在这张\n7 汇总幻灯片上有的话，那笔交易反映在什么地方？\n8 答：那是右起第二行，底部带有——带有\n9 薰衣草色气泡的那个。\n10 问：好的。欣顿先生，我们现在要看一下\n11 ACASS Canada Ltd.（加拿大ACASS有限公司）的记录之一，也就是该图表上的第三个箭头\n12 流向。\n13 霍顿先生（MR. HORTON）：请转到政府方\n14 证据NJ808，第2页。\n15 问：澄清一下，不是看银行记录之一，\n16 而是看与该特定流向相关的政府方证据之一。\n17 欣顿先生，您知道ACASS Canada Ltd.是一家什么类型的公司吗？\n18 答：不知道。\n19 问：这是标题为NJ808的政府方证据。您\n20 以前见过这个吗？\n21 答：我不记得了。\n22 问：重点看顶部——洛夫特斯女士，如果我们能放大——这里列出的\n23 公司名称/服务提供商，欣顿先生，\n24 请您为我们读一下好吗。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭记录公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct（直接询问）\n1 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请问我们能否放大那部分。\n2\n3 问：是在那里的“公司名称”分录下，第一行，\n4 第一条长线。\n5 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请问您能高亮显示那部分吗。\n6\n7 答：好的，上面写着“公司名称：ACASS Canada Ltd.”，然后\n8 在后面带引号写着“服务提供商”，所以我认为您指的\n9 服务提供商就是ACASS Canada Ltd.。\n10 默里女士：请将那部分缩小，\n11 洛夫特斯女士，我们看页面下方。\n12 问：现在重点看底部，就是“同意方”一直到\n13 右侧部分。\n14 欣顿先生，看这里，“服务提供商同意方”，\n15 本文件该栏中是什么内容？\n16 答：是ACASS Canada Ltd.。\n17 问：右侧列出的客户是谁？\n18 答：“客户Whitecroft Shore Ltd.（怀特克罗夫特海岸有限公司）同意”，然后\n19 有一个签名和一个印刷体姓名。\n20 问：印刷体姓名是什么？\n21 答：印刷体姓名是Mei Guo。\n22 默里女士：好的。请缩小那部分，\n23 洛夫特斯女士。\n24 如果我们能再次重点看最上面的\n25 段落，“根据”。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭记录公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct（直接询问）\n1 问：欣顿先生，看本文件的这部分，您能否\n2 读一下第一句一直到第一个逗号？\n3 答：好的。“根据纳入飞机登记合同中的\n4 CorporateCare条款C6款，\n5 客户Whitecroft Shore Limited特此授权”，等等。\n6 问：在这段文字中，提到了什么类型的合同？\n7 答：是一份飞机登记合同。\n8 问：谢谢您。\n9 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，我们现在撤下这个，\n10 转到政府方证据VK10第58页。\n11 是VK10第58页。噢，抱歉。UK，UK10。\n12 请看这一页的顶部。\n13 问：欣顿先生，您以前见过这份文件吗？\n14 答：我不记得我是否单独审查过这一份。\n15 问：政府方证据UK10这一页上的标题是什么？\n16 答：是“首付款电汇”。\n17 问：本文件上列出的客户是谁？\n18 答：Mileson Guo（郭强）。\n19 问：往下几行的账户名称呢？\n20 答：是Wells Fargo Bank（富国银行）。\n21 问：噢，不是银行名称——抱歉——是往下两行\n22 的账户名称。\n23 答：噢，对不起。账户是Cirrus Design Corporation（西锐设计公司）。\n24 问：从那里再往下几行，有一笔美元存款\n25 金额。您看到了吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭记录公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct（直接询问）\n1 答：看到了。\n2 问：那个金额是多少？\n3 答：是$95,000。\n4 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，能否缩小一点，这样\n5 我们可以看到本页的更多内容。\n6 请转到下一页。\n7 问：欣顿先生，政府方证据UK10这一页的标题是什么？\n8 这是第59页。\n9 答：这一页的标题是“第二笔存款电汇”。\n10 问：这里的客户姓名呢？\n11 答：Mileson Guo。\n12 问：同样，往下几行，这笔第二笔\n13 存款电汇的账户名称是什么？\n14 答：那——那个账户名称是Cirrus Design Corporation。\n15 问：在那下方几行，美元存款金额是多少？\n16 答：是206,700。\n17 问：本文件上的下一行，该栏是什么，\n18 以及该栏中的信息是什么？\n19 答：好的。上面写着：“飞机参考：Vision SF50 G2\n20 顺位”。\n21 默里女士：好的。洛夫特斯女士，让我们再次转到\n22 Z26第13页，仅看看我们刚才审查的\n23 交易反映在什么地方。\n24 问：在这里，欣顿先生，您能否向陪审团解释一下我们在哪里\n25 能看到我们刚才看过的这两个实体，ACASS和Cirrus\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭记录公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct（直接询问）\n1 Design。\n2 答：它们是位于图表底部中间靠前的\n3 黑色椭圆。\n4 问：最后，我想看一下该图表右侧\n5 流向Qiang Guo（郭强）的2000万。欣顿先生，您\n6 知道那个人是谁吗？\n7 答：不知道。\n8 问：好的。那笔总计$20,000,000的\n9 转账的日期范围是什么？\n10 答：是'21年5月18日，至6月1日——\n11 问：哪一年？\n12 答：——2021年。\n13 默里女士：好的。洛夫特斯女士，请转到\n14 政府方证据3200。\n15 问：首先重点看本文件的顶部，欣顿先生，这\n16 是您在核实汇总图表的工作中审查过的\n17 银行记录之一吗？\n18 答：是的。\n19 问：在顶部，该账户对账单的日期是什么？\n20 答：是2021年12月14日。\n21 问：看右边，右上角有三个字母。\n22 您看到了吗？\n23 答：看到了。\n24 问：那些反映了什么？\n25 答：CHF我认为是指瑞士法郎。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭记录公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct（直接询问）\n1 问：其下方的姓名呢？\n2 答：Qiang Guo。\n3 默里女士：请转到下一页，\n4 洛夫特斯女士。噢，实际上，我们在这里停留片刻。\n5 问：欣顿先生，该账户对账单的第一行，截至2020年7月31日\n6 该账户的余额是多少？\n7 答：显示该日期的余额为0。\n8 默里女士：好的。请转到下一张幻灯片。\n9\n10 还有下一张幻灯片。不好意思。\n11 问：看这里，欣顿先生，同样，顶行，截至2020年7月31日\n12 结转的余额，这里反映的\n13 金额是多少？\n14 答：是0余额。\n15 问：您能读一下这份银行对账单上的下一笔分录吗，\n16 从日期开始。\n17 答：在2021年5月19日，有一笔贷记交易，\n18 被称为来自Lamp Capital LLC的红利款（bonification），金额为700万\n19 美元。\n20 问：根据这份银行记录，您怎么知道那是按美元\n21 计价的？\n22 答：嗯，对账单的这特定一页在右上角\n23 有USD字样。\n24 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请转到下一张\n25 幻灯片。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭记录公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct（直接询问）\n1 问：重点看银行对账单本页的第三\n2 行，那笔交易的日期是什么？您能\n3 解释一下细节吗。\n4 答：那笔交易的日期是6月2日，——2021年，\n5 它是来自红利款的$13,000,000贷记——上面写着\n6 来自Lamp Capital的红利款。所以——我的理解是\n7 那是从Lamp Capital向该账户转账\n8 $13,000,000。\n9 默里女士：好的。洛夫特斯女士，返回Z26\n10 幻灯片13。\n11 问：欣顿先生，我们刚才看过的这两笔交易，\n12 700万和1300万，总共就是反映在该汇总\n13 图表右侧流向上的2000万吗？\n14 答：是的。\n15 默里女士：转到下一张幻灯片。\n16 问：我想稍微谈谈G|CLUBS和Crane（克兰）。\n17 首先，欣顿先生，出于这些汇总的目的，是谁认定\n18 Crane账户与G|CLUBS类别\n19 相关联的？\n20 答：政府方。\n21 问：对于Crane是什么，您有任何独立的了解吗？\n22 答：没有。\n23 问：好的。看这里，内容很多，所以\n24 我们要稍微拆解一下。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭记录公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - Direct（直接询问）\n1 这里是否显示了属于政府方所认定的\n2 G|CLUBS和Crane类别内的某些资金来源\n3 的流向？\n4 答：是的，某些选定的资金和某些选定的账户，\n5 是的。\n6 问：这张幻灯片是否仅反映了流向以及通过各个\n7 G Club和Crane账户的流向的一个子集？\n8 答：是的，只是一个子集。\n9 问：我们来看看这里反映的\n10 几笔交易。\n11 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，如果我们能转到——\n12 问：嗯，首先，欣顿先生，您能否稍微解释一下我们\n13 在这里使用的配色方案，以便陪审团\n14 理解这些颜色反映了什么。\n15 答：好的。这里的想法是对同一实体或实体组的\n16 所有不同账户使用相同的颜色。\n17 因此，G|CLUBS实体显示为深蓝色，Crane\n18 实体显示为浅蓝色，而Hamilton（汉密尔顿）和Himalaya（喜马拉雅）\n19 实体显示为黄色。\n20 问：在右上角有一笔从Farms（农场）流入\n21 Crane Advisory（克兰顾问公司）的资金。Farms反映的是什么颜色？\n22 答：是的，我们始终使用绿色来表示Farms\n23 实体。\n24 问：好的。那么我们来稍微拆解一下。\n25 默里女士：请转到下一张幻灯片，\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭记录公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - 直接询问\n洛夫特斯女士（Ms. Loftus）。\n问：辛顿先生（Mr. Hinton），现在把注意力集中在选定资金流向汇总中的 G|CLUBS 部分，您能否为我们梳理一下最终流入 G Club Operations（G Club 运营）在 Morgan Stanley（摩根士丹利）开立的账户（即此处列出的三个账户）的各项资金流向？\n答：好的。在 2021年2月3日 至 2021年7月9日 期间，有 860万美元 从方框中列出的“资金来源”（Sources of Funds）转移至 G Club 在摩根士丹利的那些账户。\n问：从总体层面来看，如这里所反映的流入摩根士丹利账户的其他资金，我们可以看到资金是从哪里流入这些摩根士丹利账户的？\n答：这些资金来自 G Club Operations 在两家不同银行开立的其他账户。\n问：从左侧开始，您能否按顺时针方向，从 Signature 账户开始从左下角读起？\n答：当然可以。在 Signature Bank（标志银行）有一个 G|CLUBS Operations LLC（G|CLUBS 运营有限责任公司）的 3576 账户，该账户于 2021年1月11日 向 G Club Operations 的摩根士丹利账户转账了 1450万美元。\n顺时针旋转的下一个，是 G|CLUBS Operations 在——我认为是 First Bank（第一银行）开立的 7085 账户，在 2020年12月17日 有一笔 5220万美元 的转账转入 G Club Operations 的摩根士丹利账户。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法院速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - 直接询问\n最后，还有一个单独的尾号为 7052 的 G Club Operations 第一银行账户。转账金额为 10万美元，时间是 2020年12月29日。\n问：辛顿先生，您刚才讨论的这三笔转账中的每一笔都对应一个单一的日期，对吗？\n答：是的。\n问：这些转账中的每一笔都是转入 G|CLUBS 摩根士丹利账户的单独交易吗？\n答：我认为是的，但这是凭我的——我的记忆。\n问：然后从摩根士丹利账户来看，这份汇总图表中反映的两笔流出资金是什么？\n答：是的，在 2021年1月21日 至 2021年2月4日 期间，有一笔总额为 1000万美元 的流出资金转给 Fiesta Property Developments Limited（嘉年华地产发展有限公司），此外还有一系列向 Mercantile Bank（商业银行）的 G|CLUBS International（G|CLUBS 国际）账户的转账，在 2021年8月20日 至 2021年10月8日 期间累计达到 6270万美元。\n问：辛顿先生，您知道 Fiesta Property Developments Limited 是什么吗？\n答：我不知道。\n默里女士（MS. MURRAY）：好的。我们进入下一张幻灯片，洛夫特斯女士。\n问：我现在想聚焦于此处反映的选定资金流向中的 Crane 部分。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO1 Hinton - 直接询问\n辛顿先生，我们不会逐一梳理每笔交易的细节，但从直接指向 Citi（花旗）5278 账户的“资金来源”箭头开始，那里显示的金额是多少？\n答：5950万美元。\n问：时间跨度是多久？\n答：2020年11月23日 至 2021年4月1日。\n问：然后顺着那个箭头笔直向下，这里反映的从该花旗账户流出的下一笔资金是什么？\n答：是的，Citibank（花旗银行）同一个属于 Crane Advisory Group（鹤岗咨询集团）的花旗账户向 Crane Advisory Group 在摩根士丹利的账户转账了 5820万美元。\n问：我想简要关注一下最右侧的 Crane Advisory Group 账户，即 Capital One（第一资本）0887 账户。您看到了吗？\n答：看到了。\n（续见下一页）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 直接询问\n由默里女士继续询问：\n问：该账户既有资金流入也有资金流出，对吗？\n答：是的。\n问：看一下上面向下的 2530万美元 的其他流入资金，这在该图表中反映了什么类型的交易？\n答：这些是在该时间段内不是来自图表上明确列出的其他实体的所有交易。\n问：然后在这段时间内有一笔或多笔流出资金，即 4200万美元，这笔资金在什么时间段内从第一资本流向了哪些账户？\n答：在 2021年5月28日 至 7月13日 之间。\n问：那是流向了在哪家银行开立的 Crane Advisory 账户？\n答：在摩根士丹利。\n默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请翻到下一张幻灯片，把 G/Club 和 Crane 这两部分结合起来。\n问：看这里，现在把它们整合在一起了，特别是页面中线偏左有一笔从 Crane Advisory Group 的摩根士丹利账户流向 G/Club 的摩根士丹利账户的资金流，如果可以的话请高亮标注一下，洛夫特斯女士。\n从 Crane 到 G/Club 的这笔汇总转账的总金额是多少？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 直接询问\n答：在此期间，Crane Advisory 的摩根士丹利账户与 G/Club Operations 的摩根士丹利账户之间转账的总金额为 8710万美元。\n问：那笔 8710万美元 转账的时间段是怎样的？\n答：是在 2021年5月24日 至 2021年7月2日 期间进行的一系列转账。\n问：洛夫特斯女士，让我们看下一张幻灯片，加入 Himalaya Exchange（喜马拉雅交易所）实体。\n辛顿先生，现在看我们刚刚结束的那些账户，即 G/Club 摩根士丹利账户，在 2021年5月6日 至 2021年6月23日 期间此处反映的流出资金是多少？\n答：8500万美元。\n问：洛夫特斯女士，请为陪审团高亮显示左侧从 G/Club 到 Hamilton（汉密尔顿）的部分。\n然后再看那个 Hamilton Digital Assets（汉密尔顿数字资产）账户，我们看到另一笔金额为 8500万美元 的资金流。对吗？\n答：对的。\n问：这组汇总资金流的时间段是怎样的？\n答：从 2021年9月1日 至 9月16日。\n问：那笔资金流向了以什么名称开立的银行账户？\n答：Hamilton Opportunity Fund（汉密尔顿机会基金）。\n问：在哪家银行？\n答：在 Silvergate Bank（银门银行），9306 账户。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 直接询问\n问：现在关注该银门账户，即 Hamilton Opportunity Fund，上方还有另一笔来自一个 Himalaya International Clearing（喜马拉雅国际清算）实体的流入资金。您看到了吗？\n答：看到了。\n问：那笔金额是多少？\n答：是 2500万美元。\n问：洛夫特斯女士，请切入下一张幻灯片。\n辛顿先生，现在看右边，我们看的是 2021年9月 和 10月 期间流向 Lawall & Mitchell, LLC 账户的一系列资金流。您看到了吗？\n答：看到了。\n问：您能否读出图表中反映的从各个 Crane 账户流入该账户的金额和日期？\n答：摩根士丹利账户在 10月19日 汇出 680万美元。IDB bank（以色列贴现银行）账户在 9月27日 汇出 160万美元。Signature Bank 账户在 2021年9月27日 至 10月12日 之间汇出 230万美元，Crane Advisory 在第一资本的账户在 2021年9月26日 汇出 3700万美元。\n问：看下一张幻灯片。我想继续按我们这份汇总的时间顺序讲下去。\n我们再次看到页面中间 Hamilton Opportunity 银门账户。在 2021年10月27日 该账户现在有一笔流出资金。您看到了吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 直接询问\n答：看到了。\n问：该资金流的金额是多少？\n答：5900万美元。\n问：那是从哪家银行开立的 Hamilton Opportunity Fund 账户流向哪家银行开立的 Hamilton Opportunity 账户？\n答：这是同一实体 Hamilton Opportunity Fund 在银门银行开立的两个账户之间的转账，即从 9306 账户转入 7747 账户。\n问：洛夫特斯女士，请看下一张幻灯片。\n我们在这里看到了什么？\n答：我们看到在同一天从银门银行 7747 账户转入银门银行编号为 7739 的第三个 Hamilton Opportunity Fund 账户的相同金额。\n问：那些来自 Hamilton Opportunity Fund 账户的 5900万美元 转账，是在同一天在不同账户之间进行的转账，对吗？\n答：对的。\n问：请看下一张幻灯片。\n在这张幻灯片底部现在有一个列为银门银行 7713 的账户。您看到了吗？\n答：看到了。\n问：该账户是以什么实体名称开立的？\n答：那也是 Hamilton Opportunity Fund SPC（汉密尔顿机会基金独立投资组合公司）。\n问：那么我们看一下流入该账户的资金，既有来自左侧 Hamilton Opportunity Fund SPC 7721 银门账户的，也有来自右侧 Hamilton Opportunity Fund SPC 7739 银门账户的，对吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 直接询问\n答：是的。2021年11月15日 有 560万美元 从银门 7721 账户转入银门 7713 账户。\n问：然后看右侧，从 7739 转入 7713 的转账呢？\n答：是的，那笔是在 2021年12月2日 转账的 4650万美元。\n问：洛夫特斯女士，请看下一张幻灯片。\n辛顿先生，这又是我们一直在看的更广泛的 G/Club/Crane 汇总图表的一个子集。如您所见，G/Club International Limited 在商业银行的这个账户上有高亮标注。您看到了吗？\n答：看到了。\n问：图表中反映的流入该账户的资金中，从 G/Club Operations 摩根士丹利账户转入的金额是多少？\n答：6270万美元。\n问：请看下一张幻灯片。\n辛顿先生，这张幻灯片的标题是什么？\n答：G/Club 选定资金流向与支出（G/Club select flows and expenses）。\n问：看顶端这里，我们是否从上一张幻灯片中刚刚看到的流入了 6270万美元 的那个账户开始进行这一资金流向汇总分析？\n答：是的。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 直接询问\n问：关注此处反映的几笔流出资金。我们从右侧的蓝色部分开始。\n右侧流向 Yacht Zoo, LLC 的流出资金显示了什么？\n答：显示在 2021年10月26日 至 2022年9月1日 期间，转账了 478,000美元。\n问：然后看红色部分，这里的汇总图表反映了哪一类交易？\n答：红色标志与车辆相关的费用有关。\n问：那些汇总的车辆相关费用的金额是多少？\n答：640万美元。\n问：辛顿先生，我们之前看过的车辆相关费用，那些是源自不同银行账户的费用，对吗？\n答：对的。\n问：Lamp Capital 账户？\n答：对的。\n问：而这些费用是来自以什么实体名称开立的账户？\n答：G/Club International Limited。\n问：继续往下看，有一个名为 Stone Offer Design 的条目。您看到了吗？\n答：看到了。\n问：我们看到交易从哪些账户流入……\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton（欣顿）- Direct（主询问）\n1 Stone Offer（斯通要约）设计？\n2 答：我们看到既有来自G/Club International Mercantile（G会所国际商业）账户的付款，也有来自单独一个TD Bank（道明银行）账户中G/Clubs Operations（G会所运营）的付款。\n5 问：向左看，Hinton先生，左上方有一个资金来源部分，该资金流同时流入G/Club Operations账户和Himalaya International Clearing（喜马拉雅国际清算）账户。您看到了吗？\n9 答：看到了。\n10 问：资金来源中反映的款项，是否包括政府为Brattle（布拉特尔集团）指明的进账资金来源？\n13 答：是的，这些是来自相关实体的资金来源，我们此前已说明过政府是如何指示我们对其进行识别的。\n16 问：根据本幻灯片上的信息，这是否包括Himalaya Exchange（喜马拉雅交易所）——体现为流入喜马拉雅国际清算的资金流——以及G/Clubs——体现为流入G/Club Operations的资金流——两者的资金来源？\n21 答：是的。\n22 问：我们把重点放在最左侧。我们看到有一笔资金流流入G/Club Operations，那么在2022年3月2日至2022年4月12日期间，我们随后看到700万美元流向了哪里？\n25 答：有多笔累计转账至——我不确定这家瑞士银行的名字怎么读，但它就在那里。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 主询问\n1 瑞士银行的名字怎么读，但它就在那里。\n2 问：我向您说明那是Kyrgyz Swiss Bank（吉尔吉斯瑞士银行）。\n3 答：谢谢。\n4 问：让我们通过银行记录来看这些交易。Loftus女士（洛夫特斯女士），请切换到Government Exhibit TDB-93（政府物证TDB-93）。Loftus女士，我们从第一页开始。\n7 Hinton先生，这是您在本案工作中审阅过的银行记录之一吗？\n9 答：是的。\n10 问：该记录的对账单周期是怎样的？\n11 答：是2022年1月14日至同年的1月31日。\n13 问：开立该账户的实体名称和地址是什么？\n15 答：是G/Club Operations, LLC（G会所运营有限责任公司），地址为纽约州纽约市东64街162号（162 East 64th Street, New York, New York）。\n17 问：右侧主账号的后四位是什么？\n19 答：2044。\n20 问：在账户摘要这里，该账户在本对账单周期的期初余额是多少？\n22 答：期初余额为零。\n23 问：Loftus女士，请翻到第8页并向下滚动。在其他取款部分，Hinton先生，您能读一下3月2日的第一笔取款吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 主询问\n1 答：好的。3月2日，有一笔汇出至吉尔吉斯瑞士银行的电汇，金额为300万美元。\n3 问：然后Loftus女士，请翻到第12页。并向下滚动到那里的其他取款部分。关于这里4月12日的第一条记录，Hinton先生，您看到了吗？\n7 答：是的，这是一笔名称类似的汇出电汇，金额为400万美元。\n9 问：那是汇往哪家银行？\n10 答：汇往吉尔吉斯瑞士银行。\n11 问：那么这两笔交易，即300万美元和400万美元，是否共同构成了我们在Z26第25页汇总图表的资金流中看到的700万美元？\n14 答：是的。\n15 问：Loftus女士，让我们回到Z26。请翻到第26张幻灯片。我现在想宏观地谈谈喜马拉雅交易所的部分资金流。\n18 Hinton先生，从左上方这里的资金来源开始。再次提问，喜马拉雅交易所资金流汇总中反映的资金来源，与我们之前讨论的是同一类资金吗？\n22 答：是的。\n23 问：那么顺着最左侧的线一直往下看，如果您能读一下金额、日期范围以及款项流经的账户？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 主询问\n1 答：好的。在2021年6月2日至2022年6月30日期间，从资金来源转入喜马拉雅国际清算FV 3763账户的累计转账金额为4.738亿美元。\n4 问：然后从该FV Bank（FV银行）国际清算账户中，我们看到在2022年3月21日至5月13日期间反映了哪些流入资金？\n7 答：累计转账8000万美元至同家银行的另一个Himalaya International Clearing Limited（喜马拉雅国际清算有限公司）账户，但该账户尾号为2119。\n10 问：从那里开始，这里反映的下一笔资金流是什么？\n11 答：好的。随后在2022年3月5日至2022年5月13日期间，有3000万美元流向Himalaya International Financial Group Limited（喜马拉雅国际金融集团有限公司）的Mercantile账户。\n14 问：再看幻灯片中间偏中位置，Hinton先生，还有另一个喜马拉雅国际清算账户。您看到了吗，尾号是0133？\n17 答：看到了。\n18 问：该账户开立在哪个银行？\n19 答：同样是在Mercantile Bank（商业银行）。\n20 问：根据这里反映的情况，从FV银行3763清算账户以及资金来源流入该账户的款项有多少？\n22 答：来自FV银行喜马拉雅国际清算有限公司的累计款项有2.2亿美元，来自资金来源的有3690万美元，合计为2.569亿美元。\n25 问：这里还反映了另一笔流入\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 主询问\n1 商业银行清算账户的资金，来自右侧，那是多少金额，来自哪个账户或哪个实体？\n4 答：是的。那是2021年12月2日来自G/Club International Limited（G会所国际有限公司）的一笔5000万美元转账。\n6 问：所以那是从G/Club International流向喜马拉雅国际清算的5000万美元，对吗？\n8 答：对。\n9 问：再看从商业银行的喜马拉雅国际清算流向Hamilton Opportunity Fund（汉密尔顿机会基金）的流出款项，该流出款项的总金额是多少？\n12 答：5100万美元。\n13 问：该款项流入的汉密尔顿机会基金银行账户是哪一个？\n15 答：是一个尾号为7739的Silvergate（银门银行）账户。\n16 问：Loftus女士，请翻到下一张幻灯片。Hinton先生，我想重点关注这里反映的底部资金流。从我们讨论过的喜马拉雅国际金融集团商业银行账户（0139账户），我们在2022年4月15日看到了什么资金流？\n21 答：我们看到一笔转入Zeisler & Zeisler, PC（蔡斯勒与蔡斯勒律师事务所）IOLTA account（律师信托账户）的3700万美元转账。\n23 问：您知道Zeisler & Zeisler PC是什么吗？\n24 答：据我了解是一家律师事务所。\n25 问：您是否知道Zeisler & Zeisler在\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 主询问\n1 政府的案件中扮演什么角色（如果有的话）？\n2 答：不知道。\n3 问：我们翻到下一张幻灯片。我们专门关注与各个账户的部分交易相关、此前讨论过的各类支出中的一项。Loftus女士，请看下一张幻灯片。Hinton先生，这张幻灯片的标题是什么？\n8 答：这张幻灯片的标题是Yacht Zoo, LLC支出汇总。\n9 问：这张幻灯片顶部是什么？\n10 答：是一个代表Yacht Zoo, LLC（Yacht Zoo有限责任公司）的椭圆形。\n11 问：从左向右逆时针方向看，这是否代表来自我们一直在讨论的不同账户流入Yacht Zoo, LLC的各项不同资金？\n14 答：是的。它们实质上是那些账户的支出，即转入Yacht Zoo, LLC账户的款项。\n16 问：仅根据本汇总图表上反映的银行交易，在2020年5月7日至2022年10月21日期间流入Yacht Zoo, LLC的累计金额是多少？Loftus女士，在中间那里。\n20 答：是的，是390万美元。\n21 问：从左边Lamp Capital Signature账户开始，那笔180万美元累计资金流的日期范围是什么？\n24 答：180万美元。\n25 问：日期范围是什么？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 主询问\n1 答：是2021年5月7日至2021年9月13日。\n2 问：下一个账户，即以Lamp Capital（朗普资本）名义开立的IDB（以色列贴现银行）账户，那些向Yacht Zoo, LLC付款的日期范围是什么？\n5 答：2021年10月25日至12月20日。\n6 问：中间那里的Lamp Capital, LLC，DCB即Dime Community Bank（Dime社区银行），从该账户流向Yacht Zoo的金额是多少？\n9 答：990,000美元。\n10 问：继续向右，HCHK Tech，从该账户转账至Yacht Zoo的日期是什么？\n12 答：2022年10月21日。\n13 问：顺便问一下，您也看到有资金从G/Club流向Yacht Zoo，那一组交易的总金额是多少？\n16 答：478,000美元。\n17 问：让我们来看其中一笔HCHK Tech向Yacht Zoo, LLC的转账。Loftus女士，请调出Government Exhibit MTB-83（政府物证MTB-83）。我们先看顶部。看右侧这里，账号后四位是什么？\n22 答：账号尾号为2176。\n23 问：这份特定银行记录的对账单周期是怎样的？\n24 答：2022年10月1日至10月31日。\n25 问：该特定银行\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 主询问\n1 账户的名称和地址是什么？\n2 答：是HCHK Technologies, Inc（HCHK科技有限公司），地址为纽约州纽约市莱克星顿大道750号（750 Lexington Avenue, New York, New York）。\n4 问：Loftus女士，请缩小页面并向下看一点。请看2022年10月21日的第二条记录。Hinton先生，您看到了吗？\n7 答：看到了。\n8 问：在该HCHK Tech银行记录中反映的该笔交易的描述是什么？\n10 答：该条目显示为汇出chips转账auto rep Yacht Zoo Limited G Fashion Hold Co. B Li。\n12 问：您知道G Fashion hold Co. B. Li是指什么吗？\n13 答：我想是一个G Fashion（G时尚）实体。\n14 问：看右侧显示交易金额的第二列，这里的交易金额是多少？\n16 答：123,452美元。\n17 问：Loftus女士，让我们回到Z26第30张幻灯片。这是否就是我们在该汇总图表上看到的四舍五入后的123,000美元？\n20 答：是的。\n21 问：我们继续，请翻到下一张幻灯片。Hinton先生，这是不是在您的作证过程中我们一直在看的各主要类别的资金来源宏观汇总？\n25 答：是的。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 主询问\n1 问：如果您能带我们从左到右看一下——再次为了明确起见，Hinton先生，我们一直在审阅的汇总图表，是否确实仅反映了布拉特尔收到的记录中全部交易的一部分？\n6 答：没错。\n7 问：布拉特尔也没有处理从政府收到的每一份银行记录，这也是正确的吗？\n9 答：是的，没错。\n10 问：那么关于资金来源，流向GTV/VOG类别的累计金额大约是多少？\n12 答：在我们处理的所有交易中（该类别有数千笔），流向GTV和VOG的累计金额为4.11亿美元。\n15 问：那么对于农场类别呢，政府确定的流向农场类别的资金来源累计金额是多少？\n18 答：在我们处理的交易中，归类为从资金来源流向农场实体的交易价值1.1亿美元。\n21 问：G/Clubs类别呢？\n22 答：同样对于G/Clubs类别，我们确认并处理了来自资金来源账户的2.4亿美元单笔交易。\n25 问：最后是喜马拉雅交易所类别，\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 直接询问\n1 流向该类别的已处理资金总额是多少？\n2 答：5.17亿美元。\n3 问：Loftus（洛夫特斯）女士，请翻到下一张幻灯片。Hinton（欣顿）先生，这张为我们做了总结。\n4\n5 在这四大类别中，我们看到从资金来源流向这些类别的金额是多少？\n6\n7 答：总计达13亿美元。\n8 问：我们看下一张幻灯片。\n9 从这笔总计13亿美元的资金来源流出的款项，在这张幻灯片底部反映了什么？\n10\n11 答：是的。在幻灯片底部，我们表明统共从这四家实体（即归入这四个类别的实体）发生了资金流出。从我们处理的所有交易中，我们能够确定流入另外这两组账户的净流入额。\n12\n13 问：首先看左边，家族办公室和家族成员，这个集合类别是否反映了我们昨天在Government Exhibit Z27（政府物证Z27）上看到的内容，即政府在其中认定了谁符合家族成员资格，或者什么符合家族办公室资格？\n14\n15 答：对。我想您指的是那份标有多种漂亮颜色的所有不同账户清单，我们其中有一列是家族办公室和家族成员。在底部有一个脚注，说明了归入该列的实体有哪些。\n16\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭记录公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 直接询问\n1\n2 问：就此汇总图表而言，此处对家族办公室和成员的分类是否与另一张汇总图表上的分类相同？\n3\n4 答：是的，相同。\n5 问：我们看到的从总计13亿美元流向家族办公室或家族成员的净流入额是多少？\n6\n7 答：我们计算出的净流入金额（即流入金额减去流出的任何金额）为1亿美元。\n8\n9 问：再看右边William Je（余建明）拥有的公司，这些公司是否就是我们昨天讨论过的、政府为您指认的Hamilton（汉密尔顿）和ACA Capital（ACA资本）实体？\n10\n11 答：没错。\n12 问：在总计13亿美元中，我们看到流入那些公司（即William Je拥有的公司）的大致净流入额是多少？\n13\n14 答：从这四家不同的实体中，我们看到流入ACA Capital和Hamilton账户的净流入额为5.5亿美元。\n15\n16 问：Loftus女士，请翻到下一张幻灯片。\n17 Hinton先生，这张幻灯片的标题是什么？\n18 答：标题是“按类别划分的累计资金来源流入额”。\n19 问：这是对我们刚才在前几张幻灯片中看过的13亿美元资金来源款项的另一种直观展示吗？\n20\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 直接询问\n1\n2 答：是的，它只是展示了随着时间的推移它是如何累积起来的。\n3 问：您能向陪审团解释一下不同的颜色代表什么，以及从这里的2020年到2023年它们是如何随时间累积的吗？\n4\n5 答：好的。因为我们是从总共20多万笔单独交易中累积出这个数字的，我们有每一笔交易的日期，所以可以按日计算。在本案中我们是按月计算的，即归入这四个不同类别的所有账户的累计流入金额，每一种类别都有不同的颜色。因此，在每条色带之下是许许多多的单个实体，而对于每个实体，又有许多单独的账户在以资金来源的形式接收款项。\n6\n7 问：Hinton先生，在每条色带内汇总的金额，是否就是与此图表底部所示类别相关的金额？\n8\n9 答：这些是截至2023年7月底所达到的金额。您可以看到，在每种情况下，它们都是在不同的时间点逐渐累积达到该总额的。\n10\n11 问：从该图表的底部往上看，根据底部的图例和颜色，我们是否首先是GTV/VOG，加上农场，然后是G/Club，最后看起来是在2022年底的某个时间点开始的Himalaya Exchange（喜马拉雅交易所），对吗？\n12\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1\n2 答：是的，只要将它们叠加起来，您就可以看到它们总共是多少。\n3 问：Hinton先生，在本案中，就我们昨天和今天向陪审团出示的汇总物证而言，是否是政府编制或告知了其希望在那些汇总图表上反映哪些信息？\n4\n5 答：是的。\n6 问：在编制或审核这些汇总图表的过程中，您和Brattle（布拉特尔）是否听取了政府的指示？\n7\n8 答：是的。\n9 MS. MURRAY（默里检察官）：法官阁下，可以给我一点时间吗？\n10 THE COURT（法庭）：可以。\n11 MS. MURRAY：谢谢您，Hinton先生。我没有其他问题了。\n12 THE COURT：开始交叉询问。\n13 MR. KAMARAJU（卡马拉朱律师）：谢谢您，法官阁下。\n14 交叉询问\n15 由MR. KAMARAJU主问：\n16 问：早上好，Hinton先生。\n17 答：早上好。\n18 MR. KAMARAJU：法官阁下，在开始之前，先处理一点程序性事务。此时我想宣读一份双方当事人之间的Stipulation（协议事项/约定）。\n19\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1\n2 THE COURT：请讲。\n3 MR. KAMARAJU：请调出Government Exhibit Stip-14（政府物证Stip-14），该物证已采纳为证据，我们可以向法庭出示公布。\n4\n5 “United States of America（美利坚合众国）与被告Miles Guo（郭文贵）特此约定并同意，下列所列物证均由政府合法取得，并且是A栏所列实体的真实记录，该等记录系由了解记录所述事项的人员在当时或临近时间制作，或根据其传递的信息制作。该等记录是在定期开展的活动过程中保存的，制作该等记录是该实体的常规做法。”\n6\n7 然后能否翻到该协议事项的第8页。\n8 “进一步约定并同意，C栏所列的辩方物证可以在审判中作为辩方物证予以接收。” 然后请翻回首页。\n9\n10 法官阁下，依据本协议事项，我此时提出几项物证。\n11 THE COURT：好的。\n12 MS. MURRAY：没有异议。\n13 MR. KAMARAJU：辩方提出DX-11124至11129、DX-11255、DX-11432至11436、DX-10299至DX-10301、DX-13005至DX-10329、DX-10526、DX-10528至DX-10530、DX-10551至DX-10562、DX-10564至DX-10577、DX-11299至DX-11300、DX-11302、DX-11304及DX-11305、DX-11485、DX-11486至DX-11488、DX-11489、DX-11491至DX-11492、DX-11548至DX-11549、DX-11552至DX-11553、DX-11562至DX-11570、DX-10430至DX-10457、DX-10960至DX-10971、DX-11073至DX-11078、DX-11110至DX-11121、DX-11493至DX-11506、DX-10007、DX-10531、DX-10606至DX-10626、DX-10008至DX-10010、DX-10330至DX-10356、DX-10578至DX-10605、DX-11256至DX-11257、DX-11281、DX-11517至DX-11526、DX-11572至DX-11573、DX-11581、DX-11585、DX-10357至DX-10359、DX-10627至DX-10631、DX-10972、DX-10013、DX-10017至DX-10028、DX-10360至DX-10373。\n14\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1\n2 （律师商议）\n3 MR. KAMARAJU：法官阁下，如果能加快进度的话，我提出该协议事项C栏中的所有物证。\n4 THE COURT：准予采纳。\n5 （Defendant's Exhibits［被告物证］DX-11124至11129、DX-11255、DX-11432至11436、DX-10299至DX-10301、DX-13005至DX-10329、DX-10526、DX-10528至DX-10530、DX-10551至DX-10562、DX-10564至DX-10577、DX-11299至DX-11300、DX-11302、DX-11304及DX-11305、DX-11485、DX-11486至DX-11488、DX-11489、DX-11491至DX-11492、DX-11548至DX-11549、DX-11552至DX-11553、DX-11562至DX-11570、DX-10430至DX-10457、DX-10960至DX-10971、DX-11073至DX-11078、DX-11110至DX-11121、DX-11493至DX-11506、DX-10007、DX-10531、DX-10606至DX-10626、DX-10008至DX-10010、DX-10330至DX-10356、DX-10578至DX-10605、DX-11256至DX-11257、DX-11281、DX-11517至DX-11526、DX-11572至DX-11573、DX-11581、DX-11585、DX-10357至DX-10359、DX-10627至DX-10631、DX-10972、DX-10013、DX-10017至DX-10028、DX-10360至DX-10373采纳为证据）\n6\n7 MR. KAMARAJU：谢谢。\n8 由MR. KAMARAJU主问：\n9 问：Hinton先生，还有另一件程序性细节，请您向陪审团确认一下，先生，您事实上不是中国间谍，对吗？\n10\n11 答：是的。\n12 问：谢谢。那么，Brattle最初是在2023年夏天受聘于政府的，对吗？\n13\n14 答：是的。\n15 问：Brattle有一个团队在做这个项目，对吧？\n16 答：是的。\n17 问：从Brattle受聘之初您就参与其中了，对吗？\n18 答：对的。\n19 问：在受聘期间，Brattle的工作得到了政府的报酬？\n20\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1\n2 答：没错。\n3 问：我相信您在直接询问中作证说您收到了约200万美元，对吗？\n4\n5 答：嗯，我认为那是对费用金额的估计。我不确定实际收取了多少。\n6\n7 问：政府欠您200万美元？\n8 答：正如我所说，我认为我——我们已经计提了一定数额的费用。\n9\n10 问：除其他事项外，该工作还包括进行您在直接询问中作证提到的资金分析，对吗？\n11\n12 答：对的。\n13 问：您只是从检察官那里了解到GTV的，对吧？\n14 答：是的。\n15 问：您只是从检察官那里了解到农场贷款项目的，对吗？\n16 答：是的。\n17 问：G/Clubs也是一样，对吧？\n18 答：是的。\n19 问：Himalaya Exchange也是一样，对吧？\n20 答：是的。\n21 问：那么，您是从检察官那里了解到Guo（郭）先生的吗？\n22 答：不是。\n23 问：您什么时候第一次听说他的？\n24 答：在政府联系我们的时候。\n25 问：您今天的证词是关于您为本案证据所编制的汇总，对吧？\n26\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1\n2 答：是的。\n3 问：检察官向您提供了他们希望您进行汇总的证据，对吧？\n4\n5 答：一开始他们向我们提供了大量的文件，我们必须进行某种程度的识别，然后他们从中挑选了某些文件让我们放到特定的图表上。\n6\n7 问：所以可以公平地说，是他们指认了希望汇总的证据？\n8\n9 答：是的。\n10 问：作为其中的一部分，例如，他们给出了希望您重点关注的公司，对吧？\n11\n12 答：是的。\n13 问：银行账户也是一样，他们把那些也给了您，对吧？\n14\n15 答：是的。\n16 问：他们告诉了您他们想要什么样的图表，对吧？\n17 答：没错。\n18 问：他们指示您对这些图表进行修改，对吧？\n19 答：是的，增加内容，是的，进行调整。\n20 问：增加、删减、修改，各种各样的变动，对吧？\n21 答：是的。\n22 问：您还作证说您一直在认真地进行工作……\n23\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 盘问\n1 这个项目，我想是从年初开始的；对吗？\n2 答：那是工作比较密集的时期，是的。\n3 问：所以尽管 Brattle（百赋）已被聘用一年多，\n4 但检察官直到昨晚仍在指示对您的图表进行修改，对吗？\n5 答：是的。\n6 问：我想稍微谈谈这个过程。\n7 我想您在主询问中作证谈到了 Brattle 用于分析\n8 数据的过程，对吗？\n9 答：谈到了一点，是的。\n10 问：不是全部过程，只是稍微谈了一点，对吗？\n11 答：是的。\n12 问：那就是说，用通俗的话来讲，也许您以不同的方式对数据进行了清洗？\n13 答：我不会那么说。\n14 问：但该过程的一部分是确定什么是与任务相关的，对吗？\n15 答：嗯，对我来说不是。\n16 问：那正是我接下来的问题。是由政府来确定什么是相关的，对吗？\n17 答：是的。\n18 问：然后他们告诉您，对吗？\n19 答：是的。\n20 问：然后您去把它们找出来，对吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（南方区法庭速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 盘问\n1 答：不是。\n2 问：那么在政府告诉您他们认为什么是相关的之后，您做什么呢？\n3 答：我认为顺序稍微有些不同。他们把记录交给我们。我们告诉他们记录里有什么，然后他们告诉我们他们希望我们处理其中的哪些记录。但在我们处理之前他们并不知道记录里有什么，所以我们随后要与政府分享结果。\n4 问：所以这是一个来回沟通的过程；可以这么说吗？\n5 答：是的。\n6 问：您告诉他们，外面有这些东西。他们说，那是我们关心的，对吗？\n7 答：没错。\n8 问：而且他们从未告诉过您他们关心任何对郭先生（Mr. Guo）有利的事情，对吗？\n9 答：我不知道。\n10 问：因为那不在您的聘用范围之内，对吗？\n11 答：抱歉。\n12 问：撤回该问题。那么，检察官也审查了您的汇总图表的准确性，对吗？\n13 答：我认为是的。\n14 问：那是他们做出修改或提出修改建议以确保准确性的一部分吗，先生？\n15 答：与其说是为了准确性，不如说是为了确保他们希望包含的所有交易都实际被包含了，\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 盘问\n1 而不是那些不应该包含的交易。\n2 问：Brattle 是否对自己图表的准确性进行了独立核查？\n3 答：是的。\n4 问：您能向我们描述一下那个过程吗？\n5 答：嗯，有许多不同的核查。显然，在进行数据库处理和数据提取时，各个团队成员都在互相检查彼此的工作。但最终在这里发生的情况是，在根据政府希望在图表上呈现的交易生成图表后，我们能够识别与这些交易相关的每一份原始单据，然后根据这些原始单据核对金额。\n6 问：那么我们来看其中一张图表。能请调出政府物证 Z26（Government Exhibit Z26）吗。能请翻到第四张幻灯片吗。\n7 您在主询问中就此作证过，对吗，先生？\n8 答：是的。\n9 问：首先，资金来源框，哪些来源归入其中？\n10 答：嗯，资金来源被确定为来自个人账户的资金流，其中这些个人并非已被确定为利害关系人的人员，也非与我们为政府给我们的类别所涉及的实体处理的任何公司协议有关联的人员。\n11 在我在主询问中讨论的某些图表中也有过，\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 盘问\n1 您可能记得有某些流入 G/Clubs/Crane 账户的款项是 10,000、20,000、30,000、40,000、50,000 的整数金额，其中银行记录中实际上并未指明个人的姓名，该信息是空白的。但在那些特定情况下，政府告诉我们也要将那些款项归类为流入，作为资金来源。\n2 问：明白了。那么除了您谈到的最后一个类别（盲签合同）之外，可以公平地说资金来源的过程是一个排除法过程吗？\n3 答：我不会那么说。\n4 问：嗯，您排除了利害关系人，对吗？\n5 答：不，我们首先是识别政府告诉我们处理的账户中的所有交易，并识别所有来自个人的资金流入交易。\n6 问：然后您对那些个人进行了归类，对吗？\n7 答：然后我们确定了那些个人中有哪些（如有）不应包含在内，并将他们排除在外。\n8 问：而不应包含在内的一组人就是利害关系人，对吗？\n9 答：是的。\n10 问：谁决定了什么是利害关系人？\n11 答：政府。\n12 问：您能给我举个例子说明利害关系人类别中的某些人是谁吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 盘问\n1 答：例如，那就是出现在家庭成员类别中的人或被告。\n2 问：那么还有其他被您排除的类别的人吗？\n3 答：是的。正如我所说，有些人在我的汇总图表中的各个类别的实体之间的服务协议和其他合同中被确定为签署人或交易对手方。\n4 问：那些是由政府向您指出的服务协议吗？\n5 答：是的。政府交予我们的任务之一，实际上我们的首个任务就是审查各种不同类型的协议，包括我们在我主询问中讨论过的农场贷款。那些贷款有一份详细清单。那些实际上是个别的贷款文件，那些属于我们处理的协议中的一部分。\n6 问：那么您在主询问中作证提到的农场贷款文件，是由出借人签署的，对吗？\n7 答：是的。\n8 问：但没有借款人签署，对吗？\n9 答：是的。\n10 问：您是否将出借人从资金来源中排除了？\n11 答：没有，只是排除了与这些农场（GTV、Himalaya 等）各个类别中的实体相关联的人员。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 盘问\n1 问：所以在协议交易对手方的概念范围内还有进一步的筛选，对吗？\n2 答：是的。因此，任何身为协议一方且为这些实体之一工作或代表这些实体之一签署的人，都不是提供资金来源的人。\n3 问：您是否与检察官讨论过为什么他们要在第四张幻灯片上专注于这些特定的资金来源？\n4 答：没有。\n5 问：所以您根本不知道这张幻灯片的意义在于——撤回该问题。问得不好。我道歉。\n6 我们来看看左边的 VOG 框。您看到了吗？\n7 答：看到了。\n8 问：其日期范围是从 2020年4月 至 2020年10月13日，对吗？\n9 答：是的。\n10 问：您听说过 GTV 私募（GTV private placement）吗？\n11 答：我想我在文件中看到过提及私募的内容。\n12 问：我们能否将 GXC63-T 与该物证并排调出。\n13 左边是 2020年6月 一次广播的翻译。\n14 我们能否放大或高亮显示开头为“It's almost”（快到）的那一行，在第一个框里。\n15 您能读一下那行吗，Hinton 先生？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 盘问\n1 答：“现在是6月2日将近中午12点。”\n2 问：我们能翻到第七页，当您翻到时高亮显示“GTV is now”（GTV现在）这一行吗，在往下第四个框里。\n3 您能读一下以“GTV is”（GTV是）开头的那个句子的那部分吗？\n4 答：“GTV现在开始合法化了。”\n5 问：先生，您会同意我的看法，2020年6月2日 早于 2020年10月13日 吧？\n6 答：是的。\n7 问：而且您会同意我的看法，如果您扩大您所查看的日期范围，那可能会包含更多的资金流动，对吗？\n8 答：是的。\n9 问：我们可以撤下那个。我们能再次调出 GXZ26 吗，同一张幻灯片。我们看一下中间的框，写着 Saraca 的那个。\n10 您看到了吗？\n11 答：看到了。\n12 问：那笔 2.86 亿美元（$286 million）的日期范围是什么？\n13 答：2019年2月22日 至 2020年7月3日。\n14 问：我们能否在旁边调出 GXBK-5，请放在它旁边。您在右边的文件上看到日期了吗？\n15 答：2020年4月20日。\n16 问：先生，您会同意我的看法，2020年4月20日 距离 2019年2月22日 已经过了一年多吧？\n17 答：我同意。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 盘问\n1 问：同样，如果您扩大那个日期范围，它会增加流入的金额，对吗？\n2 答：嗯，澄清一下，这个日期范围代表了我们处理的所有交易的日期范围，所以这些只是显示了我们处理的所有交易。并且，是的，如果还有来自我们未处理的其他账户的更多交易，那个数字可能会上升。\n3 问：当然。而且如果您扩大时间段，数字也可能会上升，对吗？\n4 答：也许吧。我不知道。我没有处理那些交易。\n5 问：那么我们看幻灯片五。实际上，我们看幻灯片六。这是 VOG 资金流，对吗？\n6 答：是的。\n7 问：您看到中间那个箭头了吗？\n8 答：看到了。\n9 问：那是 1,730 万美元（$17.3 million），对吗？\n10 答：是的。\n11 问：那里的日期范围是 2018年3月12日 至 2020年5月12日，对吗？\n12 答：是的。\n13 问：同样，那距私募开始日期已超过两年了，对吗？\n14 答：基于您陈述的那个日期是什么时候，是的。\n15 问：基于我让您读的那份文件上的 4月20日 这个日期，对吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 盘问\n1 答：是的。\n2 问：然后如果我们看它右边的框，那是流向 Voice of Guo Media（郭媒体），对吗。您看到了吗？\n3 答：看到了。\n4 问：那是 200 万美元（$2 million）？\n5 答：我有点困惑您指的是哪个箭头。\n6 问：那或许您能帮我一下。中间那个框，Lafrenz 的那个，上面写着 WFB 1005。您看到了吗？\n7 答：看到了。\n8 问：如果我错了请纠正我，看起来有一个箭头从那个框指向带有 WFB 5536 的 Voice of Guo Media，对吗？\n9 答：是的。\n10 问：那个箭头反映了在 2019年7月11日 至 2020年5月5日 这段时间内 200 万美元 的资金流，对吗？\n11 答：是的。\n12 问：而 2019年7月11日 是在 2020年4月20日 之前的几个月，对吗？\n13 答：是的。\n14 问：我们来看幻灯片 15。我们先从左上角开始。您看到所有那些我想您称之为深蓝色的框了吗？\n15 答：看到了。\n16 问：那些是与 G/Clubs 相关联的——撤回。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 盘问\n1 那些反映了与 G/Clubs Operations, LLC 相关联的银行账户，对吗？\n2 答：还有另一个用于不同 G/Club 实体的蓝色框。\n3 问：那么我们从顶部的那些开始，顶部的四个。那些都是 G/Clubs Operations，对吗？\n4 答：是的。\n5 问：而您能够将它们与 G/Clubs Operations 关联起来的原因，是因为所有那些账户都以 G/Clubs Operations 的名义开立，对吗？\n6 答：是的。\n7 问：那么另一个以 G/Club International Limited 的名义开立的深蓝色框也是如此，对吗？\n8 答：是的，那个 Mercantile 0103 账户是 G/Club International Limited。\n9 问：另一种呈现顶部情况的方式是，您可以只用一个框代表 G/Club operations，而不是用四个框，对吗？\n10 答：是的。\n11 问：但检察官要求您放四个，对吗？\n12 答：是的。\n13 问：那么，如果我们转到右侧的浅蓝色框，情况也是如此。您看到了吗？\n14 答：看到了。\n15 问：那些都是属于 Crane Advisory 的，对吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉质询\n\n答：没错。\n\n问：再次确认，您之所以能够将这些与 Crane Advisory（克莱恩咨询公司）关联起来，是因为所有这些账户都以 Crane Advisory 的名义开立，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：所以您本可以把那六个方框合并为一个，对吗？\n\n答：理论上是可以的。\n\n问：但他们不想让您这么做，对吗？\n\n答：他们向我们指示了图表的格式。\n\n问：那么现在我们来看最底部的黄色方框。您看到了吗？\n\n答：看到了。\n\n问：最底部的黄色方框，几乎所有这些都与一个名为 Hamilton（汉密尔顿）的主体相关，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：其中有一个方框没有包含“Hamilton”字样，对吗？\n\n答：是的，有一个 Himalaya International Clearing（喜马拉雅国际清算）账户。\n\n问：是谁让您把那个方框标为黄色的？\n\n答：政府方。\n\n问：再次确认，所有 Hamilton 账户，即实际标有 Hamilton 的账户，您之所以能把它们与 Hamilton 关联起来，是因为它们都以 Hamilton 的名义开立，对吗？\n\n答：是的，有五个 Hamilton Opportunity Fund（汉密尔顿机会基金）账户和一个 Hamilton Digital Assets（汉密尔顿数字资产）账户。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉质询\n\n问：现在我随便挑一个。\n顶部那个在 11-23-2020 到 April 1, 2021 之间收到 $59.5 million 的 Crane Advisory 账户，您看到了吗？\n\n答：看到了。\n\n问：CIT 就是 Citibank（花旗银行），对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：花旗银行是一家美国银行，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：这张幻灯片上展示的银行几乎全都是美国银行，对吗？\n\n答：大部分都是，没错。\n\n问：事实上，在您大致分析过的——我不记得具体数字了——大约 600 个银行账户中，在您大致分析过的数百个银行账户中，几乎全都是美国银行账户，对吗？\n\n答：嗯，还有瑞士的账户。\n\n问：我问的不是这个。我问的是不是几乎全都是？\n\n答：绝大多数是美国银行账户。\n\n问：先在这个问题上停留一下，我们看左上角，我想圈出从 G/Club Operations（G/Club 运营）到 G/Club Operations 的 52.2 million，就在左上角的方框里。\n能请把那个 52.2 圈出来吗？\n那是 December 17, 2020 在两个 G/Clubs 银行账户之间进行的 $52.2 million 的转账，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉质询\n\n问：然后我们把下面那个 14.5 圈出来。那反映的是 January 11, 2021 在 G/Clubs 银行账户之间进行的 $14.5 million 转账，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：现在我们圈出下面那个转给 Fiesta 的 $10 million，那代表一笔 $10 million 的付款——撤回。是从 G/Clubs Operations 账户转给 Fiesta Property Developments（嘉年华地产开发公司）的 $10 million 转账，对吗？\n\n答：那是那些账户在那些期间转账的总金额。\n\n问：所以那些转账是从 January 21, 2021 开始的，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：所以那些转账是在那笔 $52 million 的转账和那笔 $14.5 million 的转账之后开始的，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：那么从这张图表来看，那 52.2 million 和 14.5 million 中有多少构成了那 $10 million？\n\n答：我不知道。\n\n问：您不可能知道，对吗？\n\n答：嗯，您可以做一些资金追踪分析并得出估算。\n\n问：对，但您在主质询中作证说您没有做那个分析，对吗？\n\n答：没错。\n\n问：所以根据这张图表，根本无法将这些金额\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉质询\n\n与那 $10 million 关联起来，对吗？\n\n答：它们在这张图表上是关联在一起的。\n\n问：我知道您在那里画了箭头，但根本无法断定这笔钱就是那笔钱，对吗？\n\n答：我不同意。资金在较早的时间点流入，然后在较晚的时间点流出，所以这是一种关联。\n\n问：那是两个日期之间的关联，对吗？\n\n答：是资金流之间的关联。\n\n问：这是一种时间顺序？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：我们回头再谈这个。我们来看 Crane Advisory，就是中间那个归类框。您看到了吗？我们先从从花旗银行账户 5278 流向其下方浅蓝色方框（即另一个 Crane Advisory 账户）的 $58.2 million 开始。您看到了吗？\n\n答：看到了。\n\n问：然后有一个箭头显示从该账户向 Lawall Mitchell（拉沃尔·米切尔）账户流出 $6.8 million。您看到了吗？\n\n答：看到了。\n\n问：那笔 $58 million 转账的日期范围是 January 22, 2021 到 March 30, 2021，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：而那笔 $6.8 million 的转账是 October 19, 2021，对吗？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉质询\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：所以那是在那笔 $58.2 million 的最后一笔转账发生将近七个月之后，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：而且我相信您在主质询中作证过，这些是经过挑选的资金流，因此并不代表全部交易，对吗？\n\n答：确实如此。\n\n问：它没有反映流入收到 $58.2 million 的那个 Crane Advisory 组方框的任何其他资金，对吗？\n\n答：没有。\n\n问：我们先放大显示这里一下。\n\n答：我不同意。我说了没有。\n\n问：您对什么不同意？抱歉。您不同意的是什么？\n\n答：不同意您刚才的问题。我没有肯定您的问题。我持不同意见。\n\n问：好的。请告诉我您不同意什么？\n\n答：您说没有任何其他资金流入那个账户。还有另一个箭头流入该账户。我只是想澄清一下。\n\n问：明白了。这个提法很合理。是指可能流入该账户的所有其他潜在资金流，对吗？\n\n答：没错。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉质询\n\n问：谢谢您的澄清。那么我们来看有一个箭头，即那笔 $58 million。向 Crane Advisory 账户转出 $58 million 的那个账户，也向 Crane Advisory 这组 IDB（以色列贴现银行）银行账户转出了 $10.7 million，对吗？\n\n答：没错。\n\n问：那些转账的最后日期是 May 28, 2021，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：然后还有另一笔转账——从 IDB 的 Crane 账户转给 Lawall Mitchell，金额为 $1.6 million，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：发生时间是 September 27, 2021，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：所以那是在那笔 $10.7 million 转账的最后一笔发生将近四个月之后，对吗？\n\n答：没错。\n\n问：现在请翻到第 27 张幻灯片。\n这里显示了与 Himalaya Exchange（喜马拉雅交易所）相关的各项资金流，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：第一个方框“资金来源”，代表的是我们之前讨论过的相同的资金来源，对吗？\n\n答：没错。\n\n问：然后它显示大约 $470 million 从那个灰色方框流向一个 Himalaya International Clearing 银行账户，对吗？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉质询\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：您理解那是 Himalaya Exchange 的一个账户？\n\n答：我对它的用途没有独立的了解。\n\n问：所以您不知道它与哪家公司相关联？\n\n答：图表上写着 Himalaya Exchange，这些是被指定的账户，但账户名称是 Himalaya International Clearing，所以我不知道该账户的作用是什么。\n\n问：但是政府方告诉您这是 Himalaya Exchange 的银行账户？\n\n答：指示将其标为黄色以便归入该类别。说它是 Himalaya Exchange 的账户——这只是为了这些图表的目的而做出的分类。\n\n问：明白了。他们给了您现成的填色模板，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：那笔交易的日期范围是 June 2, 2021 到 June 30, 2022，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：先生，您是否同意，November 2021 是在 June 2, 2021 之后？\n\n答：同意。\n\n问：您是否知晓 Himalaya Exchange 于 November 20, 2021 首次启动交易？\n\n答：不知道。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉质询\n\n问：那么请翻到第 30 张幻灯片。标题是 Yacht Zoo（游艇经纪公司）支出，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：中间有一个所有流入资金的总和 $3.9 million，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：那应该代表来自这些其他实体的所有汇入款项，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：也就是银行账户，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：您这里有 G/Club International 的 478,000，对吗；您有 HCHK，然后还有三个 Lamp 银行账户，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：那笔计入 3.9 million 中的来自 G/Clubs 的 478，您以前听说过一艘名为 Liberty（自由号）的游艇吗？\n\n答：没有。\n\n问：在 3.9 million 下方列出的日期范围是 May 7, 2020 到 October 21, 2022，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：您能否在这张图表上为我找到一笔始于 May 7, 2020 的转账？\n\n答：我认为这是笔误。如果您看左边的转账，看起来是始于 May 7, 2021。\n\n问：那是 Lamp Capital（兰普资本）的那笔，对吗？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉质询\n\n答：没错。\n\n问：检察官没有要求您计入 2020 年转给 Yacht Zoo 的任何转账，对吗？\n\n答：这些是他们挑选出来在图表上展示的资金流。\n\n问：而且它们应该全部来自 2021 年，对吗？\n\n答：我不知道他们用来挑选这些资金流的标准是什么。\n\n问：我的意思是，撇开笔误不谈，它们应该全部来自 2021 年，对吗？\n\n答：这些全部在 2021 年与 October 2022 之间。\n\n问：那是他们提供给您的日期范围，对吗？\n\n答：是他们确定了这些交易，而这些是交易的日期。\n\n问：现在我们来看第 8 张幻灯片，我想应该是第 8 张。这是农场精选资金流，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：在本案的背景下，您根本不知道“农场”是什么意思，对吗？\n\n答：没错。\n\n问：这张图表上反映出有 $77 million 流向一家名为 ACA Capital（阿卡资本）的公司，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：首先我们看一下——有一笔从 ACA Capital 流向 Savio Law（萨维奥律师事务所）的 $32 million 转账，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：发生在 November 12 到 November\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉质询\n\n16, 2020 期间，对吗？\n\n答：是的，没错。\n\n问：然后您的图表反映出在 August 20, 2020 有一个箭头从 Savio Law 指向 Leading Shine（领耀公司），金额为 $3 million，对吗？\n\n答：没错。\n\n问：所以 August 20, 2020 是在 November 12, 2020 之前，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：那么从逻辑上讲，从 Savio Law 流向 Leading Shine 的 3 million 不可能是来自 ACA Capital 那 32 million 的一部分，对吗？\n\n答：我同意。\n\n问：那我们再看下面那个 Lamp Capital。\n那是从 Savio Law 转给 Lamp Capital 的一笔 $5 million 转账，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：那笔转账的日期是什么？\n\n答：是 October 15, 2020。\n\n问：您同样也会同意，October 15, 2020 是在 November 12, 2020 之前，对吗？\n\n答：是的。\n\n问：从逻辑上讲，那 $5 million 不可能来自那笔 $32 million，对吗？\n\n答：没错。\n\n问：然后还有一笔从 Savio Law 转给 Greenwich Land（格林威治地产）的 $5 million 转账，对吗？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1 答：是的。\n2 问：那是什么日期？\n3 答：2020年10月15日。\n4 问：同样的情况，对吧，2020年10月15日是在11月12日\n5 之前？\n6 答：没错。\n7 问：所以那笔钱不可能来自那3200万美元，\n8 对吗？\n9 答：没错。\n10 问：但是检察官无论如何还是让你把这些箭头画成这样，\n11 对吧？\n12 答：我不知道你说的“无论如何”是什么意思。这些箭头反映的\n13 交易在图表上都是准确体现的。\n14 问：它们代表发生过的交易，对吧？\n15 答：是的。\n16 问：现在，最左上方还有一个框。\n17 你看到了吗？\n18 答：看到了。\n19 问：上面写着“其他资金流入”。你看到了吗？\n20 答：看到了。\n21 问：什么是其他资金流入？\n22 答：嗯，那是其他资金来源——抱歉。是其他\n23 转入 ACA Capital 账户但在本图表上未以其他方式\n24 体现的转账，即来自农场以外来源的资金。\n25 问：刚过去的周六你和检察官会面了，对吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法院速记记录处）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1 答：是的。\n2 问：6月20日，对吧？\n3 答：我认为是那个日期。\n4 问：在那次会面中，你们讨论了这张幻灯片？\n5 答：我不记得我们在周六、周日还是周一\n6 具体讨论了哪几张幻灯片。\n7 问：在会面之前，这张幻灯片曾经有一个版本是没有\n8 “其他资金流入”的，对吗？\n9 答：可能吧，是的。\n10 问：在你们会面之后——你告诉检察官\n11 存在这些其他资金流入，对吧？\n12 答：我不记得那是不是我说的话了。\n13 问：那么你能告诉我，把“其他资金流入”这一框\n14 添加到这张幻灯片上的过程吗？\n15 答：嗯，是检察官要求我们把它加到幻灯片上的。\n16 问：那是什么时候的事？\n17 答：我不记得了。\n18 问：关于这个问题，你是否记得 Brattle（布拉特尔集团）\n19 曾使用过“流入/流出冲突”这一说法？\n20 答：记得。\n21 问：那是什么意思？\n22 答：那只是针对图表上的某些\n23 需求所进行的一项平衡性核对。\n24 问：你能为陪审团详细解释一下吗？\n25 答：可以。只是因为这些图表并没有显示所有的\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1 交易，它们只显示了我们处理过的交易，\n2 以及图表中所选定实体之间的交易，\n3 所以如果将进入账户和流出账户的所有箭头金额相加，\n4 箭头上显示的金额有可能\n5 流出的金额大于流入的金额；\n6 所以那只是我们有时被要求为其中某些节点\n7 执行的平衡性问题或核对。\n8\n9 问：因此，如果流出金额超过了来自某一特定来源的流入金额，\n10 这意味着除了你所查看的特定来源之外，\n11 账户里还有钱，对吗？\n12 答：对。那要么意味着在我们掌握数据的\n13 时间段之前，账户中就已经有先前的\n14 余额存在，要么意味着有其他向该账户转款的实体\n15 未在图表上显示。\n16 问：所以检察官试图解决这种冲突的方法之一，\n17 就是向你发送更多他们可以归类为农场的实体，\n18 对吧？\n19 答：如果你想尝试解释更多的资金流入，你必须\n20 确认那些交易是什么以及交易对手是谁。所以有几个例子中，\n21 图表做了修改，以便给我们提供更多的财务记录，\n22 从而让我们能够将这些财务记录添加到图表中。\n23 问：对。这样做的目的是为了增加来自所谓农场的\n24 资金流入，对吧？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1 答：在那个具体案例中，是的。在我们准备汇总图表并\n2 查看其不同版本迭代的过程中，有更多的实体\n3 被认定为农场，\n4 政府决定在农场分类中\n5 增加额外的实体。\n6 问：而 Brattle 并没有进行任何独立的核查来\n7 确定那些是否确实是农场，对吧？\n8 答：没错。\n9 问：那全都是来自政府，对吧？\n10 答：没错。\n11 问：即便在那之后，你能够解决所谓的\n12 冲突了吗？\n13 答：这实际上没有什么可解决的。这只是一项平衡性测试，\n14 看看流入的数量和金额是否\n15 大于——流入是大于还是小于你所显示的流出金额。\n16 仅此而已。\n17 问：那么是否可以公正地说，存在“其他资金流入”这一框\n18 意味着来自农场的资金流入并没有涵盖从\n19 ACA Capital 账户流出的全部资金？\n20 答：对。\n21 问：在这张图表上，并没有与那些其他资金流入相关联的\n22 具体金额，对吧？\n23 答：对。\n24 问：所以这张图表并没有告诉陪审团那些资金流入\n25 有多大，对吧？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1 答：对。\n2 问：上面没有与之相关的日期，对吧？\n3 答：对。\n4 问：没有日期范围，对吧？\n5 答：对。\n6 默里女士：已问过并已作答。\n7 法官：反对成立。\n8 问：那么如果看从 ACA Capital 流向 Lexington Property\n9 的那1900万美元，你看到了吗？\n10 答：看到了。\n11 问：那笔钱中有多少来自其他资金流入，有多少\n12 来自农场的7700万？\n13 答：没有人要求我做那项计算。\n14 问：所以你不知道？\n15 答：我不知道。\n16 问：流向 William Je（余建明）和 Sing Ting Wang（王星亭）\n17 的1120万美元也是同样的问题？\n18 答：我不知道。没有人要求我做那项计算。\n19 问：我们来看看 Hudson Diamond，默里女士问过你的\n20 那1800万，那个怎么样。这1800万中有多少\n21 来自那7700万？\n22 答：我不知道。\n23 问：有人要求你查看过吗？\n24 答：没有。\n25 问：好的。紧挨着它的流向 Lamp Capital\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1 的1300万呢，那个怎么样？\n2 答：我不知道。\n3 问：有人要求你查看过吗？\n4 答：我没有收到执行资金追查分析的指示。\n5 问：那么流向 Greenwich Land 的500万，也是同样的\n6 答案？\n7 答：同样的答案。\n8 问：因此，尽管有箭头连接 ACA Capital 框\n9 和我们刚才谈到的那些实体，也有箭头连接\n10 农场和 ACA Capital，你实际上并不知道\n11 那7700万美元中是否有任何资金属于这些转账，对吧？\n12 答：我没有追查这些资金的最终用途，\n13 确实如此。\n14 问：事实上，我相信你在主询问中作证说，有些\n15 银行账户 Brattle 甚至看都没看过，对吧？\n16 答：没错。\n17 法官：现在到了我们11:30休庭的时间。陪审团\n18 成员们，我们将在半小时后回来。请记住，\n19 你们不得私下讨论本案。\n20 不要允许任何人在你们面前讨论本案。\n21 不要阅读、观看或收听任何与本案\n22 有关的内容。\n23 法庭书记员：陪审团退庭。\n24 （陪审团不在场）\n25 法官：证人，你可以离开法庭。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1 不要讨论你的证言。\n2 证人：我不会讨论的。\n3 （证人退庭）\n4 法官：请坐。在正午返回之前\n5 还有什么事吗？\n6 默里女士：法官阁下，有一件简短的事项需要提出。\n7 关于卡马拉朱先生的某些提问，\n8 特别是涉及 ACA Capital 在 First Abu Dhabi Bank\n9 （第一阿布扎比银行）的账户，这是在我们刚才查看的\n10 证据附件的幻灯片8上。卡马拉朱先生针对汇总图表上\n11 显示为“其他资金流入”这一类别进行了一连串发问，\n12 该类别没有与之相关联的日期范围或美元金额。\n13 正如法庭和卡马拉朱先生所知，第一阿布扎比银行的账户记录\n14 是政府在本案中收集的证据的一部分。\n15 在过去的数年里，它们曾在政府的财务分析过程中\n16 被使用过。最终，由于阿拉伯联合酋长国未能向我们提供\n17 可用于将这些记录引入证据的认证文件，法庭基于我们遇到的\n18 这一问题排除将其采纳为证据。但它们对本图表上的\n19 资金流动具有极强的佐证性。\n20\n21 政府根据法庭的命令，\n22 剔除了来自任何这些记录的所有资金来源。因此我们\n23 重新进行了所有不依附于这些记录的财务分析，\n24 改为依附于交易对手方的记录。结果，\n25 汇总图表上的数字有所下降，这没有问题。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1 这在 Hinton 先生的主询问中已经涉及过了。但这并不是——\n2 这并没有完全包含我们所看到的所有资金流动。\n3 再次说明，这是因为政府根据法庭的命令\n4 没有依赖那些记录。但是，卡马拉朱先生在此对证人\n5 强烈暗示该“其他资金流入”类别是由政府建议添加的，\n6 其意图似乎是在暗示政府显然在试图操纵\n7 资金流动的汇总，法官阁下，我们认为这已经构成了反驳辩由（opens the door），\n8 我们可以在反询问中询问 Hinton 先生是否确实从政府那里\n9 收到了第一阿布扎比银行的账户记录，\n10 以及其中所反映的交易是否与这些汇总图表上的\n11 信息一致。我们可以确立他并未为了图表上反映的\n12 总金额而依赖这些记录，但既然卡马拉朱先生已经打开了话匣，\n13 我们希望能够承认它们的存在，以作为解释此“其他资金流入”\n14 类别之目的的一种方式。\n15 法官：那么，你如何解释未在图表上提及的情况？\n16 默里女士：法官阁下，未提及什么？\n17 法官：未提及该银行？\n18 默里女士：嗯，图表上有提及该银行，\n19 因为我们展示了通过交易对手方确立并溯源的交易，\n20 我们调出了政府证据附件 Z26 的幻灯片8。\n21 你可以看到 ACA Capital FAB 账户。\n22 那就是第一阿布扎比银行账户，我想洛夫特斯女士正在将其调出。\n23 就此处所显示的转账而言，我们展示了——\n24 洛夫特斯女士，如果我们能缩小画面，展示更多上下文的话。\n25 就显示从该账户流出的转账而言，那来自于此处所引用的\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉询问\n1 账户，即本图表附录中引用的政府证据附件。\n2 我认为关于未提及该账户记录的问题，只需问 Hinton 先生一个问题：\n3 你是否审阅过该账户的记录？它们是否与本汇总图表上的\n4 信息一致？你在溯源本图表上的信息时是否依赖了\n5 那些记录？为什么没有？是否因为政府要求你不要依赖\n6 这些作为来源记录？我们问到这里就可以了。\n7 法官：卡马拉朱先生。\n8 卡马拉朱先生：法官阁下，有几点意见。第一，\n9 Hinton 先生是一名汇总证人。他只能汇总或陈述\n10 记录中具有可采性且已被采纳为证据的内容。\n11 法官阁下此前已经裁定第一阿布扎比银行的\n12 账户不可采纳。他们选择出示一份试图将这些资金与\n13 这些转账联系起来的图表，却没有必要的证据链条。\n14 我有权指出这一点。自法官阁下裁定以来，\n15 他们就收到了关于这一问题的通知。\n16 这些图表全都是在那之后制作的。\n17 此外，法官阁下，他们认为可以……\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉盘问\n1 会说，好吧，你有这些记录。你审查了它们。\n2 它们证实了这一点，这将必然为我们打开大门，使我们\n3 能够说，事实上，法院认定那些记录\n4 不够可靠，不能作为证据提交至本案中，\n5 而且那些记录属于传闻证据，并且政府\n6 未能对其进行鉴真。所以我不明白，政府怎么能够\n7 仅仅因为我攻击他们的汇总图表以及他们拥有的材料，\n8 就提及未在审判中采纳为证据的内容。他仍然——我又绕回我的\n9 原始论点——根据规则，汇总证人必须针对\n10 已经采纳、已被采纳为证据的事项作证。而且法官大人\n11 已经对这个问题作出了裁定。他们本不必以这种方式\n12 呈现这张图表。那是他们自己的选择。\n13 法院：Murray（默里）女士。\n14 默里女士：法官大人，我认为此时我们所面临的情况是，\n15 Kamaraju（卡马拉朱）先生制造了一个《联邦证据规则》第 403 条问题。\n16 就法院不希望政府就这条提问线向 Hinton（欣顿）先生进行深究而言，我想我们\n17 是理解的。辩方似乎确实在采取一种策略，\n18 以利用法院关于 ACA Capital 记录的裁定，\n19 特别是这些记录，正如我们在审前简报中指出的那样，\n20 就资金流向的目的而言是极其重要的记录。\n21 我们确实利用了从我们调取的其他账户中获得的其他可采纳证据，\n22 对资金流向进行了汇总，但这准确地反映在了\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉盘问\n1 这些图表上。\n2 然而，在双方以及法院都了解那些记录以及那些记录的地位的情况下，\n3 继续沿着这条提问线进行下去，有给陪审团造成偏见并混淆争议焦点的风险。\n4 归根结底，政府请求法院要求\n5 卡马拉朱先生从这条提问线继续进行下去，不再纠缠于此。\n6 卡马拉朱先生：法官大人，我只想说这一点。指出政府指控中证据的缺乏，\n7 非常明确地就是辩方的策略。就他们对此感到担忧而言，\n8 这正是我们的策略。在这里，我们是在指出他们没有可采纳的证据\n9 来关联这些银行资金流向的事实，这直接回应了他们\n10 试图声称这笔资金被滥用于郭先生家人的主张。\n11 他们未能对该记录进行鉴真这一事实，并不构成 403 条问题。\n12 而我对其进行攻击的能力，是提出辩护的根本所在。\n13 我从未听说法庭上有削弱政府证据会造成 403 条问题的情况。\n14 而且正如默里女士所说，这对陪审团没有任何偏见。\n15 陪审团能够理解正在发生的事情。如果他们愿意，他们可以对资金追踪提出论点。\n16 但陪审团才是做出裁决的人。\n17 他们不能说，好吧，卡马拉朱先生不应该追问那些显示我们案件弱点的问题，\n18 因为我们知道不可采纳的记录。我也知道\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO2 Hinton - 交叉盘问\n1 不可采纳的信息，我也很想在为郭先生辩护时提及，\n2 但我不能这么做，因为它未被采纳为证据。\n3 法院：因此，我不允许政府涉及这些阿布扎比的记录。\n4 卡马拉朱先生：谢谢您，法官大人。\n5 法院：就这样。\n6 （休庭）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 交叉盘问\n1 下午开庭\n2 中午 12:00\n3 法院：请带陪审员入庭。\n4 （陪审团在场）\n5 法院：请就座。\n6 证人先生，请记住你仍处于宣誓状态。\n7 证人：是的。\n8 法院：你可以继续询问。\n9 卡马拉朱先生：好的。我们能把那两份物证重新调出来吗，\n10 或者我想在我们休庭时我们正在查看政府物证（GX）Z26。第 8 页幻灯片。\n11 卡马拉朱先生提问：\n12 问：好的。现在快速过一下这张幻灯片。你之前和默里女士一起查看过的 Savio Law 账户，\n13 你记得吗？\n14 答：是的。\n15 问：好的。那是一个美国银行账户，对吗？\n16 答：是的。\n17 问：好的。HCHK Technologies 在 IDB 的账户，是美国银行账户，对吗？\n18 答：是的。\n19 问：Leading Shine 在 IVB 的账户，是美国银行账户，对吗？\n20 答：是的。\n21 问：所有 Lamp Capital 的银行账户，都是美国银行账户，对吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 交叉盘问\n1 答：是的。\n2 问：Greenwich Land 账户也是一样，对吗？\n3 答：是的。\n4 问：反映给 Lamp Capital 的 Signature 账户也是一样？\n5 答：是的。\n6 问：IDB 账户也是一样，对吗？\n7 答：是的。\n8 问：DCB 账户也是一样，对吗？\n9 答：是的。\n10 问：关于 Lexington Property 的？\n11 答：是的，我认为是的。\n12 卡马拉朱先生：现在我们能把物证 GX Z27 并排调出来吗，谢谢。\n13 问：好的。默里女士带你过了一遍这个。你记得吗？\n14 答：我记得。\n15 问：好的。所以在右侧的 GX Z27 上，Brattle（百图集团）识别出的账户总数是 681 个账户，\n16 对吗？\n17 答：是的。\n18 问：已处理的账户，450 个，对吗？\n19 答：是的。\n20 问：好的。那么这意味着——已处理和已分析是同一个子集吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 交叉盘问\n1 答：嗯，这取决于你所说的已处理和已分析是什么意思。\n2 分析有时我们认为包含处理，对吧？广义上讲那是分析的一部分。\n3 问：好的。我想我要问的是，先生——可能问得不够得体——\n4 那里反映的 450 个账户，是百图实际上查看、审查并试图提供证据的账户吗？\n5 抱歉。撤回。\n6 那 450 个账户是百图实际审查并深入研究的账户吗？\n7 答：对。那些是我们从中提取交易数据并放入数据库的账户，\n8 那是为作证而制作的各种物证的起点，但——但并不是数据库中的所有交易和账户\n9 最终都会出现在物证中。\n10 问：懂了。明白了。谢谢你，先生。这很有帮助。\n11 那么那里反映的 231 个账户，那些账户从未进入数据库，对吧？\n12 答：我们没有处理那些；没错。\n13 问：好的。所以这 231 个银行账户的任何数据都没有反映在汇总图表的任何地方，对吧？\n14 答：没错。\n15 问：而且除了我们正在看的这个小条目之外，它没有反映在你今天作证的任何汇总图表中，对吧？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 交叉盘问\n1 答：没错。\n2 问：所以该图表反映——撤回。\n3 卡马拉朱先生：我们可以撤下 GX Z27。我想把已采纳为证据的辩方物证（DX）10339 并排调出来，\n4 这样我们就可以向陪审团出示它，谢谢。\n5 好的。我们能翻到第 3 页吗，谢谢。\n6 问：好的。你看到底部那里，5 月 2 日的三笔转账了吗？\n7 答：看到了。\n8 卡马拉朱先生：好的。实际上，抱歉。我们能快速缩小一下画面吗。\n9 问：我认为确定日期会有所帮助。你看到“服务费摘要”这一行了吗？\n10 你能读一下吗，谢谢。\n11 卡马拉朱先生：也许我们可以高亮显示它。\n12 答：好的。“从 2018 年 4 月 1 日至 2018 年 4 月 30 日的服务费摘要。”\n13 问：所以那是这份银行对账单的期间，对吗？\n14 答：是的。\n15 问：好的。现在让我们往下看那些转账。你看到 5 月 2 日的那些了吗？\n16 答：看到了。\n17 问：好的。在这三笔转账的过程中总计是 300,000 美元，对吗？\n18 答：是的。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 交叉盘问\n1 问：那些转账是谁转来的？\n2 答：它们来自 ACA Capital。\n3 卡马拉朱先生：好的。让我们重新缩小画面。\n4 让我们翻到顶部。让我们看看这是谁的银行账户，谢谢。\n5 问：你看到那里的 Golden Spring (New York) 了吗？\n6 答：看到了。\n7 问：好的。那是银行账户持有人，对吗？\n8 答：我认为是的。\n9 问：好的。现在这三笔共 300,000 美元的转账并未反映在你的汇总图表中，对吗？\n10 答：没错。\n11 卡马拉朱先生：请翻到第 13 页。\n12 问：好的。你看到 7 月 19 日一笔 2,000,000 美元的交易了吗？\n13 卡马拉朱先生：也许我们可以放大那一处。\n14 答：看到了。\n15 问：那是谁转来的？\n16 答：那也是来自 ACA Capital。\n17 问：那没有反映在你的汇总图表上，对吧？\n18 答：没错。\n19 卡马拉朱先生：好的。请翻到第 18 页。\n20 问：好的。你看到 2018 年 8 月 20 日一笔 500,000 美元的转账了吗？\n21 答：看到了。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 交叉盘问\n1 问：那是谁转来的？\n2 答：ACA Capital。\n3 问：那没有反映在你的图表上，对吧？\n4 答：没错。\n5 卡马拉朱先生：那么请翻到第 45 页。\n6 问：好的。你看到 2019 年 1 月 14 日一笔约为 4,499,000 美元的转账了吗？\n7 答：看到了。\n8 问：好的。那是谁转来的？\n9 答：ACA Capital。\n10 问：那没有反映在你的图表上，对吧？\n11 答：没错。\n12 卡马拉朱先生：请翻到第 89 页。\n13 问：好的。你看到 2019 年 8 月 8 日一笔 3,000,000 美元的转账了吗？\n14 答：看到了。\n15 问：那是谁转来的？\n16 答：这笔是来自 ACA Capital。\n17 问：好的。那也没有反映在你的图表上，对吧？\n18 答：没错。\n19 卡马拉朱先生：好的。让我们撤下 10339 并把 10381 调出来。请并排显示。\n20 好的。请翻到下一页。继续翻。\n21 好的。实际上，请翻到第 23 页。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 交叉盘问\n1 问：好的。让我们从顶部开始。你能告诉我们账户持有人是谁吗。\n2 答：Leading Shine NY Ltd.。\n3 卡马拉朱先生：好的。让我们向下滑动回去。\n4 问：你看到 2019 年 1 月 22 日一笔将近 3,000,000 美元的转账了吗？\n5 答：看到了。\n6 问：好的。那是谁转来的？\n7 答：嗯，来自——来自 ACA Capital。\n8 问：好的。哪家银行？\n9 答：第一阿布扎比银行（First Abu Dhabi Bank）。\n10 问：好的。那没有反映在你的图表上，对吧？\n11 答：没——没错。\n12 卡马拉朱先生：好的。请翻到第 41 页。\n13 问：你看到 2019 年 8 月 8 日一笔 3,000,000 美元的转账了吗？你看到了吗？\n14 答：看到了。\n15 问：那是谁转来的？\n16 答：那也是来自 ACA Capital。\n17 问：哪个银行账户？\n18 答：来自第一阿布扎比银行账户。\n19 问：那也没有反映在你的图表上，是吗，欣顿先生？\n20 答：没错。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 再直接询问\n1 卡马拉朱先生：法官大人，此时没有其他问题了。\n2 法院：再直接询问。\n3 默里女士：谢谢您，法官大人。\n4 再直接询问\n5 默里女士提问：\n6 问：欣顿先生，在交叉盘问中，有人就 Z26 幻灯片第 8 页上反映的某些交易向你提出了一些问题。\n7 默里女士：Loftus（洛夫特斯）女士，请调出那一页。\n8 问：具体而言，有人就此处描绘的进出 ACA Capital 账户的某些交易向你提问。\n9 你还记得那些问题吗？\n10 答：我记得。\n11 问：欣顿先生，政府要求你对其指定的汇总图表进行核对；是这样吗？\n12 答：没错。\n13 问：政府并没有要求你对这里反映的各个账户进行详细的资金流向分析，这是准确的吗？\n14 答：没错。\n15 问：或者对政府在本案过程中提供给百图的任何银行记录进行资金流向分析？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 再次直接询问\n\n1 答：是的。\n\n2 问：看 ACA Capital 账户的资金流出情况，那些流向各个不同实体的银行账户的数字，是准确的吗？\n\n3\n\n4\n\n5 答：是的。\n\n6 默里女士（MS. MURRAY）：洛夫特斯女士（Ms. Loftus），麻烦我们现在切换到幻灯片 12。\n\n7\n\n8 问：这是前一张图表的一个子集，类似于放大视图，对吗？\n\n9\n\n10 答：是的。\n\n11 问：举例来说，根据记录，从 ACA Capital 账户流向这些 Lamp Capital 账户的资金总额为 2900 万美元，这笔资金流向是准确的，对吗？\n\n12\n\n13\n\n14 答：是的，我们核实过，这些进入 Lamp Capital 账户的交易都在底层原始凭单中有反映。\n\n15\n\n16 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请放下一张幻灯片。\n\n17 问：那么，这里所反映的从那些 Lamp Capital 账户流向这些不同开支的费用和交易，希顿先生（Mr. Hinton），这些也都是准确的，对吗？\n\n18\n\n19\n\n20 答：是的。\n\n21 问：包括这里用红色标示的与豪车相关的费用？\n\n22 答：是的。\n\n23 问：包括这里用蓝色标示的与游艇相关的费用？\n\n24 答：是的。\n\n25 问：包括这里用黑色标示的与飞机相关的费用？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 再次直接询问\n\n1\n\n2 答：是的。\n\n3 问：并且包括（例如）这里右侧所示的、转入以 Qiang Guo（郭强）名义开立的瑞士银行账户的 2000 万美元？\n\n4\n\n5\n\n6 答：是的。\n\n7 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请切换到本证据的第 15 张幻灯片。\n\n8\n\n9 问：希顿先生，卡马拉朱先生（Mr. Kamaraju）问了您一些关于此汇总图表上显示的各个方框的问题。您还记得那些问题吗？\n\n10\n\n11\n\n12 答：我记得。\n\n13 问：具体来说，例如，他问您政府是否要求将右侧浅蓝色标示的 Crane Advisory Group 方框分开显示，而不是合并为一个。您还记得吗？\n\n14\n\n15\n\n16\n\n17 答：我记得。\n\n18 问：看一下那些 Crane Advisory Group 方框，我们先从左上角开始。那反映的是哪个银行账户？\n\n19\n\n20 答：左上角是 Citibank（花旗银行）账户，Crane Advisory 账户，5278。\n\n21\n\n22 问：然后顺着向右追溯，紧接着的那个 5522 账户反映的是哪家银行？\n\n23\n\n24 答：是在 Signature Bank（签名银行），5522。\n\n25 问：再往右，第三个方框反映的是哪家银行？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 再次直接询问\n\n1 答：又是另一家不同的银行；是 Capital One（第一资本），0887。\n\n2 问：我们现在看左侧中间，有一系列的 MSS 账户。那些以 Crane Advisory Group 名义开立的账户是在哪些银行持有的？\n\n3\n\n4\n\n5 答：Morgan Stanley（摩根士丹利）账户。一共有四个。\n\n6 问：在右边这里，IDB，代表哪家银行？\n\n7 答：我想是以色列贴现银行（Israel Deposit Bank）。\n\n8 问：那么在这张汇总图表上的这五个不同方框，是否准确地代表了以 Crane Advisory Group 名义在五家不同银行开立的账户？\n\n9\n\n10\n\n11 答：是的。\n\n12 问：而图表上所反映的在这些账户之间及相互流动资金的情况，是准确的，对吗？\n\n13\n\n14 答：是的。\n\n15 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请调出同一证据，切换到幻灯片 4。\n\n16\n\n17 问：希顿先生，此前有人问过您关于各汇总图表上反映的时间段的一些问题。您还记得吗？\n\n18\n\n19\n\n20 答：我记得。\n\n21 问：特别是针对这张幻灯片，卡马拉朱先生问过您，延长一个时间段是否会在汇总中显示更大数额的资金；是这样吗？\n\n22\n\n23\n\n24 答：是的。\n\n25 问：那么，希顿先生，我们一直在看的这些汇总图表，仅反映了已向 Brattle（布拉托集团）提供银行记录的部分处理过的交易；是这样吗？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 再次直接询问\n\n1\n\n2\n\n3\n\n4 答：是的。\n\n5 问：并且是由政府选择将哪些信息（如果有的话）纳入这些汇总图表中的？\n\n6\n\n7 答：是的。\n\n8 问：而且先生，我相信您作证过，仅根据 Brattle 处理过的银行记录来看，汇总图表所包含的交易也是不全面的（underinclusive）；是这样吗？\n\n9\n\n10\n\n11\n\n12 答：是的。\n\n13 问：那么看这里的 GTV/VOG 概览，先生，我想请您当场做一点大致的快速心算。\n\n14\n\n15\n\n16 这里的流向 Saraca 的金额为 2.869 亿。您看到了吗？\n\n17\n\n18 答：看到了。\n\n19 问：如果我们加上右边的约 2960 万和左边的 7290 万——您可以取近似值——能否告诉我 GTV/VOG 的总累计金额是多少？\n\n20\n\n21\n\n22\n\n23 答：可以。嗯，2.86 亿加上大约 3000 万，会得到 3.16 亿，然后再加 7300 万，会得到 4.03 亿。\n\n24\n\n25\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 再次直接询问\n\n1 问：再试算一次。\n\n2 答：抱歉。3.09 亿。对，3.09 亿或 3.10 亿。抱歉。4.10 亿。\n\n3\n\n4 问：我们再拆解计算一次。再次抱歉让您当场做算术。\n\n5\n\n6 2.86 亿加上 3000 万左右得出 3.16 亿；对吗？\n\n7\n\n8 答：对。\n\n9 卡马拉朱先生：反对。已经问过并回答过了。\n\n10 答：对，3.16 亿，然后在 3.16 亿上加 7200 万是 400——4.06 亿。\n\n11 法庭：反对无效。\n\n12 问：所以可以说是大约 4 亿左右，差不多吧？\n\n13\n\n14 答：是的。\n\n15 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请把政府证据约定事项 19（Government Exhibit Stip 19）并排展示出来。\n\n16\n\n17 问：希顿先生，您以前见过右边的这份证据吗？\n\n18\n\n19 答：右边的这份，没有。\n\n20 问：这是双方之间的一份约定事项（stipulation），内容为：如果传唤出庭作证，SEC（美国证券交易委员会，Securities and Exchange Commission）的一名雇员除其他事项外将陈述如下内容：\n\n21\n\n22\n\n23 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请翻到约定事项 19 的第 2 页。\n\n24\n\n25 问：希顿先生，请您读一下那里的第 3 段第一句话。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 再次直接询问\n\n1\n\n2 答：根据该协议——\n\n3 问：抱歉。请您慢一点读，并把那段文字中的每一个字都读出来。\n\n4\n\n5 答：好的。“根据《和解协议》，Saraca、GTV 和 VOG 已就 GTV 私募事宜向 SEC 汇付 455,211,346.39 美元，其中包括 Saraca 在 Hayman Capital Management 的投资中的 69,713,578.6 美元。”\n\n6\n\n7\n\n8\n\n9 问：您可以先停一下。\n\n10 然后看下一句，“截至本约定事项签署之日”，也请您把这部分读一下。\n\n11\n\n12 答：“截至本约定事项签署之日，Saraca 和 GTV 共同（在连带责任的基础上）仍欠 SEC 额外的 31,488,392.52 美元，VOG 仍欠 SEC 额外的 45,324 美元。”\n\n13\n\n14\n\n15\n\n16 问：那么，希顿先生，右侧约定事项中反映的实体名称，与我们在左侧汇总图表中看到的实体名称是相同的吗？\n\n17\n\n18\n\n19 答：是的。\n\n20 问：也就是 VOG、GTV、Saraca？\n\n21 答：对。我是说，虽然没提到 Hayman Capital，但提到了其他的。\n\n22\n\n23 问：明白。在汇总图表中——它反映了提供给 Brattle 的银行记录的一个子集——我想我们说过，这份 GTV/VOG 资金来源概览的总累计金额大约是 4 亿；是这样吗？\n\n24\n\n25\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 再次直接询问\n\n1\n\n2 答：是的。\n\n3 问：右侧约定事项中的初始金额，在第二行，那个金额大约是多少？\n\n4\n\n5 答：4.55 亿。\n\n6 问：加上倒数第二行还有一个额外金额。那个金额是多少？\n\n7\n\n8 答：3100 万。\n\n9 问：4.8 亿是否大于 4 亿？\n\n10 答：是的。\n\n11 默里女士：好的。洛夫特斯女士，我们可以撤下约定事项 19 了。\n\n12\n\n13 我们可以看 Z26 的第 27 张幻灯片。\n\n14 问：希顿先生，此前也有人问过您关于这张 Himalaya Exchange（喜马拉雅交易所）资金流向幻灯片上反映的一些日期范围的各种问题。您还记得那些问题吗？\n\n15\n\n16\n\n17 答：记得。\n\n18 问：具体而言，卡马拉朱先生调出了一份文件，并向您指出交易所的上线日期是 2021 年 11 月。您还记得吗？\n\n19\n\n20\n\n21 答：记得。\n\n22 问：然后指出了这里包含更早时间段的一些资金流向，特别是，如果我们看资金来源，汇总图表上的 4.738 亿是从 2021 年 6 月 2 日开始的，对吗？\n\n23\n\n24\n\n25\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 再次直接询问\n\n1 答：是的。\n\n2 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请调出政府证据 Z9，并翻到第 93 页。\n\n3\n\n4 问：希顿先生，这份政府证据最左列的日期是什么？\n\n5\n\n6 答：2021 年 5 月 20 日。\n\n7 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请放大顶部区域，一直到第二段结束。\n\n8\n\n9\n\n10 问：希顿先生，截图顶部有一个带日期的括号，然后是一些加粗文本。请您读一下。\n\n11\n\n12\n\n13 答：“[2021 年 5 月 20 日] Miles Guo（郭文贵）的 Gettr（盖特）（第 3 条）。”\n\n14 问：好的。我们来读一下这里的第一段，从“还有一件事”开始。请您为陪审团仔细读一下。\n\n15\n\n16\n\n17 答：“还有一件事我想对兄弟姐妹们说。我想重申，所有购买了 G-Club 会员卡的人，必须抓紧时间尽快完成包括 KYC（了解你的客户）和对账在内的一系列操作。这是在与时间赛跑。我不想再多谈其他事情了。”\n\n18\n\n19\n\n20\n\n21\n\n22\n\n23 问：好的。然后我们看下一段。您可以从该段的开头开始读。\n\n24\n\n25 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，我可能会请您在读的过程中高亮显示部分文本。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 再次直接询问\n\n1\n\n2 问：请继续，希顿先生。\n\n3 答：“更重要的是，想要购买 Himalaya Coins（喜币）和 Himalaya Dollars（喜美元）的战友们，必须认真周到地完成他们的 KYC。仔细阅读说明，如果需要帮助请联系各喜马拉雅农场。你们绝不能在完成 KYC 方面浪费任何时间。”\n\n4\n\n5\n\n6\n\n7\n\n8 问：希顿先生，请先在这里停一下。\n\n9 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，麻烦您高亮那两处，开头的文本“购买喜币”一直到“喜美元”。然后是“你们绝不能”这句话。\n\n10\n\n11\n\n12 问：希顿先生，同样看左边，关于这里所写的文字“你们绝不能浪费任何时间”，根据这份证据，这份摘要是哪一天在网上发布的？\n\n13\n\n14\n\n15\n\n16 答：2021 年 5 月 20 日。\n\n17 问：然后我们看这里最后几行。\n\n18 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，请从倒数第三行的“请尽最大努力”开始高亮，一直到结尾。\n\n19\n\n20\n\n21 问：希顿先生，请读一下。\n\n22 答：“通过 KYC 审核后，请尽量使用您将获得的 Himalaya Dollar（HDO，喜美元）账户进行支付。很快您就可以通过您的 HDO 账户购买 G Fashion 产品。”\n\n23\n\n24\n\n25 默里女士：谢谢您，洛夫特斯女士。可以撤下了。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - 再次直接询问\n\n1\n\n2 问：希顿先生，卡马拉朱先生还问了您一些关于您的汇总图表中反映的信息是否对 Miles Guo 有利的问题。您还记得那些问题吗？\n\n3\n\n4\n\n5 答：记得。\n\n6 问：您知道什么对 Miles Guo 有利吗？\n\n7 答：我不知道。\n\n8 问：您知道什么对政府有利吗？\n\n9 答：我不知道。\n\n10 问：您认识本案中政府的其他证人吗？\n\n11\n\n12 答：我不认识。\n\n13 问：除政府为 Brattle 在本案中的工作而向您提供的材料之外，您了解政府的其他证据吗？\n\n14\n\n15\n\n16 答：我不了解。\n\n17 问：政府是否向您透露过关于本案基础事实的任何情况？\n\n18\n\n19 答：没有。\n\n20 默里女士：法官阁下，能否容我片刻。\n\n21 法庭：可以。\n\n22 默里女士：洛夫特斯女士，我不确定我们是否有这个。如果没有，我可能会请求辩方调出辩方证据 10339。\n\n23\n\n24\n\n25 卡马拉朱先生：豪尔赫（Jorge），你介意把它调出来吗。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect（再直接询问）\n1 MS. MURRAY（默里女士）：我们可以看第 29 页。\n2 默里女士继续提问：\n3 问：Hinton（欣顿先生），这是 Kamaraju（卡马拉朱先生）\n4 在交叉询问中向您问及的文件之一。\n5 默里女士：抱歉。可能还要往后翻两页。\n6 是卡马拉朱先生询问过的关于\n7 300万美元的那笔交易。\n8 抱歉。请翻到第 89 页。谢谢。\n9 好的。如果我们能放大底部的\n10 部分。有几条 8 月 8 日的记录项。谢谢。\n11\n12 默里女士继续提问：\n13 问：欣顿先生，有人就这 300 万美元向您提问，\n14 即此处显示的第一笔资金转账。您还记得\n15 这些问题吗？\n16 答：记得。\n17 问：那是来自 ACA Capital Group（ACA资本集团）的一笔电汇；对吗？\n18 答：对。\n19 问：电汇汇入了这个 Golden Spring（金泉）账户，对吧？\n20 答：对。\n21 问：您是否看到下面两行，显示同一金泉账户\n22 有一笔借记或转出交易？\n23 答：看到了。\n24 问：那笔交易的金额是多少？\n25 答：也是 300万美元。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（南区速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Redirect（再直接询问）\n1 问：那是否与来自 ACA资本集团 的 300万美元 汇入是同一天？\n2\n3 答：是的，是同一天。\n4 默里女士：非常感谢。谢谢。我们\n5 可以把这个撤下了。\n6 Loftus（洛夫特斯女士），让我们调出 Z26。请翻到\n7 第 33 页。\n8 问：欣顿先生，这算是这份汇总证物中所包含的\n9 资金流向的高级别概览；对吗？\n10\n11 答：是的。\n12 问：看一下政府指出的 Himalaya Exchange（喜马拉雅交易所）类别，\n13 根据 Brattle（布拉特尔）在此审查的已处理账户，\n14 进入喜马拉雅交易所账户的“资金来源”金额是多少？\n15\n16 答：是的，将所有喜马拉雅账户归总在一起，\n17 来自资金来源的总流入金额为 5.17亿美元。\n18 问：欣顿先生，您是否知晓政府从以\n19 喜马拉雅交易所或控制它的实体（包括 Hamilton（汉密尔顿））\n20 名义持有的银行账户中扣押了大约 6.4亿美元？\n21\n22 答：不知道。\n23 问：而 6.4亿美元 多于 5.17亿美元，对吗？\n24 答：对。\n25 默里女士：我们可以撤下那个了。谢谢。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Hinton - Recross（再交叉询问）\n1 问：最后，欣顿先生，您是否知晓 Miles Guo（郭文贵）在\n2 2022年 申请了破产？\n3 答：不知道。\n4 问：您是否知晓他申报的资产不足\n5 约 500,000美元？\n6 答：我不知道。\n7 问：您是否知晓他——撤回。\n8 您是否知晓 G|CLUBS 在新泽西州以约 24.5 million 美元\n9 购买了一栋豪宅，资金出自\n10 这些汇总图表所反映的资金流向分析中所审查的款项？\n11\n12 MR. KAMARAJU（卡马拉朱先生）：反对提问形式。\n13 答：我见过——\n14 法庭：你能把这个问题拆分一下吗。\n15 默里女士：好的。\n16 问：欣顿先生，在审查银行记录的过程中，\n17 这些记录是否包括涉及向产权服务公司及其他公司转账\n18 24.5 million 美元的银行记录？\n19 答：是的。\n20 问：那些资金的来源是 G|CLUBS 账户吗？\n21 答：我认为是的。\n22 默里女士：法官阁下，我可以稍等片刻吗？\n23 法庭：好的。\n24 默里女士：谢谢你，欣顿先生。\n25 没有其他问题了，法官阁下。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct（直接询问）\n1 法庭：再交叉询问？\n2 卡马拉朱先生：非常简短，法官阁下。\n3 能否请调出 Z26 第 12 张幻灯片。\n4 再交叉询问\n5 卡马拉朱先生提问：\n6 问：欣顿先生，默里女士在再直接询问中就这张幻灯片向您提问了，\n7 对吗？\n8 答：是的。\n9 问：她问您是否曾被政府要求进行——\n10 我记得原话是详细的资金流向分析，\n11 对吗？\n12 答：我相信——我相信她是这么说的。\n13 问：好的。但您并没有被要求这样做，对吧？\n14 答：没错。\n15 问：而且因为您没有被要求进行详细的资金流向分析，\n16 您无法说明那 77 million 美元中是否有任何部分\n17 构成了流向 Lamp 的那 13 million 美元中的任何部分，\n18 对吧？\n19 答：对。如果您——如果您想确切知道有多少资金\n20 流经这些账户，您就必须做追踪分析。\n21\n22 问：而您并没有做那项分析，对吧？\n23 答：我没有做过。\n24 卡马拉朱先生：好的。没有其他问题了。\n25 法庭：好的。谢谢你，先生。你可以退庭了。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct（直接询问）\n1\n2 （证人退庭）\n3 法庭：检方可以传唤下一位证人了。\n4\n5 MR. FINKEL（芬克尔先生）：政府传唤 Wei Chen（陈薇）。\n6 （证人宣誓）\n7 法庭：请说出你的名字并拼写，\n8 对着麦克风讲话。\n9 证人：我的名字是 Wei Chen，拼写为 W-E-I，\n10 以及 C-H-E-N。\n11 法庭：你需要比这更大声一点说话，\n12 好让每个人都能听到你。\n13 你可以开始询问了。\n14 芬克尔先生：谢谢法官阁下。\n15 WEI CHEN（陈薇），\n16 作为政府证人出庭，\n17 经依法宣誓后作证如下：\n18 直接询问\n19 芬克尔先生提问：\n20 问：陈女士，接着法官所说的话，你可以\n21 直接把麦克风对准你的嘴巴，以便\n22 收音，好吗？请随意移动它。你可以移动\n23 顶部部件，让它正对着你的嘴巴。谢谢。\n24\n25 陈女士，你在哪里出生？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct（直接询问）\n1 答：我出生在中国。\n2 问：你何时来到美国的？\n3 答：我是在 2007年 来到美国的。\n4 问：你为什么来美国？\n5 答：为了攻读硕士学位。\n6 问：你获得硕士学位了吗？\n7 答：获得了。\n8 问：什么专业？\n9 答：工商管理硕士。\n10 问：你现在住在哪个州？\n11 答：Virginia（弗吉尼亚州）。\n12 问：你的工作是什么？\n13 答：我在一家银行工作。我协助银行管理风险，\n14 包括操作风险、财务风险和声誉风险。\n15\n16 MS. SHROFF（施罗夫女士）：不好意思。我没听清最后一个。\n17 芬克尔先生：声誉风险。\n18 问：陈女士，你曾经是郭文贵的追随者吗？\n19 答：是的。\n20 问：你今天还是郭文贵的追随者吗？\n21 答：不是了。\n22 问：为什么不是了？\n23 答：因为他是个骗子；他是个欺诈犯。\n24 问：陈女士，你最早是什么时候知道郭文贵的？\n25 答：在 2007年。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct（直接询问）\n1 问：2007年？\n2 答：抱歉。2017年。\n3 芬克尔先生：法官阁下，我们能否到法官席前一步。\n4\n5 法庭：好的。\n6 （接下一页）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct（直接询问）\n1 （在法官席旁）\n2 芬克尔先生：法官阁下，我听到旁听席传来\n3 大量的嘲笑声和嗤笑声，超出正常情况。\n4 我不知道为什么会这样，但这是不恰当的。\n5 我不想在公开场合、在所有人面前处理这件事，\n6 但在某个时刻我希望法庭能提醒旁听席肃静下来。\n7\n8 法庭：我也听到了同样的声音，我正准备\n9 叫他们停止发出声音。\n10 芬克尔先生：谢谢。\n11 施罗夫女士：法官阁下，法庭打算在陪审团面前告诉他们吗？\n12 我会——\n13 法庭：陪审团就坐在这里听着他们发表议论、\n14 发笑和嘲讽。\n15 施罗夫女士：法官阁下，我刚走进来。我整个上午\n16 都不在这里。所以我没有注意到——我其实\n17 看不到那个人，所以我正试图把那东西放下来，\n18 但是——\n19 芬克尔先生：在整个庭审过程中一直有这种情况。\n20 之前从来不是什么大事。但这次程度不同了。\n21 这就是我为什么想告知法官阁下。\n22 法庭：是的。我马上就会告知他们。\n23 对于某些人一直在聊天和做鬼脸的表现，\n24 我感到非常不满。有些人甚至戴着墨镜进来。\n25 所以我现在就要说两句。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct（直接询问）\n1\n2 （在公开法庭上）\n3 法庭：我现在对坐在旁听席上、听众席上、\n4 长椅上的各位讲话。我不想听到任何笑声\n5 或任何交头接耳。如果你们无法保持安静，\n6 就必须离开。\n7 请继续。\n8 芬克尔先生：谢谢法官阁下。\n9 芬克尔先生继续提问：\n10 问：陈女士，你说你是在 2017年 第一次知道郭文贵。\n11 你最初是如何知道郭文贵的？\n12 答：我丈夫当时在听他的 YouTube 视频，\n13 并把他介绍给了我。\n14 问：你自己也开始听郭文贵的 YouTube 视频了吗？\n15\n16 答：是的。\n17 问：你是什么时候开始看郭文贵的视频的？\n18 答：大约在 2018年 底或 2019年 初，大概在那个时间段。\n19\n20 问：在 2018年 到 2019年 那个时间段内，大体而言，\n21 郭文贵传达的信息是什么？\n22 答：他在讲把美国价值观带到中国。\n23 施罗夫女士：反对，法官阁下。我认为她只能证明\n24 她对郭先生所传达信息的理解。\n25 法庭：她可以就他陈述的内容作证。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct（直接询问）\n1 你可以继续。\n2 芬克尔先生继续提问：\n3 问：让我重新提问。陈女士，当你开始\n4 观看郭文贵的视频时，他在 2018年、\n5 2019年 传达的信息是什么？\n6 答：我的理解，我所领会到的信息是把美国价值观带到中国。\n7\n8 问：你同意那个信息吗？\n9 答：同意。\n10 问：我想提请你注意，陈女士，2020年 6月。\n11 大约在那个时候，郭文贵是否提到过一个叫 GTV Private Placement（GTV私募）的项目？\n12\n13 答：是的。\n14 问：你在 GTV私募 中投资了吗？\n15 答：投资了。\n16 问：大约多少钱？\n17 答：最开始，大约 200,000美元。\n18 问：如果有的话，郭文贵说了什么导致你在那个时候，\n19 大约在 2020年 6月，投资了 GTV私募？\n20\n21 答：郭文贵将其宣传为一个非常难得的机会。他\n22 将其宣传为上市前发行，追随者可以按\n23 每股 8美元 购买，然后当它上市时，价值\n24 会涨到十倍或百倍，甚至一千倍。因此有非常\n25 巨大的回报。他还说投资 GTV 是因为 GTV\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct（直接询问）\n1 业务将有光明的前景。它将比 YouTube、Amazon（亚马逊）更好。\n2 它不仅是一个社交媒体平台，\n3 它还将实现互联互通，比如你可以像在 Amazon.com 或 eBay.com 上那样买东西。\n4 它将成为一个非常强大的平台。它将会成功。他们将获得\n5 巨额回报。\n6 问：大约在那个时候，陈女士，郭文贵有没有说过\n7 投资 GTV私募 是有风险还是没有风险？\n8\n9 答：完全没有。只有回报，巨额回报，零风险。\n10 问：那是郭文贵说的？\n11 答：完全没错。\n12 问：陈女士，当你决定投资 GTV私募 时，\n13 根据郭文贵所说的话，你对你投资的这笔钱将如何使用\n14 的理解是什么？\n15 答：我的理解是这笔钱将用于开发和壮大 GTV 业务，\n16 包括收购软件、搭建架构以使业务成功，\n17 成为像 YouTube、亚马逊、eBay 等对手那样的竞争者。\n18\n19 问：陈女士，在你决定投资 GTV私募 之前，\n20 你在股票市场上投资多吗？\n21 答：不多。我不做有风险的投资。\n22 问：如果你通常不投资股票，你为什么决定投资 GTV私募？\n23\n24\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 答：因为——\n2 SHROFF 女士（施罗夫律师）：反对。她不是这么说的。\n3 FINKEL 先生（芬克尔检察官）：这是一个提问。\n4 问：如果您平时不投资股票，为什么决定投资 GTV Private Placement（GTV 私募）？\n5\n6 SHROFF 女士：她没说——\n7 法庭：她没有具体提到股票。\n8 SHROFF 女士：是的，她提到了，她说她不投资有风险的股票。\n9\n10 法庭：没错。\n11 答：我可以澄清一下。\n12 问：如果可以的话，让我来提问。\n13 陈女士，如果您通常不投资有风险的股票，为什么决定投资 GTV Private Placement？\n14\n15\n16 答：因为没有风险。而且我想澄清一下。在我看来，股票是一种有风险的投资，所以我不投资股票。\n17\n18\n19 FINKEL 先生：我们可以调出作为证据的 GX VK5。\n20\n21 问：陈女士，在投资 GTV Private Placement 之前——\n22 答：抱歉。我没看到显示任何内容。\n23 问：我知道。我正在提问。\n24 答：哦，好的。\n25 问：好的。现在大家的屏幕上应该都能看到了。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区速记员有限责任公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 答：好的，我现在看到了。\n2 问：陈女士，您以前见过这份文件吗？\n3 答：见过。\n4 问：在您投资 GTV Private Placement 之前，您见过这份文件吗？\n5\n6 答：是的，我见过。\n7 问：您审阅过它吗？\n8 答：是的，我审阅过。\n9 问：顺便问一下，您是怎么拿到这份文件的？\n10 答：Miles Guo（郭文贵）通过 WhatsApp 聊天向我丈夫发送了这份文件的链接。\n11\n12 问：在您审阅——好吧，撤回。\n13 FINKEL 先生：我们可以翻到第 10 页。\n14 问：您看到上面写的“4. Use of Proceeds（募集资金用途）”了吗？\n15 答：看到了。\n16 问：在审阅了这部分资金用途后，您当时对投资到 GTV Private Placement 的资金将如何使用有何理解？\n17\n18\n19 答：将按照这里的图表使用，即第 10 页所概述的将资金的百分比用于那些活动。\n20\n21\n22 问：您看到上面写着“Other, approximately 5 percent（其他，约 5%）”了吗？\n23\n24 答：看到了。\n25 问：您当时对“Other（其他）”的含义有何理解？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 答：我的理解是一些日常运营开支、行政、人力资源招聘。\n2\n3 FINKEL 先生：我们可以翻到第 15 页。\n4 问：陈女士，当您考虑投资 GTV 时，您对 GTV 中的“G”代表什么有何理解？\n5\n6 答：我的理解那是 Guo TV（郭媒体）。\n7 问：当您考虑是否投资 GTV Private Placement 时，您对——好吧，撤回。\n8\n9\n10 您看到底部写着“6.3 Sponsor and Adviser of GTV Media（GTV 传媒的发起人与顾问）”了吗？\n11\n12 答：看到了。\n13 问：您能读一下上面写的内容吗？\n14 答：“The Sponsor and Adviser of GTV Media, Mr. Wengui Guo (a/k/a Miles Guo, Ho Wan Kwok or Miles Kwok), is a billionaire, a successful businessman, and a dissident in China（GTV 传媒的发起人兼顾问郭文贵先生[又名 Miles Guo、Ho Wan Kwok 或 Miles Kwok]，是一位亿万富翁、成功的商人，以及中国的异见人士）。”\n15\n16\n17 问：您可以停在那里了。陈女士，这里说郭先生是亿万富翁。郭文贵关于财富的声称对您投资 GTV Private Placement 的决定产生了什么影响（如果有的话）？\n18\n19\n20\n21 答：这在我的决定中起到了关键影响。那让我相信他是一个富有的人，他拥有资源，而且他强调了机构投资者投资 GTV 的事；那会让它取得成功。\n22\n23\n24\n25 问：陈女士，这里说郭先生是 GTV Media（GTV 传媒）的发起人和\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 顾问。这份文件里就是这么说的。根据您对郭先生所做广播的查看，您当时对郭在 GTV 中的角色（如果有的话）有何理解？\n2\n3\n4 答：我对他的角色的理解是他拥有它，他控制它，并且他创立了它。\n5\n6 问：那是基于您看过的广播。\n7 答：是的。\n8 FINKEL 先生：我们可以翻到第 18 页。\n9 或者实际上——抱歉——我们翻到第 13 页吧。\n10 第 12 页。\n11 问：好的。您看到写着“Executive Directors（执行董事）”的地方了吗？\n12 答：看到了。\n13 问：列出的第一位执行董事的名字是什么？\n14 答：Yvette Wang（王雁平）。\n15 FINKEL 先生：请翻到下一页。\n16 问：列出的下一位执行董事的名字是什么？\n17 答：Max Krasner。\n18 问：在您考虑是否投资 GTV 时，您对郭文贵与 Max Krasner 之间是否存在关系以及有何关系有了解吗？\n19\n20\n21 答：没有，我完全不知道。\n22 FINKEL 先生：好的。Loftus 女士，我们可以翻到第 15 页吗。\n23\n24 问：您能读一下列为非执行董事的人有谁吗。\n25 答：Darren Blanton 和 Aaron Mitchell。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 FINKEL 先生：Loftus 女士，请往回翻一页到第 14 页。\n2\n3 问：您能读一下这里列出的非执行董事吗。\n4 答：Steve Bannon（史蒂夫·班农）、Kyle Bass（凯尔·巴斯）。\n5 FINKEL 先生：请翻到第 17 页。\n6 问：陈女士，在您投资 GTV Private Placement 时，您对您和您的丈夫是否属于合格投资者（accredited investor）有何理解？\n7\n8\n9 答：我的理解是我们符合合格投资者的要求，并且具备该资格。\n10\n11 问：因此——好吧，撤回。\n12 FINKEL 先生：Loftus 女士，请翻到下一页。\n13\n14 问：您看到底部写着“Risk Factors（风险因素）”了吗？\n15 答：看到了。\n16 FINKEL 先生：Loftus 女士，请翻阅一下那部分。\n17\n18 问：在投资 GTV 之前，您审阅过那些风险因素吗？\n19\n20 答：是的。\n21 问：那些风险因素对您的投资决定产生了什么影响（如果有的话）？\n22\n23 答：没有任何影响。\n24 问：为什么没有？\n25 答：因为按我当时的想法，那些都是套话，\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 而且我相信了郭文贵在视频中所说的话，没有任何风险，只有巨额回报。\n2\n3 法庭：你说的“套话”是什么意思？\n4 证人：就像在法律文件里，通常会有谈论风险的措辞。\n5\n6 FINKEL 先生：Loftus 女士，我们可以把那个撤下来了。\n7 问：对您来说什么更重要，是我们刚才看的那份备忘录，还是郭文贵在视频里说的内容？\n8\n9 答：对我有何更重要？\n10 问：当您考虑是否投资 GTV Private Placement 时，什么更重要，是我们刚才看的那份备忘录，还是郭文贵在视频里说的内容？\n11\n12\n13 答：郭文贵在视频里说的内容。\n14 问：为什么？\n15 答：因为我信任他，我信任他说的话，我相信他是一个富有的人，我相信他是一个值得信赖的人。我相信他说的话，说我就是他的姐妹，他希望我致富。我相信他从不撒谎，他是一个非常真实的人，所以我信任他关于 GTV 投资所说的每一个字。\n16\n17\n18\n19\n20\n21 问：陈女士，如果您当时知道您为 GTV Private Placement 汇出的款项将被用作以郭文贵儿子名义向某对冲基金投资一亿美元的一部分，您还会向 GTV 汇款吗？\n22\n23\n24\n25 答：不会，绝对不会。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 问：如果您当时知道尽管郭文贵在视频里作了陈述但您的投资并没有保障，您还会向 GTV 汇款吗？\n2\n3\n4 答：不会，绝对不会。\n5 问：您收到任何股票凭证了吗？\n6 答：我得以登录一个网站，能够花钱购买两张印有股份数量的纸。\n7\n8 问：您订购了那些纸吗？\n9 答：是的。\n10 问：费用是多少？\n11 答：一百美元。\n12 问：您具体把 GTV——好吧，您在 GTV Private Placement 中投资了多少钱？\n13\n14 答：接近 200,000 美元。\n15 问：您把那笔钱汇给了哪个实体？\n16 答：Saraca Media（萨拉卡传媒）。\n17 问：您收到了什么指示——好吧，您是怎么知道要汇给 Saraca Media 的？\n18\n19 答：因为郭文贵通过 WhatsApp 聊天向我丈夫发送了一个文件链接，当我们点击该网页应用——或者该链接时，它会带你进入一份包含电汇指示信息的文件。\n20\n21\n22\n23 FINKEL 先生：法官阁下，我可以走近证人吗。\n24 法庭：可以。\n25 FINKEL 先生：法官阁下，我已向陈女士递交了一个活页夹，\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 其中包含 VB 系列中的以下文件：14、24、26、27、29、31 和 33。\n2\n3 问：陈女士，请翻阅一下那个活页夹，翻完后请告诉我。\n4\n5 答：好的，我看过了。\n6 问：您认得那个活页夹里的文件吗？\n7 答：是的，我认得。\n8 问：它们是什么？\n9 答：那些是我提供的文件。\n10 问：那些文件与什么有关？\n11 答：与郭文贵的欺诈骗局有关。\n12 FINKEL 先生：Loftus 女士，我们可以调出 Stip 21。\n13 法官阁下，政府方提请将该约定事项（Stip 21）采纳为证据。\n14\n15 法庭：准予采纳。\n16 （政府方证据 Stip 21 已被采纳为证据）\n17 FINKEL 先生：Stip 21 载明，“兹由双方约定并同意——”\n18\n19 SHROFF 女士：法官阁下，Finkel 先生能否放慢速度，因为我认为翻译人员跟不上了。\n20\n21 FINKEL 先生：我很乐意放慢速度。\n22 口译员：谢谢。\n23 法庭：继续。\n24 FINKEL 先生：“兹由双方约定并同意：在下表中，A 栏下列出的证据包含外语文本、音频或视频。\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1\n2 “在下表中，B 栏下列出的证据及其子项是对 A 栏下列出的证据及其子项中所包含的音频或文本的真实且准确的翻译。”\n3\n4\n5\n6 Loftus 女士，请翻到下一页。\n7 在 A 栏中，列有 VB24、13、10、27 以及 24T、13T、10T、27T。\n8\n9 法官阁下，政府方此时提请采纳活页夹中的文件，即 VB13、14、24、26、27、29、31、33 以及经双方约定确认的相应译文，即 VB24-T、13-T、10-T、27-T。\n10\n11\n12\n13 法庭：准予采纳。\n14 （政府方证据 VB13、VB14、VB24、VB26、VB27、VB29、VB31、VB33 已被采纳为证据）\n15\n16 （政府方证据 VB10-T、VB13-T、VB24-T、VB27-T 已被采纳为证据）\n17\n18 FINKEL 先生：Loftus 女士，我们可以把那个撤下来了。\n19 由 FINKEL 先生继续主问：\n20 问：陈女士，您最初是什么时候得知名为 G|CLUBS 的事物的？\n21\n22 答：我最早是在大约——大约 2020 年 10 月得知的。\n23\n24 问：陈女士，起初郭文贵对 G|CLUBS 是怎么说的（如果有提及的话）？\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - Direct\n1 答：如果我没记错的话，我认为他说那是一项会员资格。\n2 问：您为 G|CLUBS 会员资格汇款了吗？\n3 答：没有，绝没有。\n4 问：您向一家名为 Crane 的公司汇款了吗？\n5 答：是的。\n6 问：您为什么向一家名为 Crane 的公司汇款？\n7 答：因为郭文贵宣传了增持更多 GTV 股份的机会，为了做到这一点，郭文贵让我们联系农场以完成对额外 GTV 股份的投资。所以我们联系了 MOS 农场，并获得了 Crane 的一个银行账户。\n8\n9\n10\n11 问：MOS 是什么？\n12 答：Mountains of Spice Farm（香草山农场）。\n13 问：您对谁是 Mountains of Spice Farm 的负责人有何理解？\n14\n15 答：当时是 Lo——\n16 SHROFF 女士：您问的是现在的负责人是谁，还是在哪一年的负责人？\n17\n18 问：陈女士，您对——是的，您对谁是 Mountains of Spices 的负责人有何理解？\n19\n20\n21 SHROFF 女士：同样的反对理由。\n22 法庭：你问的是现在是还是过去是？\n23 FINKEL 先生：嗯，我认为是一样的，不过——\n24 问：在您考虑向 Crane 汇款时，谁是 Mountains of Spice 农场的负责人？\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 直接询问\n1 答：那时是长岛哥（Long Island Brother）。\n2 问：您是否看到长岛哥和 Miles Guo（郭文贵）在视频中\n3 一同出现？\n4 答：是的，一直如此。\n5 问：什么是农场？\n6 答：在我看来，农场就是郭文贵要求\n7 人们组建的实体，以帮助追随者加入农场来\n8 完成投资。\n9 问：陈女士，在您当时考虑向 Crane（克莱恩）\n10 汇款以购买更多 GTV 股份时，郭文贵如果有所表示的话，\n11 在其视频中就 GTV 的价值说了些什么？\n12 答：郭文贵说他聘请了独立估值公司对\n13 GTV 业务进行了估值，它已经——它已经\n14 升值了。我不记得具体升值了多少\n15 倍，大概十倍左右，但这足以吸引\n16 我汇出更多款项来购买额外的 GTV 股份。\n17 问：郭文贵是否解释了为什么为了获得额外的\n18 GTV 股份，您必须通过农场和克莱恩，而\n19 不是像之前那样直接汇给 Saraca（萨拉卡）？\n20 答：我不记得他解释过。\n21 芬克尔先生（MR. FINKEL）：能否调出已列入证据的内容，在\n22 左侧展示 VB24，在右侧展示 VB24-T。\n23 好的。正如各方所约定的那样，\n24 译文在屏幕右侧。\n25 问：陈女士，您认得屏幕左侧的\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 直接询问\n1 文件吗？\n2 答：认得。\n3 问：顶部写着 Crane。您看到了吗？\n4 答：看到了。\n5 问：好的。这份文件来自哪里；来自什么实体？\n6 答：这份文件是 MOS 农场的义工提供给我们的。\n7 我不知道它来自哪里，但它是由一名 MOS 义工\n8 通过 Discord 聊天发送给我们的。\n9 问：什么是 Discord？\n10 答：Discord 是农场和\n11 喜马拉雅联盟（Himalaya Alliance）用来召集追随者的社交媒体平台。\n12 芬克尔先生：洛夫图斯女士（Ms. Loftus），请帮我们翻到这两份文件的\n13 下一页。\n14 问：那么陈女士，您对这份文件（即 VB24）\n15 的理解是什么？\n16 答：当我们签署这份文件时，我们以为，这就是\n17 完成这项投资所必需的文件。\n18 问：屏幕上的这份具体文件，是您签署的\n19 文件吗？\n20 答：是我丈夫签署的。\n21 问：顶部的红色文字是什么？您对顶部\n22 红色文字的理解是什么？\n23 答：顶部的红色文字写着致 G|CLUBS 客户，意思就是\n24 付款的人，并要在上面写上名字。\n25 问：这些是农场通过\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 直接询问\n1 Discord 频道提供的指示吗？\n2 施罗夫女士（MS. SHROFF）：反对。农场并没有提供\n3 指示。农场提供的是一份文件。\n4 法庭（THE COURT）：反对成立。\n5 问：您的理解是否为：农场提供的这份文件是\n6 关于如何向克莱恩办理付款\n7 的指示？\n8 答：是的，那是我的理解。\n9 芬克尔先生：请调出 VB26。\n10 问：这份文件顶部写着谁的名字？\n11 答：我的名字。\n12 问：下面写着 G|CLUBS 参考号。您\n13 看到了吗？\n14 答：看到了。\n15 问：那个号码是做什么用的？\n16 答：那是我丈夫在 G|CLUBS 网站上创建订单时\n17 获取的一个号码。\n18 问：陈女士，对于 G|CLUBS 与您想要购买的这些\n19 额外 GTV 股份之间的关系，\n20 您如果有任何理解的话，您的理解是什么？\n21 答：我的理解是郭文贵在其广播视频中所宣传的，\n22 如果我们购买额外的 GTV 股份，\n23 那些 G|CLUBS 会员资格将作为一项福利免费赠送。\n24 问：您是否看到顶部写着 Crane Advisory Group（克莱恩咨询集团），\n25 陈女士？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 直接询问\n1 答：看到了。\n2 问：您实际上是否向克莱恩咨询集团汇了款？\n3 答：是的。\n4 问：大约汇了多少？\n5 答：大约十万美元。\n6 问：那十万美元是从哪里来的？\n7 答：这十万美元来自我的房屋\n8 净值。\n9 问：您这话是什么意思？\n10 答：意思是我的房屋二次抵押贷款。\n11 问：您为了尝试购买额外的 GTV 股份，\n12 办理了房屋二次抵押贷款吗？\n13 答：是的。\n14 问：为什么？\n15 答：因为我相信郭文贵所说的 GTV 股份会\n16 带来巨额回报，能够带来足以\n17 抵消我从房屋净值借款成本的回报。\n18 问：陈女士，对于向克莱恩汇出的十万\n19 美元能换取多少份 G|CLUBS 会员资格，\n20 您如果有任何理解的话，您的理解是什么？\n21 答：我的理解是会有两份免费的\n22 5级 G|CLUBS 会员资格。\n23 问：该理解是基于什么得出的？\n24 答：基于郭文贵在其 YouTube 及广播视频中\n25 一再强调和反复说明的内容，即如果\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 直接询问\n1 您购买 GTV 股份，就能免费获得 G|CLUBS 会员资格，\n2 这是他给予追随同仁的一项福利。\n3 问：您是否曾向一家名为 HCHK 的实体汇款？\n4 芬克尔先生：洛夫图斯女士，我们可以把这个撤下了。\n5 答：汇过。\n6 芬克尔先生：能否调出已列入证据的\n7 VB29。\n8 问：这份文件是什么？\n9 答：这是我汇款给 HCHK Technology（HCHK科技）\n10 的电汇收据或确认单。\n11 问：“付款方（Debit Party）”下面写的是您和您丈夫的名字吗？\n12 答：是的。\n13 问：您向 HCHK Technologies 汇了多少款？\n14 答：十一万美元。\n15 问：您为什么向 HCHK Technologies 汇了 110,000 美元？\n16 答：为了购买额外的 GTV 股份。\n17 问：根据您从郭文贵的视频中获得的理解，\n18 这些额外的 GTV 股份是否同样附带 G|CLUBS\n19 会员资格？\n20 答：是的。\n21 问：陈女士，您需要多份 G|CLUBS 会员资格吗？\n22 答：不需要。我不需要任何 G|CLUBS 会员资格，因为它不\n23 提供任何实质内容。\n24 问：什么是 HCHK Technologies？\n25 答：我完全不知道 HCHK Technologies 是什么。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 直接询问\n1 问：大约在这个时候，陈女士——我认为这份文件的日期是\n2 2021年8月——郭文贵如果有所表示的话，关于购买\n3 额外 GTV 股份是否具有紧迫性说了些什么？\n4 答：紧迫性就在于机会窗口正在关闭。如果\n5 你想获得更多 GTV 股份，就必须抓紧时间。\n6 问：郭文贵谈到的这种紧迫性，对您尝试购买更多\n7 GTV 股份的决定产生了什么影响\n8 （如果有的话）？\n9 答：这促使我尽快向该账户汇款。\n10 我相信我们在 8月15日 收到了银行账户，\n11 次日即 8月16日 就把钱汇出了。\n12 问：这份文件底部写着“REF: MOS”。您\n13 看到了吗？\n14 答：看到了。\n15 问：MOS 代表什么？\n16 答：Mountains of Spice（香草山）。\n17 芬克尔先生：洛夫图斯女士，我们可以撤下这个了。\n18 问：当您在考虑时——您访问过 G|CLUBS\n19 网站吗？\n20 答：访问过。\n21 问：您看到了什么？\n22 答：我看到郭文贵抽着雪茄并在他的游艇上。\n23 问：针对汇给 HCHK 的 110,000 美元以及汇给克莱恩的大约十万美元，\n24 您后来拿到额外的 GTV 股份了吗？\n25 答：没有，我认为没有。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 直接询问\n1 芬克尔先生：能否调出已列入证据的\n2 VB14。\n3 陈女士，如果您早知道您汇给 HCHK 的款项和汇给\n4 克莱恩的款项换不来任何股份，\n5 您还会汇出那笔钱吗？\n6 答：当然不会。\n7 问：我们在 VB14 中看到的是什么？\n8 答：这是我丈夫的 G|CLUBS 会员账户，这是他\n9 登录账户时显示的\n10 账户信息。\n11 问：您是否在电脑上在线看到了这些账户信息？\n12 答：是的。\n13 问：陈女士，您或您的丈夫是否曾经\n14 使用过 G|CLUBS 会员资格中的\n15 G Fashion（G时尚）折扣？\n16 答：使用过。\n17 问：您购买了大约多少金额的 G Fashion 服装？\n18 答：我支付了大约 2,000 美元。\n19 问：您获得的折扣是多少？\n20 答：50% 折扣（五折）。\n21 问：陈女士，如果您早知道您汇给 HCHK Technologies 和\n22 克莱恩咨询集团的钱所能换来的全部东西\n23 仅仅是 G Fashion 商品的五折优惠，您还会\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 直接询问\n1 汇出那笔钱吗？\n2 答：抱歉。您能重复一下那个问题吗。\n3 问：当然。如果您早知道向克莱恩和\n4 HCHK 汇出 200,000 美元所能换来的全部东西就只是 G\n5 Fashion 的五折优惠，您还会汇出那笔钱吗？\n6 答：不会。G Fashion 的五折优惠根本不算什么。我付了\n7 2,000 美元买的东西，即使打了折，也根本不值\n8 我付的那些钱。\n9 问：据您所知，G|CLUBS 是否提供过任何酒店折扣？\n10 答：我没听说过。\n11 问：您是否通过邮寄收到过来自 G|CLUBS 的任何物品？\n12 答：我收到过一次圣诞礼物。\n13 问：圣诞礼物里有什么？\n14 答：一些饼干、咖啡和一个咖啡马克杯。\n15 芬克尔先生：您可以撤下那个了。洛夫图斯女士，\n16 能否仅向证人展示 VB35。\n17 问：这是什么？\n18 答：那就是我收到的咖啡马克杯。\n19 芬克尔先生：政府方提呈 VB35。\n20 施罗夫女士：没有异议，法官阁下。\n21 法庭：予以采纳。\n22 （政府方证据 VB35 已被采纳列入证据）\n23 问：陈女士，如果您早知道您从\n24 G|CLUBS 能得到的全部东西就是一个咖啡马克杯、一些饼干、咖啡以及\n25 G Fashion 折扣，您还会向 HCHK 和克莱恩汇款吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 直接询问\n1 答：不会。\n2 问：您是否从 G|CLUBS 那里得知或\n3 听说过有关 F1 赛车折扣的任何消息？\n4 答：没有。\n5 芬克尔先生：您可以撤下那个了。\n6 洛夫图斯女士，请帮我们在左侧\n7 调出 VB27，在右侧调出 27-T。\n8 问：右侧是双方约定的译文。\n9 陈女士，您认得屏幕左侧的\n10 文件吗？\n11 答：认得。\n12 问：您能否向陪审团说明一下您对\n13 这份文件的理解。\n14 答：我对这份文件的理解是，这是 MOS 农场\n15 要求我们填写的用于计算 GTV 股份总额的表格。\n16 问：您说的 GTV 股份总额是什么意思？\n17 答：因为所有的投资，包括捐款，都与 GTV\n18 股份挂钩。郭文贵在视频中说过并强调，\n19 所有不同的投资加上捐款都会赋予\n20 追随者等额的 GTV 股份。\n21 问：那么对于为什么需要进行计算，您的理解是什么？\n22 答：因为投资非常复杂，存在\n23 不同的投资项目，以至于开始搞不清\n24 每个成员已完成了多少投资，所以我们需要\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 直接询问\n1 提交这份表格，包括金额和付款收据，\n2 供 MOS 农场进行核实，然后为每位成员\n3 计算出 GTV 股份的总额。\n4 问：您和您丈夫出于该目的填写了这份表格吗？\n5 答：是的。\n6 问：好的。这里第 2 项写着：“本表格用于重组项目的要求。”\n7 陈女士，您看到了吗？\n8 答：看到了。\n9 问：您对重组项目\n10 的理解是什么？\n11 答：我的理解是由于 SEC（美国证券交易委员会）的诉讼，郭文贵\n12 提到了一个新的 GTV 平台，对旧平台进行重组，\n13 所以这被称为 GTV 重组。\n14 问：您说的 SEC 诉讼是什么意思？\n15 答：我当时的理解是，SEC 提出了指控，\n16 并且针对我们在 2020年6月 进行的 GTV 投资\n17 正在进行一些诉讼。\n18 问：陈女士，您从 SEC 那里收到钱了吗？\n19 答：收到了。\n20 问：那笔钱属于公平基金（Fair Fund）分配的一部分吗？\n21 答：是的。\n22 问：陈女士，关于郭文贵在广播中就人们应当如何处理\n23 从 SEC 的公平基金处收到的\n24 款项所作的言论，您如果有所回忆的话，您记得些什么？\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 主问\n\n1 答：Miles Guo（郭文贵）要求人们把公平基金（Fair Funds）的分配款退回到郭文贵相关的实体。\n\n2 问：郭文贵有没有就收到公平基金分配款的人应该快点还是慢点退回发表过任何意见？\n\n3 答：郭文贵说他们应该快点退回，并设定了在收到公平基金分配款后 45 天的时间期限。\n\n4 问：如果郭文贵说过的话，关于为什么会有 45 天的时间期限，他是怎么说的？\n\n5 答：我不记得他确切说了什么，但我的理解是，有喜马拉雅 H 币（Himalaya H Coin）与作为公平基金一部分的投资挂钩。如果你不在 45 天的时间期限内把钱退回去，那么根据成员们能够以每枚 10 美分购买的投资额所分配给他们的喜马拉雅 H 币就会作废。\n\n6 芬克尔律师（MR. FINKEL）：洛夫特斯女士（Ms. Loftus），麻烦请翻到这些文件的第 3 页。\n\n7 问：看英文版本，陈女士（Ms. Chen），你看到底部写着“Apple Coin，G1，您是否成功购买了 G1 苹果币？”吗？\n\n8 答：看到了。\n\n9 问：那是什么？\n\n10 答：我的理解是，那是可以通过苹果商店（Apple Store）购买的数字货币的初始版本。\n\n11 问：你购买过 G1 苹果币吗？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭记录公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 主问\n\n1 答：没有，我没有。\n\n2 芬克尔律师：好的。洛夫特斯女士，我们能不能翻到各自的下一页。\n\n3 问：那么，陈女士，我们正在看的这份表格，是你对表格中问题的回答吗？比如在 G Dollar（G 币）下面写的“否”？\n\n4 答：不好意思。您能再重复一遍您的问题吗？\n\n5 问：当然可以。你看到在“您是否成功购买了 G2 且未申请退款或已收到退款？”下方写着“否”吗？你看到了吗？\n\n6 答：看到了。\n\n7 问：那个“否”，是你和你丈夫的回答吗？\n\n8 答：是的。\n\n9 问：好的。然后关于第 4 项，上面写着“老椅子（Old Chair）。您是老椅子的拥有者吗？”你选择了“是”；对吗？\n\n10 答：是的。\n\n11 问：什么是老椅子？\n\n12 答：所以老椅子，按我的理解，就是最初的 GTV 股份投资者。我们直接与郭文贵联系以获取向萨拉卡传媒（Saraca Media）汇款的电汇指引，当时有 10 万美元的最低投资额要求，满足了该要求就被视为老椅子之一，然后在所有农场（farms）中，总共大约有 1300 个老椅子。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 主问\n\n1 问：底部的那个数字，198,700，代表什么？\n\n2 答：那个数字代表我汇给萨拉卡传媒的钱，总共是 90——90——是的，就是这里的这个美元金额。\n\n3 问：好的。陈女士，你参与了农场借款项目吗？\n\n4 答：没有，我没有。\n\n5 芬克尔律师：好的。洛夫特斯女士，请翻到下一页。\n\n6 还有这里——那个用不了吗？\n\n7 问：好的。上面写着“GC 订单号（GC Order Number）”。你填在那里的是什么订单号？\n\n8 答：这是一个与我们为那个克兰（Crane）合规文件包所完成的订单号相同的号码，所以那是我丈夫在 G|CLUBS 网站上创建订单后获得的号码。\n\n9 芬克尔律师：洛夫特斯女士，请翻到下一页。\n\n10 问：那么在这里，第 8 项写着 G 俱乐部卡（G Club Card），你看到了吗，在底部？\n\n11 答：看到了。\n\n12 芬克尔律师：好的。洛夫特斯女士，我们可以翻到下一页。\n\n13 问：你选择了“否”，对吗？\n\n14 答：是的。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 主问\n\n1 问：好的。你为什么选择“否”？\n\n2 答：因为我是购买额外的 GTV 股份，而不是购买 G 俱乐部会员资格。\n\n3 芬克尔律师：请翻到下一页。\n\n4 问：然后第 12 项写着“总结（Summary）”。你看到了吗？\n\n5 答：看到了。\n\n6 问：上面写着：“您的总投资额（美元）。总投资额 = G1 + G2 + 老椅子 + 原始 VOG/凤凰（Original VOG/Phoenix）+ 从喜马拉雅纽约 MOS 借款（Borrowing from Himalaya New York MOS）+ 从其他农场借款 + G 俱乐部实际购买额 + 其他农场冻结金额 + 捐赠金额。”你看到所有这些了吗？\n\n7 答：看到了。\n\n8 问：你理解这个数学等式是用来做什么的？\n\n9 答：用来计算总的 GTV 股份。\n\n10 问：那“其他农场冻结金额”是什么意思；你知道吗？\n\n11 答：我的理解是，有某些农场借款被称为被当地政府冻结，所以它们被定义为 MOS 农场之外的“其他农场冻结金额”。\n\n12 芬克尔律师：洛夫特斯女士，请翻到下一页。\n\n13 问：在这里，第 13-2 项，正中间写着“您的投资计划”。你看到了吗？\n\n14 答：看到了。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 主问\n\n1 问：你选择了什么？\n\n2 答：我选择通过卡项目参与投资。所以这里的翻译不准确。不是购买卡和股权。是分发卡和股权。\n\n3 什罗夫律师（MS. SHROFF）：反对。她没有翻译资质。文件本身已有说明，而且文件——\n\n4 法庭：我支持该反对。\n\n5 问：关于你为什么选择那第三个选项按钮，你的理解是什么？\n\n6 答：因为我看了中文版本。在中文版本里，写的是通过卡项目参与投资。在中文版本里，意思就是分发卡和股权股份。\n\n7 问：另外两个选项，仅购买 G 俱乐部卡或仅用于投资，你能解释一下你对这些选项含义的理解吗？\n\n8 答：可以。那些选项意味着这是 GTV 股份投资，而 G 俱乐部卡是免费提供的福利，你有权自愿放弃这项免费 G 俱乐部会员资格的福利，因此，第二个选项，即仅 GTV 股份，意味着你放弃了 G 俱乐部会员资格的免费福利。\n\n9 问：所以你认为你是在购买股份——\n\n10 什罗夫律师：反对诱导性发问。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6Q1GUO3 Chen - 主问\n\n1 芬克尔律师：我还没有问完我的问题。\n\n2 法庭：他还没问到问题呢。请继续。\n\n3 问：陈女士，你给 HCHK 和 Crane（克兰）汇过钱，对吗？\n\n4 答：是的。\n\n5 （继续见下一页）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 主问\n\n1 由芬克尔律师继续发问：\n\n2 问：关于向这两个实体汇款你会获得什么，你的理解是什么？\n\n3 答：GTV 股份。\n\n4 问：除此之外你还会获得别的什么吗？\n\n5 答：免费的 G/Club 会员资格。\n\n6 问：洛夫特斯女士，你可以撤下那个了。陈女士，你加入过农场吗？\n\n7 答：加入过。\n\n8 问：哪一个？\n\n9 答：MOS 农场。\n\n10 问：你为那个农场做过志愿者吗？\n\n11 答：做过。\n\n12 问：你作为 MOS 农场志愿者所做工作的性质是什么？\n\n13 答：我的工作是重新核对按 10 美分一枚的 ICO 价格分配给每位成员的喜马拉雅 H 币，以确认该分配是否准确。\n\n14 问：你做 MOS 农场志愿者花了多少小时？\n\n15 答：平均每周大约 40 个小时。\n\n16 问：你当时也在工作吗？\n\n17 答：是的。\n\n18 问：你有孩子吗？\n\n19 答：有。\n\n20 问：你是怎么抽出时间做所有这些事的？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 主问\n\n1 答：我不睡觉，而且我休工作年假来做这个志愿者工作。\n\n2 问：你为什么决定花这么多时间为 MOS 农场做志愿者？\n\n3 答：因为郭文贵要求我们做志愿者。他要求我们不仅要投资，还要做志愿工作。而且当时我的 H 币分配，对我过去的投资计算有误，所以我担心其他成员的投资也可能被算错他们应得的 H 币。\n\n4 我知道那些战友追随者汇给郭文贵的每一分钱都是辛苦钱，我不想让他们遭遇和我一样的处境，辛苦钱汇给了郭文贵却被算错了。\n\n5 问：你什么时候开始为 MOS 农场做志愿者的？\n\n6 答：在 2022 年 3 月。\n\n7 问：你大约什么时候停止的？\n\n8 答：2023 年 3 月。\n\n9 问：在你观看郭文贵谈论这些投资项目的各个视频中，他有没有说他身在何处？\n\n10 答：我的理解是曼哈顿雪莉荷兰酒店（Sherry Netherland Hotel）的顶层公寓，还有他在格林威治（Greenwich）的房子，那栋房子是他很久以前买的。\n\n11 问：洛夫特斯女士，请调出证据 C205。在调出来的同时，陈女士，你是否见过郭文贵和一辆车一起出现在视频中？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 主问\n\n1 答：见过。\n\n2 问：那辆车长什么样？\n\n3 答：一辆红色的跑车。\n\n4 问：那是什么车，你知道吗？\n\n5 答：我知道是一辆跑车，看起来非常昂贵，但我不知道它确切是什么车。\n\n6 问：如果郭文贵说过的话，他是怎么说那辆车的？\n\n7 答：那是他的车。\n\n8 问：洛夫特斯女士，你能往下滚动一点吗。你认得戴墨镜和帽子的人吗？\n\n9 答：认得。\n\n10 问：是谁？\n\n11 答：郭文贵。\n\n12 问：你认得后面的那面旗帜吗？\n\n13 答：认得。\n\n14 问：那是什么？\n\n15 答：新中国联邦（New Federal State of China）的旗帜。\n\n16 问：根据郭文贵在视频中所说的，你清楚这个视频是从哪里录制的吗？\n\n17 答：我的理解是这是在雪莉荷兰酒店的顶层公寓录制的，就是曼哈顿那家昂贵的酒店。\n\n18 问：我们可以撤下那个了。什么是 G 银行（G Bank）？\n\n19 答：G 银行是郭文贵宣传的另一个投资机会，称其为拥有数字货币牌照的银行，可以与喜马拉雅交易所（Himalaya Exchange）相辅相成，进行数字货币与法定货币之间的结算。它非常赚钱，而且他们之所以能够收购它，是因为 William Je（余建明）在金融界非常有影响力。他有人脉关系，能够让他们成功购买这家 G 银行。\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 主问\n\n1 问：你参加过关于 G 银行的任何视频会议吗？\n\n2 答：参加过。\n\n3 问：郭文贵是这些会议的参与者吗？\n\n4 答：是的。\n\n5 问：余建明呢？\n\n6 答：余建明参加了与郭文贵分开的 Webex 通话。\n\n7 问：如果郭文贵说过的话，他是怎么说 G 银行的？\n\n8 答：郭文贵说 G 银行是拥有数字货币牌照的银行。获得数字货币牌照是非常罕见的。它将构建喜马拉雅 H 币交易所生态系统的未来，与其相辅相成。它将会非常赚钱，有非常光明的前景，那是你可以传给你的孩子以及世代子孙的资产类型。这是一个一生只可能出现一次的罕见机会。如果你进行那项投资，你将成为 G 银行的创始股东。\n\n9 问：郭文贵在谈及 G 银行的语境下有没有提到任何关于赌场的事情？\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n1 答：是的。\n2 问：关于赌场他是怎么说的？\n3 答：我记不太清楚他说了什么，但我记得\n4 一开始呈现的机会包括 G Bank（G银行）以及\n5 赌场投资，后来赌场投资没有\n6 成功推进，所以就取消了。\n7 SHROFF 女士：最后那部分我没听清。\n8 FINKEL 先生：没有成功推进所以取消了。\n9 问：Chen 女士，关于他是否将自己的资金投入 G Bank，\n10 Miles Guo（郭文贵）说了什么（如果有的话）？\n11 答：Miles Guo 说机构投资者有很多\n12 资金来收购 G Bank。他们已经用全部资金完成了\n13 对 G Bank 的收购。他们根本不需要我们的\n14 钱。他们的资金绰绰有余，我们的钱\n15 对他用来收购 G Bank 的机构投资者来说根本算不上什么。\n16\n17 问：你投资 G Bank 了吗？\n18 答：投资了。\n19 问：你给 G Bank 投了多少钱？\n20 答：$300,000。\n21 问：你把那 $300,000 汇给了哪个实体？\n22 答：Hamilton Opportunity Fund（汉密尔顿机遇基金）。\n23 问：Chen 女士，你听过《H Coin to the Moon》（喜币上月球）这首歌吗？\n24 答：听过。\n25 问：你在哪里听过的？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n1 答：我在 Gettr（盖特）上听过。我在 Apple Itunes（苹果Itunes）上听过。\n2 问：你在 Apple Itunes 上购买过它吗？\n3 答：买过。\n4 问：你在 Apple Itunes 上购买了多少次《H Coin to the Moon》？\n5\n6 答：大约600或700次。\n7 问：你为什么要购买这么多次？\n8 答：因为 Miles Guo 让我们把这首歌下载很多很多次，\n9 以提升在 Itunes 排行榜上的排名。\n10 问：你说的提升在 Itunes 排行榜上的排名是什么意思？\n11\n12 答：这样它就能显示在 Itunes 的榜首，所有人就都会知道\n13 《H Coin to the Moon》这首歌。\n14 问：“to the moon”（上月球/飞上天）这个词对你来说是什么意思？\n15 答：意思是价格会暴涨。\n16 问：Miles Guo 在他的视频中关于 H Coin（喜币）说了什么（如果有的话）？\n17\n18 答：Miles Guo 说 H Coin 比 Bitcoin（比特币）更好。\n19 问：什么是 Bitcoin？\n20 答：Bitcoin 是一种非常有价值的加密货币。\n21 问：Miles Guo 说 H Coin 是什么？\n22 答：一种加密货币。\n23 问：Miles Guo 是否提到过 H Coin 是基于区块链的？\n24\n25 答：是的。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n1 问：关于区块链中的 H Coin，Miles Guo 说了什么（如果有的话）？\n2\n3 答：Miles Guo 说 H Coin 拥有最先进的\n4 区块链技术。它比当前市场上任何现有的数字货币都要好。\n5\n6 问：关于 H Coin 拥有最先进区块链技术的这些陈述，\n7 对你产生了什么影响（如果有的话）？\n8 答：那影响了我购买 H Coin 的决定，那让我\n9 相信 H Coin 将会非常有价值。\n10 问：关于 H Coin 是否有黄金支持，Miles Guo 说了什么（如果有的话）？\n11\n12 答：Miles Guo 说 H Coin 有20%的黄金作为储备\n13 支撑。\n14 问：关于 H Coin 拥有20%黄金储备的这些陈述，\n15 对你考虑是否购买 H Coin 产生了什么影响？\n16\n17 答：那对我来说至关重要，那让我接受了他在宣传中所说的\n18 H Coin 比 Bitcoin 更好的观点。它将会\n19 比 Bitcoin 更有价值，因为它有黄金储备，\n20 而 Bitcoin 没有。\n21 问：据你理解，Himalaya Exchange（喜马拉雅交易所）与 Miles Guo 之间\n22 有何关联（如果有的话）？\n23 答：Miles Guo 创立了 Himalaya Exchange 并且他是所有人。\n24 问：你投资 H Coin 了吗？\n25 答：投资了。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n1 问：你购买 H Coin 大约花了多少钱？\n2\n3 答：我花了大约 $530,000 购买 H Coin。\n4 问：你为什么决定购买 H Coin？\n5 答：因为当时 Miles Guo 说 H Coin 很快就会在几周内\n6 涨到 $100。\n7 问：Chen 女士，如果事实证明 H Coin 不是由黄金支持，\n8 而是由美元支持，这会对你有影响吗？\n9\n10 答：当然有影响。\n11 问：为什么？\n12 答：因为如果它仅由美元支持而不是黄金，\n13 这意味着它不会比 Bitcoin 更好。它不会\n14 那么有价值。它就不值得我去考虑\n15 投资 H Coin 了。\n16 问：关于投资 H Coin 或 H dollar（喜美元）是否有保障，\n17 Miles Guo 有说过什么吗？\n18 答：Miles Guo 说过，对于像我这样以极高价格\n19 购买 H Coin，而后价格下跌\n20 甚至一半或一半以上的人，Miles Guo 会赔偿\n21 我们因购买 H Coin 所遭受的全部损失。\n22 问：你访问过 Himalaya Exchange 的网站吗？\n23 答：访问过。\n24 问：你在 Himalaya Exchange 网站上看到过叫作白皮书的东西吗？\n25\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n1 答：我可能看到过。\n2 问：你读过它吗？\n3 答：我读过。\n4 问：你对白皮书内容的理解是什么？\n5\n6 答：我从中获取的信息是，当前的加密货币市场\n7 存在挑战。\n8 SHROFF 女士：抱歉。能否将那个回答\n9 重读一遍。\n10 （宣读了记录）\n11 问：你所说的挑战是什么意思？\n12 答：关于数字加密货币价格的挑战、\n13 关于安全性的挑战，即当前的加密货币\n14 没那么安全、关于成本的挑战，即当前的加密货币\n15 成本高昂。所以这些就是市场上现有加密货币的\n16 挑战，而 H Coin 的创建就是为了克服所有这些挑战。它将成为最\n17 安全、经济实惠、高效的货币，代表所有加密货币的\n18 未来。\n19 问：Chen 女士，当你决定购买 H Coin 时，你认为\n20 你购买的是加密货币还是积分？\n21 答：我认为我购买的是加密货币。\n22 问：农场参与了你对 H Coin 的购买吗？\n23 答：在我于 ICO（首次代币发行），即以每枚10美分的价格进行首次代币发行\n24 购买 H Coin 时，他们参与了。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n1 问：什么是 H Coin 锁仓？\n2 答：据我的理解，H Coin 锁仓是指在 ICO 首次代币发行以每枚10美分\n3 认购的代币会被锁定一段时间，\n4 战友追随者们在此期间不得\n5 将其出售。\n6 问：请调出证据编号为 VB33 的文件。Chen 女士，\n7 你认得这个吗？\n8 答：认得。\n9 问：这是什么？\n10 答：那是我的 Himalaya Exchange 账户。\n11 问：据你理解，上面显示 130,000 HDO 和零 HCN 的原因是什么（如果有的话）？\n12\n13 答：那是我的账户余额。\n14 问：据你理解，HDO 与 HCN 之间的区别是什么（如果有的话）？\n15\n16 答：当时我的理解是 HDO 与美元是一比一对应的，\n17 而 HCN 是加密货币。\n18 问：当你向——你是如何向 Himalaya Exchange\n19 汇入资金的？\n20 答：我登录该账户，它会向你提供汇入资金的\n21 银行账户付款指引，并且它还\n22 包含一个专门给我的参考号，以便我在向该银行账户\n23 电汇时添加该参考号。\n24\n25 问：当你登录 Himalaya Exchange 汇款时，你在哪个州？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n1\n2 答：我使用了虚拟专用网络，即 VPN。\n3 SHROFF 女士：问题是她在哪个州。\n4 请求予以剔除。\n5 法庭：如果你能回答是哪个州的话。\n6 答：我住在弗吉尼亚州。\n7 问：你当时在弗吉尼亚州吗？\n8 答：是的。\n9 问：什么是 VPN？\n10 答：虚拟专用网络。\n11 问：你为什么要使用 VPN 登录 Himalaya Exchange？\n12 答：因为 Miles Guo 让我们用 VPN 登录 Himalaya\n13 Exchange。\n14 问：据你理解，Miles Guo 为什么让你们从美国境内使用 VPN\n15 登录 Himalaya Exchange？\n16 答：因为我的理解是我需要从美国以外的\n17 国家登录才能进入 Himalaya Exchange 账户。\n18 问：当你向 Himalaya Exchange 汇款时，你认为\n19 你购买的是 H dollar 还是 H Coin？\n20 答：我汇入美元，它会变成等值的 HDO，然后我\n21 使用 HDO 购买 HCN。\n22 问：可以撤下那份文件了。请调出 Z10 第2页。\n23 Chen 女士，关于 A10，Miles Guo 说了什么（如果有的话）？\n24\n25 答：Miles Guo 宣传了另一个名为 A10 的投资项目。我不\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n1 理解那是什么。Miles Guo 说它包含 Gettr 的5%\n2 以及 Himalaya Exchange 的5%。\n3 问：Loftus 女士，请往上稍微滚动一点，只要\n4 看到日期就行。\n5 当你最初得知 A10 时，你是通过什么方式\n6 最初得知 A10 的？\n7 答：抱歉。你问我什么重要吗？\n8 问：你是如何最初得知 A10 的？\n9 答：Miles Guo 在 Gettr 上广播的视频。\n10 问：在得知 A10 之后，Chen 女士，那对你产生了什么影响？\n11\n12 答：当他宣传 A10 时，我感到很困惑。\n13 问：为什么？\n14 答：因为为什么又是一个投资项目。在我看来，\n15 就是一直在要求我们给钱投资，一直在\n16 掏空我们的钱包，总是在付出、付出、投资、\n17 投资，但回报在哪里？为什么一直在给钱？\n18 什么时候才会有作为回报的资金进来？\n19 问：你投资 A10 了吗？\n20 答：没有。\n21 问：你是否曾试图从你根据 Miles Guo 的视频所做的其他\n22 投资中要回你的钱？\n23 答：是的。\n24 问：为了要回你的钱，你采取了哪些步骤？\n25 答：对于 G Bank 投资，我联系了 Hamilton Opportunity Fund 的农场主管\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n1 David Fallon。\n2 问：David Fallon 对你说了什么（如果有的话）？\n3 答：David Fallon 没有回复。他在英国的律师 James\n4 回复了我。\n5 问：James 说了什么？\n6 答：James 说。\n7 SHROFF 女士：所有这些都是传闻证据。\n8 法庭：异议驳回。你可以回答。\n9 答：抱歉。\n10 问：你可以回答，James 说了什么？\n11 答：Jim 说你的资金属于 DOJ（司法部）冻结令的一部分。\n12 问：对此你有何回应（如果有的话）？\n13 答：我的回应是，我不这么认为，因为我早在\n14 2022年1月就把钱汇过去了。而这笔资金直到\n15 2022年9月才被冻结。在我汇出资金的时间与资金被冻结的时间之间，\n16 相隔了八个月。我相信\n17 存在资金流出。在 DOJ 冻结该账户时，\n18 我汇入该账户的资金已经不在该账户中了。\n19 问：你是否曾试图从 G/Club（G俱乐部）要回你的钱？\n20 答：我联系了 G/Club 要求退款。\n21 问：G/Club 是怎么对你说的？\n22 答：G/Club 客户服务部门向我提供了一个电子邮箱地址，\n23 用于联系 G/Club 的法律事务部。\n24 问：你联系那个电子邮箱地址了吗？\n25 答：我联系了该电子邮箱地址，并填写了\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n1 要求取消 G/Club 会员资格的表格。\n2 问：G/Club 对你说了什么（如果有的话）？\n3 答：G/Club 法律团队根本没有回复我的请求。\n4 问：你是否还联系过其他人试图要回你的钱？\n5 答：我联系了 Mulan 询问关于 G Bank 投资的事。\n6 问：Mulan 对你说了什么？\n7 答：Mulan 告诉我，我的资金根据 DOJ\n8 的命令被冻结了。\n9 问：你是否曾尝试从 Himalaya Exchange 赎回并提取现金？\n10\n11 答：是的。\n12 问：后来发生了什么？\n13 答：我记得我早在2023年5月就申请了赎回，两个月后\n14 我收到通知称该请求被取消了，\n15 不再予以赎回。\n16 问：Loftus 女士，你可以把那份文件撤下了。\n17 Chen 女士，Miles Guo 在其视频中是否曾谈到\n18 被 CCP（中国共产党）针对？\n19 答：谈到过。\n20 问：关于被 CCP 针对，他会说什么（如果有的话）？\n21\n22 答：他说他是被针对的目标。\n23 问：你投资 Miles Guo 的投资项目是因为他说\n24 他被 CCP 针对了吗？\n25 答：不是。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n问：你当时为什么投资Miles Guo（郭文贵）的投资项目？\n答：因为我想赚钱。他承诺高回报且零风险。\n问：在你投资的钱当中，你拿回来了多少？\n答：我通过SEC（美国证券交易委员会）公平基金分配拿回了大约180,000美元左右。\n问：你总共投资了多少钱？\n答：我投资了将近130万美元。\n问：那么还欠你多少钱？\n答：大约110万美元。\nSHROFF女士：反对使用“欠”这个词。\n法庭：反对无效。\n问：陈女士，如果郭文贵确实被CCP（中国共产党）盯上是事实，你是否仍然想要拿回你的110万美元？\n答：是的。\n问：如果郭文贵被中共盯上是事实，这是否会改变你对是否还欠你110万美元的看法？\n答：不会，这不会改变我的看法。\n问：郭文贵被盯上——撤回问题。\n陈女士，中共可能盯上了郭文贵这一事实，如果说有任何影响的话，对你投资郭文贵项目的经历有什么影响？\n答：没有任何影响。诈骗就是诈骗。与其他任何事情都没有影响。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n任何其他事情。\n问：如果郭文贵被中共盯上是事实，这能让他对你所做的事情变得合理吗？\nSHROFF女士：反对，假定了未经证实的案件事实。\n法庭：反对无效。你可以回答。\n证人：抱歉，是我回答还是——\n法庭：是的，你来回答。\n答：你能重复一下问题吗？而且我刚才听不太清楚那位律师说话。你介意把麦克风放近一点吗？\nSHROFF女士：大多数人在听我说话方面都没问题，不过当然可以。我提出了反对，法官驳回了我的反对。\n答：好的，那我刚才分心了。你介意再重复一遍问题吗？\n问：没问题。陈女士，如果郭文贵被中共盯上是事实，这能让他对你所做的事情变得合理吗？\n答：不能，他毁了我的人生。\n问：怎么说？\n答：他欺骗了我，通过——\n法庭：好了。我现在必须打断一下。我已经告诉过旁听席上的人，我不想听到笑声。我不想听到噪音。你们必须在这个法庭里保持尊重，否则我会把你们驱逐出法庭。请继续。你刚才在回答。我打断了。你可以宣读她刚才陈述的内容。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 直接询问\n（记录被宣读）\n答：郭文贵欺骗了我，并通过不断强调和一遍又一遍地重复说他是一个非常诚实、值得信赖的人来获取我的信任。他说他从不撒谎。他通过讲述自己的故事来给我洗脑，让我相信他，让我相信他是一个非常善良、仁慈、体贴的人。他骗我，让我相信他把我当妹妹一样关心。他骗我，让我相信他愿意像对待妹妹一样与我分享他的财富。\n而且他利用了我的希望，利用了我希望能为年迈的父母和年幼的孩子提供更好生活的希望，承诺了零风险的巨额回报。他为我的家庭描绘了一个美好的未来，骗我把所有的钱，我所有辛辛苦苦赚来的钱和所有好不容易攒下的钱都交给了他，用来供他的家人、他的女儿、他的儿子过着奢华挥霍的生活。郭文贵是个骗子。他是个欺诈者。他是个无耻、无情的欺诈者和诈骗犯。\n问：你今天在法庭上看到郭文贵了吗？\nSHROFF女士：法官阁下，我认可郭先生就坐在我的左边。\n法庭：好的。\n问：那是郭文贵吗？\n答：是的。\nFINKEL先生：没有其他问题了。\n法庭：交叉询问。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n交叉询问\n由SHROFF女士进行：\n问：下午好，陈女士。\n答：下午好。\n问：你好吗？\n答：我很好。你好吗？\n问：我有点累，不过我们言归正传。\n陈女士，你能告诉陪审团的女士们先生们，谁是IvyIvy6538吗？\n答：那是我在MOS（香草山）农场的网名。\n问：让我给你看——\nFINKEL先生：法官阁下，我们可以到法官席前一步吗？\n法庭：可以。\n（续见下一页）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n（在法官席前）\nFINKEL先生：也许这不是个问题，但特别是考虑到今天旁听席上发生的事情。我当然希望Shroff女士不仅仅是要从证人那里梳理受害者的个人身份识别信息，这是不恰当的，而且只是一种骚扰她的手段。因此，我仅在法官席前提出这一点，以确保不会再涉及关于她个人身份识别信息的内容。\n法庭：我相信她不会那样做的。是这样吗，Shroff女士？\nSHROFF女士：我希望如此，法官阁下。我深切尊重法庭的裁定，我也很乐意阐明我想要做的是什么。我打算做的是展示她在该社群活跃期间所使用的账号网名。而且在我忘记之前，我只想说，旁听席上的人做什么，我们无法控制。例如，旁听席上的某些人是我们明确要求过不要出现在这里的。我们甚至试图与那些人的律师沟通，让他们不要来这里。所以把任何事情归咎于我们，真的是，我不知道这是什么意思，但我只是把话挑明。我们不是朋友。我们无法控制谁在旁听席上。\n让我回到Ivy这个名字。Ivy是她使用过的一个账号网名。我要给她看一张该账号网名的照片。我还打算给她看她丈夫账号网名的照片。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n政府知道这一点，因为政府有来自某个名叫All Well的人的电子邮件。我打算展示一个名叫Octopus的账号网名照片。我打算展示一个名叫Faithfully的人的照片。它们都是公开的账号网名。我绝不会问她是否就是XXXXX。我并不打算问她那个。我无意帮助陪审团对她产生同情。那不是我的职责。我认为所有这些都是恰当的交叉询问。如果政府不知道这些账号网名，我很抱歉，但那不是我的责任。\nFINKEL先生：首先，在我忘记之前，我们请求将涉及她名字XXXXX的回答予以封存，只注明为证人。\nSHROFF女士：没问题。你可以直接把名字从法官席前的谈话记录中删掉。不过我确实要注意到这一点，法官阁下，她的姓氏是陈。在挑选陪审团成员时，XXXXX是我们引用的名字之一。如果有人真的想把这些线索拼凑起来，并不需要顶尖的专家才能做到。\nFINKEL先生：我们没必要帮别人去这样做。我们应该保护受害者。他们依法享有获得此类保护的法定权利。\n法庭：这也是一个极其常见的名字。\nFINKEL先生：我能对Shroff女士所说的话做个回应吗？\n法庭：请讲。\nFINKEL先生：我认为梳理她在农场使用过的各种账号网名没有任何相关性，\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n关于这些农场，她现在正在作证并陈述农场里发生的事情。这应当被排除，因为这纯粹是为了骚扰证人。Shroff女士完全可以问：你是否使用过账号网名？你是否使用过不同的登录名？我估计对这些问题的回答会是肯定的。如果她想把Fay Fay的用户名摆在她面前，可以。如果她想把Octopus的名字摆在她面前，可以。并且说明这一点——我相信这是非常重要的一点——即她就像Octopus和Fay Fay一样使用了账号网名。但是使用该证人使用过的具体名字——我认为这包含在我们的3500材料中。材料中提到她对自己的账号网名被发现感到紧张。事实上——\nSHROFF女士：根本没有这回事。\nFINKEL先生：请不要打断我。法官阁下可能记得，在其中一份银行记录中提到了MOS，并且有一行被隐去了。被隐去的那一行是她的MOS，即她的Mountain of Spices（香草山）ID号码，因为她不希望香草山的人去针对她，就像他们针对Luc Despins（卢克·德斯平斯）以及他的女儿和女婿那样。因此我反对使用这些用户名以及针对具体细节的提问，因为这纯粹是为了骚扰这位受害者。\nSHROFF女士：根本不是这样。\n法庭：让我弄明白一件事，你是说所有这些用户名都与她有关联吗？\nFINKEL先生：我不知道，但显然Shroff女士\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n认为这两个用户名与她有关。根据Shroff女士刚才向法官阁下所陈述的，她试图引出的并不是这种关联，而是她使用了用户名而不是她的真实姓名这一点。因此，说明这一点是可以的，而且可以用一种概括性的方式来提出，并对陪审团产生与使用具体名称相同的显著效果。\n法庭：你怎么知道这些假名会让公众识别出她的身份呢？\nFINKEL先生：因为社群就是这样认识她的，就像社群认识木兰就是Ya Li（李亚）一样。社群就是通过这个身份认识她的。我知道这是她的身份，因为Shroff女士问了这个问题，而她回答了是的。而且我推测接下来还会有大量此类问题。这是政府方的反对。如果我们被驳回，那就是被驳回了。那没问题。但这是我们觉得有必要提出的一个要点。\nSHROFF女士：我可以澄清一下吗？\n法庭：可以。\nSHROFF女士：所以该账号网名是与她作证所使用的姓名相关联的。她是使用她自己的姓名在作证，对吧？\nFINKEL先生：是的。\nSHROFF女士：这就是与之关联的地方。她以该网名与人们互动。她以该网名发送短信。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n她用该网名发送电子邮件。她用该网名填写她的志愿者服务时间。她用该网名与H Coin（喜币）的人交谈，而且我打算非常正当地与该证人一起逐一过一遍这些证据。我绝不会说这个人与XXXXX有关联，这也是法庭禁止我做的事情。\n法庭：有什么证据将这些名字中的任何一个与XXXXX联系起来吗？\nFINKEL先生：法官阁下，我不确定。这是坦率的回答。我所知道的是社群使用这些账号网名来识别人员，他们就是通过这种方式找到人的。整套运作就是这样的。这个组织的架构就是这样的。每个人都以Fay Fay、Feather、Octopus或Saturn之类的名字为人所知。如果Shroff女士想向她出示具体的陈述内容，可以。但逐一梳理每一个ID，我们表示反对，因为我们认为这属于骚扰。\n法庭：你认为她有多少个ID？\nSHROFF女士：我认为她除了Ivy Ivy和那个数字之外没有其他ID了。那是她的ID。那就是她与每个人沟通的方式，而且它并没有通过姓名XXXXX建立关联。我有证据向她展示带有该ID的内容，而且我有证据向她展示带有该账号网名的内容。那就是她的账号网名。她还使用了多个Gmail账户，对吧。因此政府基本上隐去了整个账户。我们请求至少澄清——让文件澄清——她被抄送在了\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 电子邮件。他们拒绝了，所以我不在乎她实际的电子邮件\n2 显示什么。某些证据，证据的真实性在于，她拿到了该文件的一份副本。\n3 法庭：那么据我的理解，你的意思是\n4 你想问她是否使用某个特定网名，\n5 就一个网名？\n6 什罗夫女士（MS. SHROFF）：是的，就一个网名。\n7 法庭：你还想问她是否真的\n8 与其他网名有关联？\n9 什罗夫女士：不，是她与其他网名的互动情况。\n10 法庭：我认为这是可以接受的。\n11 （接下一页）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区速记员有限责任公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 （在公开法庭上）\n2 法庭：请继续。\n3 由什罗夫女士提问：\n4 问：我刚才在向你询问关于 IvyIvy 6538 的情况，对吗？\n5 答：是的。\n6 问：女士，那是你使用的网名吗？\n7 答：那只是我用来进行 MOS 农场（MOS farm）\n8 注册的一个昵称。\n9 问：那你向政府方提及过你使用的那个 MOS 农场\n10 注册信息吗？\n11 答：没有。\n12 问：请调出该文件，仅供政府方和证人查看。\n13 你能认出辩方物证 7010（Defense Exhibit 7010）吗？\n14 答：那是我的 Discord 注册信息。\n15 什罗夫女士：法官阁下，辩方请求将 DX-7010\n16 采纳为证据。\n17 芬克尔先生（MR. FINKEL）：基于边庭会议阐述的理由，我反对。\n18 法庭：准予采纳。\n19 （被告物证 7010 已被采纳为证据）\n20 什罗夫女士：请求向陪审团出示。\n21 问：All Well 5921 是谁？\n22 答：那是我丈夫的 Discord 注册账号。\n23 问：让我向你出示 DX7011。你能认出那份\n24 文件吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 答：能。\n2 问：那是 DX7008 吗？\n3 答：是的。\n4 问：你认出它是什么？\n5 答：那是我丈夫的 Discord 注册账号，因为人们\n6 在任何社交媒体平台上注册时都会使用\n7 昵称。\n8 什罗夫女士：我们请求将 DX-7008 采纳为证据。\n9 芬克尔先生：法官阁下，我们可以到法台前来吗？\n10 法庭：好的。\n11 （接下一页）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 （在边庭会议中）\n2 芬克尔先生：法官阁下，很抱歉在此赘述，\n3 但这与什罗夫女士刚才向阁下说明的情况不符。\n4 什罗夫女士：那就是那两个网名。\n5 芬克尔先生：什罗夫女士正在人肉搜索（doxing）这名证人。该\n6 组织在这个机构中的做法就是在网络上、在 Twitter 上、\n7 在 Discord 以及其他社交媒体渠道上攻击他人。\n8 她将该网名作为证据提交，纯粹是为了大做文章，\n9 让法庭上的所有人和其他所有人都知道如何\n10 去对付她和她的丈夫。这完全是\n11 不恰当的。这与什罗夫女士片刻之前\n12 在边庭会议上阐明的理由毫无关系。\n13 这纯粹是骚扰和人肉搜索。\n14 法庭：芬克尔先生，如果我不允许她当庭质证\n15 这名证人，而你们获得了定罪，判决是会被\n16 推翻的。她必须能够质证该证人。她\n17 是自愿来到这里的。她已经陈述了自己的姓名。你可以\n18 继续。\n19 （接下一页）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 （在公开法庭上）\n2 什罗夫女士：我们请求将 7008 采纳为证据。\n3 法庭：准予采纳。\n4 （被告物证 7008 已被采纳为证据）\n5 由什罗夫女士提问：\n6 问：我们可以向陪审团出示吗。\n7 陈女士（Ms. Chen），你认识一个名叫 Octopus（八爪鱼）的人吗？\n8 答：认识。\n9 问：她是谁？\n10 答：她是 MOS 农场现任农场主。\n11 问：让我向你出示标为辩方物证 7011 的文件。\n12 你能认出那份文件吗？\n13 答：能。\n14 问：那是什么？\n15 答：那是 Octopus 的 Discord 信息。\n16 什罗夫女士：我们请求将 7011 采纳为证据。\n17 芬克尔先生：无异议。\n18 法庭：准予采纳。\n19 （被告物证 7011 已被采纳为证据）\n20 由什罗夫女士提问：\n21 问：你能告诉陪审团成员 Faith Night（信念之夜）是谁吗？\n22 答：Faith Night 在 MOS 农场工作。\n23 问：让我向你出示标为 DX7009 的文件。你能\n24 认出那份文件吗？\n25 答：能。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 问：那是 Faith Night 女士的网名吗？\n2 答：是的，Discord 注册信息。\n3 什罗夫女士：我们请求将 DX7009 采纳为证据\n4 并向陪审团出示。\n5 芬克尔先生：无异议。\n6 法庭：准予采纳。\n7 （被告物证 7009 已被采纳为证据）\n8 由什罗夫女士提问：\n9 问：你能告诉我 Fay Fay 是谁吗？\n10 答：Fay Fay 也是该运动的一员。\n11 问：那 Little Sarah（小萨拉）呢？\n12 答：也是一样，也是该运动的一员。\n13 问：陈女士，你与 Octopus 互动过吗？\n14 答：你说的互动，是指我和她沟通过吗？\n15 问：你在 Discord 上和她说过话吗？\n16 答：是的，我在 Discord 上和她说过话。\n17 问：那 Faith Night 呢？\n18 答：是的，我在 Discord 上和她说过话。\n19 问：我们稍后会回到这个问题上，不过你曾和她们在同一个\n20 群组里，对吗？\n21 答：我之前解释过我当时在做志愿者工作。\n22 问：我们也会回到那个问题上，但这三个人\n23 当时和你同在一个群组里，对吧？\n24 答：在志愿者工作中，有某些方面我会\n25 就我的志愿者工作与他们进行沟通。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 问：我们稍后会回到那个问题。我们先花点时间谈谈\n2 你的背景。\n3 你在主问时作证说你来到了美国，\n4 是在 2007 年吗？\n5 答：是的。\n6 问：你在来之前在中国是一名学生，对吗？\n7 答：是的。\n8 问：你曾就读于上海对外贸易学院（Shanghai Institute of Foreign Trade），\n9 对吗？\n10 答：是的。\n11 问：你学的是国际商务专业，对吗？\n12 答：不对。\n13 问：好吧，请告诉我你学的是什么专业？\n14 答：我学的是英语。\n15 问：那你在那之后学习并接受了商务教育吗？\n16 答：所以你说的我学习并接受了商务教育，\n17 是指我来到美国接受商务教育，还是你能否\n18 澄清一下？\n19 问：当然。你在中国做学生期间学过任何\n20 商务课程吗？\n21 答：我学的是英语，属于商务英语。\n22 问：你在中国期间也学过会计吗？\n23 答：没有，我没学过。\n24 问：然后你在 2006 年从上海对外贸易学院\n25 毕业，对吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 答：是的。\n2 问：你是以优异成绩毕业的，对吗？\n3 答：是的。\n4 问：毕业后你在中国工作了一年，\n5 对吧？\n6 答：是的。\n7 问：你曾担任内部审计分析师；是这样吗？\n8 答：不，那不对。\n9 问：请你告诉我你以什么职位工作？\n10 答：我做的是助理。\n11 问：协助什么？\n12 答：协助当时的部门经理。\n13 问：那是在上海亨斯迈聚氨酯公司（Huntsman Polyurethanes）吗？\n14 答：是的。\n15 问：你在那里一直待到 2007 年 7 月，对吗？\n16 答：是的。\n17 问：你在亨斯迈负责什么工作？\n18 答：我做的是一些助理类型的工作。\n19 问：其中包括会计吗？\n20 答：不包括。\n21 问：你在 2007 年来到了美国，对吧？\n22 答：是的。\n23 问：你曾就读于路易斯安那州立大学（Louisiana State University）；是这样吗？\n24 答：是的。\n25 问：你来这里读研究生，对吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 答：是的。\n2 问：陈女士，你是全额奖学金学生吗？\n3 芬克尔先生：就关联性提出反对。\n4 法庭：你可以回答。\n5 答：是的。\n6 问：你是 LSU（路易斯安那州立大学）工商管理硕士（MBA）项目的学生，对吗？\n7 答：是的。\n8 问：你毕业并获得了工商管理硕士学位，\n9 对吗？\n10 答：是的。\n11 问：你在读期间以及攻读 MBA 时的\n12 专业方向是内部审计，对吗？\n13 答：对的。\n14 问：你的丈夫拥有计算机科学博士学位，对吗？\n15 答：是的。\n16 问：他拥有来自美国一所大学的博士学位，\n17 对吗？\n18 答：对的。\n19 问：你目前在职受雇，对吗？\n20 答：是的。\n21 问：你在一家银行工作，对吗？\n22 答：是的。\n23 问：在 LSU 毕业之后、开始在这家银行工作之前，\n24 你在德勤（Deloitte）工作过，对吗？\n25 答：是的。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 问：德勤是什么？\n2 答：它是四大（Big Four）会计师事务所之一。\n3 问：你为他们做什么工作？\n4 答：我做咨询工作。\n5 问：作为咨询顾问，你做过风险评估吗？\n6 答：我就流程改进和风险\n7 管理相关工作提供咨询。\n8 问：我们来细分一下。你在德勤有确保\n9 合规方面的经验吗？\n10 答：没有。\n11 问：你在德勤工作时，在评估风险方面具有\n12 专业知识吗？\n13 芬克尔先生：超出范围、关联性、重复累赘。\n14 法庭：反对无效。你可以回答。\n15 答：你能重复一下那个问题吗。\n16 问：你在德勤工作期间，而且你在那里一直待到 2011 年，\n17 对吗？\n18 答：是的。\n19 问：评估风险是你的工作职责之一吗？\n20 答：是帮助客户管理风险。\n21 问：当你谈到帮助客户管理风险时，你的意思\n22 具体是什么？\n23 向陪审团描述一下你的工作？\n24 答：我所服务的客户可能会面临各种不同的\n25 风险，所以我的工作是帮助他们识别这些\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 风险是什么，并能够确定管理这些风险的优先级。\n2 问：这些都是投资风险，对吗？\n3 答：当然不是。\n4 问：好吧，那你告诉我你帮他们评估的是什么风险？\n5 答：我的客户是一家石油天然气公司。\n6 问：抱歉？\n7 答：我的客户属于石油天然气行业，因此存在\n8 潜在的运营风险，这正是我帮助他们\n9 进行评估的地方。\n10 问：你帮他们评估财务风险以及——\n11 答：运营风险。\n12 问：运营风险。在那之后你担任了高级\n13 审计师，对吗？\n14 答：是的。\n15 问：你曾担任高级审计师——你能概括性地向\n16 陪审团讲讲高级审计师通常做什么吗？\n17 答：审计师会进驻企业，询问\n18 流程及其运作方式，以准确定位潜在风险；\n19 然后从中识别控制措施，进而制定审计\n20 计划来对业务流程进行审计。\n21 问：而编写出那一流程正是你的工作职责之一，\n22 对吗？\n23 答：是的。\n24 问：然后你作证说你现在在一家银行工作，对吧？\n25 答：是的。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 盘问\n1 问：你在那家银行的职务头衔是什么？\n2 答：我是经理。\n3 问：什么经理？\n4 答：风险经理。\n5 问：合规风险经理，对吗？\n6 答：是的。\n7 问：所以你的确切头衔是合规\n8 风险经理，对吧？\n9 答：是的。\n10 问：你管理多少人？\n11 答：我管理五个人。\n12 问：你的工作包括进行年度合规\n13 风险评估，对吗？\n14 答：是的。\n15 问：进行年度合规风险评估\n16 是有一套流程的，不是吗？\n17 答：是的。\n18 问：要做好你从事的这项工作，你必须注重\n19 细节，对吗？\n20 芬克尔先生：反对，法庭已经就\n21 该问题作出了裁决。\n22 法庭：什罗夫女士，请你注意我的\n23 裁决。\n24 什罗夫女士：我只是在询问她的流程是什么。\n25 问：进行你的评估，无论你在哪里进行，并且\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 请不要告诉我具体在哪里，你必须评估操作\n2 风险，对吗？\n3 芬克尔律师（MR. FINKEL）：反对，重复发问（asked and answered）。\n4\n5 法官（THE COURT）：已经问过并回答过了。\n6 问：而且你必须识别责任方，对吗？\n7 芬克尔律师：反对，请依法庭裁定。\n8 法官：我准许这个问题。请继续。\n9 答：你说识别责任方，你能澄清一下\n10 你是在问我什么吗？\n11 问：哪些主体在承担该风险？\n12 答：那不一定是我的工作。那不是我的工作。\n13 问：好的。审查相关政策是你的工作吗？\n14 答：不，那不是我的工作。\n15 问：建立适当的规程呢？\n16 答：那不是我的工作。\n17 问：考量审计呢？\n18 答：那不是我的工作。\n19 问：评估报告呢？\n20 答：那不是我的工作。\n21 问：你是否愿意告诉陪审团，你是如何确保\n22 合规管控措施落实到位的？\n23 芬克尔律师：反对，相关性，请依法庭裁定。\n24 法官：我准许回答。请回答。\n25 答：我们所做的评估更多是自上而下的风险评估，\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法院速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 来自企业层面，旨在识别外部存在哪些首要\n2 风险，因此它不涉及你刚才\n3 提到的那些流程。\n4 问：那么，你能告诉我涉及哪些流程吗？\n5 答：我已经解释过了。这是自上而下的风险评估。\n6 问：你评估的风险是什么？\n7 芬克尔律师：反对，相关性。\n8 法官：你可以回答。\n9 答：评估来自消费者保护局的消费者合规风险，\n10 以保护客户\n11 免于可能在银行操作中受到欺骗。\n12 问：谢谢你。制定行动方案也是你的工作内容之一吗？\n13\n14 答：不。\n15 问：就如何改善合规提出建议呢？\n16\n17 答：不。\n18 问：陈女士（Ms. Chen），你从事这项工作多久了？\n19 答：大约14或15年。\n20 问：你在主询问中作证说，对吧，你第一次听说\n21 Miles Guo（郭文贵）是在2017年，对吗？\n22 答：是的。\n23 问：而且在你听说郭文贵之前，你作证说你丈夫\n24 当时在看郭文贵的视频；是这样\n25 吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 答：是的。\n2 问：当你丈夫在看郭文贵的视频时，他有没有告诉你\n3 他的视频中吸引你丈夫的是什么？\n4\n5 芬克尔律师：反对，传闻证据（hearsay）。\n6 施罗夫律师（MS. SHROFF）：我提出该证据不是为了证明其真实性。\n7 法官：你可以回答。\n8 答：讲的是把美国价值观带到中国。\n9 问：不好意思，请再说一遍。\n10 答：讲的是把美国价值观带到中国。\n11 问：在2017年，郭文贵先生是在讲把美国\n12 价值观带到中国吗？\n13 答：我丈夫是这么跟我说的。\n14 问：你知道2017年郭先生是否在讲来自\n15 中共（CCP）的虚假信息吗？\n16 芬克尔律师：反对。\n17 法官：你可以回答。\n18 答：我当时没有看。我不知道。\n19 问：当你刚开始听郭先生的视频时，你还记得\n20 他讲过中国的腐败吗？\n21 答：记得。\n22 问：你听过他讲中国缺乏\n23 自由吗？\n24 答：我不记得了。\n25 问：你记得他是否讲过中国缺乏财产\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 权利？\n2 答：我不记得了。\n3 问：你记得他是否讲过中国缺乏选择的权利？\n4\n5 答：我不记得了。\n6 问：你还记得他的视频是否讲过一个人在\n7 中国无法自主选择自己的工作？\n8 芬克尔律师：同上反对理由。\n9 法官：反对无效（Overruled）。你可以回答。\n10 答：我不记得了。\n11 问：陈女士，你在哪一年开始听郭文贵\n12 的视频？\n13 答：2018年底。\n14 问：我不会跟你逐一过一遍整个清单，\n15 但我之前提到的那些话题，有任何一个是你\n16 在2018年能记起来的话题吗？\n17 答：时间太久了，我不记得了。\n18 问：你曾记得郭先生谈论过香港的\n19 局势吗？\n20 答：我想是的。\n21 问：你记得他关于香港说了什么吗？\n22 答：我不记得了。\n23 问：今天坐在这里，陈女士，你是否认同\n24 无论在2017年还是在2024年，发表反对中共的言论都是有风险的？\n25 答：你是在问我的意见吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 问：是的，女士。\n2 答：问是否有风险？\n3 问：是的，女士。\n4 答：我不知道。\n5 问：当你在Discord上互动时——算了，\n6 我撤回这个问题。\n7 你在某个时间点决定加入所谓的\n8 爆料革命（whistleblower movement），对吗？\n9 答：我在2022年加入了农场。\n10 问：在你2022年加入农场之前，你的理解是\n11 你根本没有加入任何运动？\n12 答：那我问——你能用简单的方式澄清一下那个问题吗？\n13 问：我这样问吧。你迈向爆料革命的第一步\n14 是什么？\n15 答：我迈向爆料——我跟爆料革命没有任何\n16 关系。\n17 问：你与法治基金（Rule of Law Foundation）的宗旨\n18 有任何关系吗？\n19 答：我捐了款。\n20 问：我问的是法治基金的宗旨，\n21 你熟悉吗？\n22 答：我的理解是帮助需要帮助的人。\n23 问：基于这种理解，你知道法治基金是否\n24 帮助把人从中国带到美国吗？\n25 答：那我就不知道了。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 问：你知道他们是否在乌克兰战争中帮助了民众？\n2 答：我的理解是这样，所以我为了那份救助捐了款。\n3 问：向民众提供新冠口罩和其他口罩呢？\n4\n5 答：那部分我不确定。\n6 问：那么，你向法治基金捐了款，对吗？\n7 答：是的。\n8 问：你捐了多少？\n9 答：大约$30,000。\n10 问：你记得是在哪一年捐的吗？\n11 答：在2020年到2022年之间。\n12 问：那么，我们来谈谈这个。在2020年，按你的说法你捐了\n13 多少？\n14 答：我丈夫捐了几百美元。\n15 问：准确地说是400，对吧？\n16 答：我说了几百。我不确切记得他到底\n17 捐了多少。\n18 问：2020年你捐了多少？\n19 答：当时是共同捐赠。\n20 问：2021年呢？\n21 答：我不记得了，可能也是几百美元。\n22 问：2022年呢？\n23 答：大约$30,000。\n24 问：你是在2022年9月捐的那笔钱，对吗？\n25 答：没错。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 问：在你做出那笔捐赠之前，你了解过\n2 谁是法治基金董事会成员，\n3 对吗？\n4 答：不，我不知道谁在法治基金的董事会\n5 上。\n6 问：所以你没有查看法治基金的网站？\n7 答：我只是打开了网站，我不知道去哪里找\n8 董事会成员名单，而且我认为在那个时候\n9 那对我来说并不重要。\n10 问：谁是该基金会的一员对你来说并不重要？\n11 答：你特别指的是董事会，对吧？\n12 问：是的。\n13 答：在那个时候？\n14 问：董事会成员并不重要？\n15 答：你说在那个时候，你指的是什么时间？\n16 你能澄清一下吗？\n17 问：当你在2022年9月做出那笔$30,000的捐赠时。\n18 答：我在2022年9月做那笔投资时，我没有查看\n19 谁是董事会成员。\n20 问：那么，如果我们允许的话转换一下话题，我们来谈谈\n21 你在此处主询问作证时提到的GTV投资。\n22 好吗。\n23 答：好的。\n24 问：那么，是你的丈夫首先决定投资GTV\n25 的，还是你？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 答：这是一个共同的决定。\n2 问：从一开始就是一个共同的决定吗？\n3 答：是的。\n4 问：可以公平地说，你是在2020年4月听说\n5 GTV的私募发行的吗？\n6 答：是的。\n7 问：也可以公平地说，你和你丈夫\n8 参与了投资的全过程吗？\n9 答：是的。\n10 问：在评估投资GTV时，你当时明白\n11 该私募发行原定于2020年6月2日\n12 截止，对吗？\n13 答：你说评估去投资，意思是说我在\n14 进行评估吗？你能澄清一下那个问题吗？\n15 问：你告诉我你是否评估了。\n16 答：我们信任郭文贵，所以我们投资了。\n17 问：所以除了对郭文贵的信任之外，你没有评估任何其他东西，\n18 这是你的证词吗？\n19 答：我们相信了郭文贵所说的GTV未来的\n20 景象，我们阅读了文件，并证实了郭文贵\n21 所说的其竞争对手是谁以及他们将要把\n22 这笔钱用于何处。\n23 问：请说完你的回答。抱歉。\n24 答：我不确定你在问什么，所以我刚才在\n25 努力确保我理解了你在那里问的内容。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 问：让我再试一次。你第一次听说GTV是在你投资的一个多月\n2 以前，对吗？\n3 答：是的。\n4 问：而且你对芬克尔律师说了那一点，对吧，在从你听说\n5 GTV到你实际投资GTV之间，你有\n6 一整月的时间与你丈夫讨论此事，\n7 对吗？\n8 答：我没那么说。我认为实际情况是，被批准成为\n9 GTV投资者需要经过一个流程，因此你必须满足某些\n10 标准才能获取付款信息，\n11 因为这被认为是特许的。郭先生说\n12 你必须满足某些要求才能被允许进行这项\n13 投资，而那一要求的验证花了大约\n14 那么长的时间才完成验证并获得批准。\n15 问：所以从申请开始到你获得批准花了一整月的时间，\n16 对吗？\n17 答：为了让我们获取银行账户信息。\n18 问：所以花了一个月，对吧？\n19 答：那是很久以前的事了。如果你说是一个月，那就是大约\n20 一个月。\n21 问：让我们看看能不能帮帮你。让我给你出示\n22 编号为3602-30文件的第2页，只给出示给那边的陈女士。请\n23 仅供证人查看。好的。\n24 芬克尔律师：存在记忆缺失吗？\n25 施罗夫律师：她就是这么说的。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 问：该文件是否唤起了你关于过去大约一个月的\n2 记忆——算了，我先让你阅读\n3 该文件，然后再提我的问题。\n4 答：这是——\n5 问：唯一的问题，女士，就是该文件是否唤起了\n6 你的记忆？\n7 法官：关于时间段吗？\n8 施罗夫律师：关于时间点，法官阁下（your Honor）。\n9 法官：不要读出文件内容，只要说这是否\n10 有助于你想起来。\n11 答：你是说关于那个月，你问我的是这个吗，关于\n12 那个月？\n13 就像我解释的那样，从你听说\n14 投资项目（ATO）到你能够获取银行账户、汇出\n15 款项之间有一个过程，所以那大约是一个月。\n16 问：而在那一个月里，你在等待信息发送给你，\n17 对吗？\n18 答：是的。\n19 问：GTV没有任何人连环催促你说我们已经给你发了\n20 文件、赶快回复我们，对吧？\n21 答：关于这项投资有一个截止日期。\n22 问：我的问题不是是否存在截止日期。我的\n23 问题是GTV是否有人联系你说\n24 你的申请在哪里？\n25 答：你是在问我——\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 问：请听清楚我的问题。\n2 GTV investments（GTV投资公司）有人问过你的\n3 申请表在哪里吗？在你等待的那一个月里，GTV\n4 有联系过你吗？\n5 芬克尔先生（MR. FINKEL）：我对其提问形式提出异议。什么叫来自\n6 GTV investments 的人？这是什么意思？\n7 法庭（THE COURT）：异议驳回。你可以回答。\n8 答：对不起。我还是不太明白。您是问\n9 GTV investment（GTV投资）有没有人就我的申请表\n10 联系我，还是——\n11 问：是的。\n12 答：是的，有人就申请表联系了我。\n13 问：那些都是些什么人？\n14 答：当时直播里说是联系——\n15 问：不。不。GTV investment 的哪些人？\n16 芬克尔先生：什罗夫女士（Ms. Shroff）不应当打断\n17 证人。\n18 法庭：让她回答。\n19 问：你明白我的问题吗，陈女士（Ms. Chen）？\n20 答：抱歉，我认为关于这个问题，是有没有\n21 GTV investment 的人联系我？\n22 问：这家公司。\n23 答：公司联系我？\n24 问：是的。\n25 答：当时是 Miles Guo（郭文贵）联系了我们。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 问：郭文贵从来没有联系过你，对吗？\n2 答：郭文贵联系了我丈夫。\n3 问：你不知道郭文贵是否联系了你丈夫，\n4 对吗？你当时并没有参与那次联系，对吧？\n5 答：我丈夫——\n6 问：你只知道——\n7 法庭：你必须允许她回答。你\n8 不能压着她的声音说话。让她回答。请继续。\n9 答：我丈夫当时在 Whatsapp 上直接和郭文贵聊天，\n10 我就在他身旁，听到了郭文贵\n11 从 Whatsapp 消息里发来的语音留言。\n12 问：好的。那么就是说，你在听到郭先生发来语音留言时\n13 是在场的，对吗？\n14 答：是的。\n15 问：而且不管他的语音留言如何，你当时仍然足足等了\n16 30天，才拿到一个可以汇入\n17 资金的账号，对吗？\n18 答：那不对。\n19 问：好的。从你第一次听到他的声音，\n20 到有人实际把银行账号发给你，\n21 这中间你等了多久？等了多长时间？\n22 答：是这样，已经过去很久了，我想说我们起初\n23 并没有直接联系上郭文贵。所以当我提到整整一个月时，\n24 是一开始先向 Sara Wei（魏丽红/萨拉）提交申请，告诉她\n25 我们有投资意向，并且金额在100,000以上。而且\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 我们等了一阵子才收到回复，然后萨拉告诉我们通过了\n2 资格审核，接着我们拿到了郭文贵的\n3 联系方式，所以关于你刚才问的那一个月，\n4 中间确实过去了一段时间。\n5 因此，等到我们收到郭文贵的联系方式并且他\n6 把进行 GTV 投资的信息发给我们时，我们很快就\n7 汇款进行了 GTV 投资。我想在我们收到电汇指引\n8 信息后，只用了几天时间。\n9\n10 问：那我们来拆解一下。你联系了魏丽红，对吗？\n11 答：因为郭文贵在视频里说联系魏丽红\n12 获取完成 GTV 投资的信息。\n13 问：郭文贵告诉你的，我们之前听过了。我明白。\n14 我的问题是，你联系了魏丽红。是你\n15 联系的她，还是你丈夫联系的她？\n16 答：我丈夫联系的她。\n17 问：你丈夫等了多久才收到魏丽红的\n18 回复？\n19 答：有一段时间了。我想说有几个星期，\n20 如果我没记错的话，大概两到三个星期，但确实\n21 过了一段时间，大概是他第一次联系到获得\n22 批准之间。\n23 问：在你们等待的那几个星期里，你是否\n24 记得你丈夫告诉过你，他曾试图自己去联系\n25 郭先生？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 答：他没有联系郭文贵的方式。\n2 问：所以你丈夫没有告诉过你那件事；是这样吗？\n3 答：他告诉过我——你说他没告诉过我那件事是什么意思？\n4 你的问题到底是什么？你是在问我——你能\n5 把问题再重复一遍吗？\n6 问：当然。在你们等待魏丽红\n7 回复期间，对吧，你丈夫有没有告诉过你\n8 他等不及了，正试图联系郭先生？\n9 答：他没有对我说过这个。\n10 问：那么，当你在评估 GTV 是什么时，你做过\n11 任何调研吗？\n12 芬克尔先生：依据法庭的裁定提出异议。\n13\n14 法庭：你可以询问她是否做过任何\n15 调研。你可以回答。\n16 答：当您说调研时，噢，我听了他的直播\n17 视频，然后我听了他关于 GTV 的类似蓝图规划，\n18 然后就只有这些了。\n19 问：Kyle Bass（凯尔·巴斯）是 GTV 董事会成员，这对你来说重要吗？\n20\n21 答：有一些影响。\n22 问：而且你知道凯尔·巴斯是谁，对吧？\n23 答：具体细节我不是很清楚，但我知道他是一位\n24 投资人。\n25 问：你知道他是一位投资人？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 答：我知道他是一位成功的机构投资者、私募\n2 股权人士。他在投资方面很成功。\n3 问：你在直接询问中作证说，你在2020年5月11日\n4 开始了 GTV 投资流程，对吧？\n5 答：当您说我开始了一个流程时，您能否澄清一下\n6 当您说——\n7 问：联系魏丽红，那是在5月11日吗？\n8 答：我不记得那个日期了。\n9 问：你不记得那个日期了？\n10 芬克尔先生：该问题已问过并已回答。\n11 法庭：她已经问了这个问题。\n12 什罗夫女士：有时候我只是听不清，所以我\n13 重复了一下回答。\n14 法庭：那么请对着麦克风说话。\n15 问：在2020年5月12日，你收到了私募\n16 备忘录，对吧？\n17 答：我不记得日期了。\n18 问：是你收到了 GTV 第一份私募备忘录，\n19 还是你丈夫收到的？\n20 答：郭文贵发送了那份文件的链接，我们打开链接\n21 一起查看的。\n22 问：除了 PPM（私募备忘录）之外，你们还收到了\n23 保密协议，对吗？\n24 答：我们按照提供的指引操作，提交了所需的\n25 任何文件。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 问：我是在问你，你是否记得收到了\n2 保密协议？\n3 答：我想是的。\n4 问：你是否记得收到了认购协议？\n5 答：我想是的。\n6 问：你是否记得收到了股东协议？\n7 答：可能吧。我不确切记得具体是什么了。\n8 问：你是否记得随同这些文件收到过一份附注，\n9 上面写着：收到本协议的老朋友和潜在投资者，\n10 请仔细阅读？\n11 答：我不记得那个了。\n12 问：你是否记得曾被告知本次私募将于\n13 2020年5月26日纽约时间上午11点截止？\n14 答：我不记得具体日期了。\n15 问：让我问你一件事，当你丈夫在与郭先生回复\n16 或通信时，你说你就在现场，\n17 对吗？\n18 答：是的。\n19 问：那你是否记得你丈夫告诉郭先生，他会去\n20 仔细审查协议并一丝不苟地遵守其中规定的\n21 所有要求，你记得你丈夫说过这话吗？\n22\n23 芬克尔先生：反对，传闻证据且依据法庭的\n24 裁定。\n25 法庭：异议驳回。你可以回答。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 答：我不记得那个了。\n2 问：你是否记得在那之后，你丈夫确认过他\n3 已经阅读了 GTV 私募的条件？\n4 答：我不记得那个了。\n5 问：你在直接询问中就何为合格投资者\n6 作过证，对吗？\n7 答：是的。\n8 问：关于成为合格投资者，你告诉我你的\n9 理解是什么？\n10 答：共同收入在$300,000以上，除主要自住房外\n11 净资产超过一百万美元。\n12 问：你们符合这个条件，对吧？\n13 答：是的。\n14 问：你是否记得在注明自己是合格投资者后，\n15 你们是何时首次转账的？\n16 答：是的，我是合格投资者。\n17 问：今天坐在证人席上，你是否记得该投资是\n18 以你的名义、你丈夫的名义、还是以你们双方共同的名义进行的？\n19 答：我们发了几笔电汇。有些是以我的名义。有些\n20 是以他的名义，还有一些是以我们共同的\n21 名义。\n22 问：还有，陈女士，耽误片刻问一下，\n23 你在直接询问中作证过，对吧，你——嗯，让我问你\n24 这个。在你投资 GTV 之前，你买过股票，\n25 对吗？\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 答：不，我没有买过。\n2 问：你的证词是——不是股份，是股票？\n3 芬克尔先生：已问过并已回答。\n4 法庭：异议成立。\n5 问：你是否曾有过亏损的投资，\n6 你记得吗？\n7 答：我不记得了。\n8 问：好吧，让我给你看一下第3530号文件第3页。看看阅读\n9 该文件是否能唤起你的回忆。\n10 答：我不记得，所以。\n11 问：所以你不记得投资过股票或亏过钱？\n12 芬克尔先生：已问过并已回答。她不\n13 记得。\n14 法庭：异议成立。\n15 问：可以把那个拿下来了。你的理解是 GTV\n16 是对一家初创公司的投资吗？\n17 答：我对郭文贵推广的 GTV 的理解是\n18 私募。\n19 问：什么的私募？\n20 答：就是你可以在它进入公开市场之前购买股票。\n21 问：但为了什么？\n22 答：为了让它走——\n23 问：针对一家初创公司，对吧？\n24 芬克尔先生：反对。她还没回答完。\n25 法庭：异议成立。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 问：请继续，说完。\n2 答：为了让它上涨10倍或100倍，那是郭文贵\n3 当时宣传的，我当时也相信了。\n4 问：他宣传了私募，而你相信了；你是\n5 这么说的吗？\n6 答：他宣传了一个可以上涨到10倍\n7 100倍的私募，我相信了他所说的话。\n8 问：你之前说过那个了。我的问题是你是否知道\n9 他所谈论的是否是一家初创公司？\n10 芬克尔先生：已问过并已回答。\n11 法庭：你已经问过关于初创公司的\n12 问题了。\n13 问：让我向你出示那边的芬克尔先生在直接询问中向你出示过的东西，\n14 即私募文件本身。你认得 GXVK-5 吗？\n15 答：认得。\n16 问：这就是私募备忘录，对吗？\n17 答：是的。\n18 问：我只是想确认一下。我是在问你读过它吗？\n19\n20 答：读过。\n21 问：你逐页读过，对吗？\n22 答：我读过这份文件。\n23 问：完整地读过？\n24 芬克尔先生：已问过并已回答。\n25 法庭：异议成立。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 交叉询问\n1 问：我们来看一下这份文件。翻到第9页。如果\n2 可以的话，先向她展示整页内容。你看到那\n3 一页了吗？\n4 答：看到了。\n5 问：你看到最底下的那个段落了吗？\n6 答：看到了。\n7 问：它告诉你了下一页将要涉及的\n8 内容，对吧？\n9 答：是的。\n10 问：对于关于2亿股新股的内容，\n11 你的理解是什么？\n12 答：我的理解是它之前由 Saraca Media（萨拉卡传媒）持有100\n13 百分比。现在郭文贵想让我们发财，所以他拿出10\n14 百分比，然后将他的股份以每股一美元的价格\n15 让我们认购。\n16 问：在我给你看的段落里，你在哪里读到郭文贵想让我们发财了？\n17\n18 芬克尔先生：对证词作了不实陈述。刚才的问题\n19 是她的理解是什么，而不是上面写了什么。\n20 法庭：异议成立。\n21 问：我的问题是，那个段落写了什么——我\n22 提议撤销记录，我重新开始提问。\n23\n24 法庭：继续进行吧。\n25 问：写在那张纸上的发行项目涉及2亿\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 反询问\n以 100 万股换取 2 亿美元，对吗？\n答：所以你说的是你在那里高亮显示的那个，你问我？\n问：我很乐意取消高亮。\n答：你是问我是否把它理解为以 2 亿美元购买 2 亿股？\n问：那是我的问题。\n答：所以我的理解是，上面说的是以 1 美元发行股份，共计 2000 万股新股，最多可以是 2 亿股新股。\n问：那份文件告诉你了，对吧，想出售 2 亿股的是 Saraca（萨拉卡公司），对吗？\n答：我当时的回忆不是 Saraca 在出售。我当时的回忆是 Miles（郭文贵/文贵）告诉我们，他在为我们寻找这个 1 美元一股的机会，并没有说 Saraca 要卖给我们。\n问：我明白你已经多次向我们陈述了你的理解。我的问题其实与该文件有关，对吧，Chen 女士（陈女士）？\n答：我知道你在问我关于这份文件的事，但我告诉您的是，我同意你所说的。我读过这份文件。当我读这份文件时，我对 Miles 所说的内容有自己的理解。因此当我读到它时，我是按照 Miles Guo（郭文贵）所说并在视频中广播的方式来解读的，这就是为什么我向你解释我的理解，是基于我阅读它的时间，基于我受到 Miles Guo、受到他的广播视频影响的时间。\n法官：好的。今天的时间到了，我们必须暂停了。陪审团成员们，不要在你们之间或与任何其他人讨论本案。不要允许任何其他人在你们面前讨论本案。不要阅读、观看、收听任何涉及本案主题的内容。祝大家度过一个愉快的夜晚。\n法庭书记官：陪审团退庭。\n（接下页）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.（纽约南区法庭速记公司）\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 反询问\n（陪审团不在场）\n法官：您可以退庭了。不要讨论您的证词。\n（证人暂时退庭）\n法官：请就座。在明天上午开庭前，双方是否有任何事项需要提出？\nSHROFF 女士：法官大人，如果可以的话，我只有一件事要提出。谢谢。法官大人，鉴于法庭在陪审团在场期间对旁听人员的告诫，我恳请法庭现在趁陪审团不在场时重申一遍。我们不会有异议，只是为了让未来的作证不以任何方式被打断，并希望能进行得更顺利。而且我也不必担心对陪审团造成偏见，所以我希望现在进行。\n法官：在我们的法律制度下，被告有权获得公开审判。这意味着任何人都可以来旁听。但是，必须遵守法庭礼仪。这意味着不说话、不发笑、不做鬼脸、不做手势，只是安静且礼貌地坐着。\n双方还有其他事项吗？\nSHROFF 女士：没有了，法官大人。\nMR. FINKEL（芬克尔先生）：法官大人，简短说两句。我提出异议时提到了法庭的两项命令。\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 反询问\n一项是前几天在更衣室做出的，另一项——我想法庭也意识到了——是关于投资人成熟度的问题。具体而言是法官大人在 Docket 319（案件案卷号 319）第 17 页的裁定，引用法官大人的话：“在正当地询问投资人的成熟度，与向陪审团不当暗示投资人本应查明涉嫌虚假陈述的真相之间，存在一条细微的界线。”支持了政府的动议，并允许政府“如果被告的提问接近于后者，可以在适当时机提出异议”，即暗示受害人本应意识到自己被骗了。\n因此今天的异议被驳回了。这没问题。明天如果在该问题上有额外的提问线索，政府将提出异议。政府重申，鉴于对 Chen 女士以及其他受害者和其他证人的提问，这是适宜的，我们请求法庭考虑就此向陪审团做出指示，即投资人的成熟度并不在争议范围之内。投资人无需承担查明自己是否被欺诈的责任。因此我们请求法庭，为了使陪审团随着审判继续以及进入被告案情陈述阶段时不产生混淆，请法官大人就该事项对他们进行指示。\n法官：所以你们有我拟定的陪审团指示，\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nO6QBGUO4 Chen - 反询问\n其中包含关于该问题的非常清晰的指示。Shroff 女士没有越界。我相信她不会的。\nMR. FINKEL：谢谢您，法官大人。\n法官：晚安。\nMR. FINKEL：我可以问一个问题吗？Shroff 女士在反询问上还剩多少时间？\n法官：Shroff 女士？\nMS. SHROFF：坦白讲，我和证人沟通有些困难，所以可能很容易还要两到两个半小时。\n法官：你说多少？\nMS. SHROFF：两小时。\n法官：哎呀。听起来确实太长了，真的。\nMS. SHROFF：法官大人，她非常具有对抗性。所以我必须小心。她随时可能会情绪崩溃爆发。\n法官：我没有那种感觉。她给人感觉是一个聪明、有思考能力、冷静的人，所以我并不担心她会崩溃，因此我请求你尽量提高效率。\nMS. SHROFF：我会尽最大努力的，法官大人。\nMR. FINKEL：如果真的是两个小时、两个半小时的话，法官大人，那我们到周五都不可能完成举证。周二，周五不开庭。\n法官：我们拭目以待。晚安。\n（休庭至 2024年6月27日 上午 9 点）\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\n询问索引\n被询问人： 页码\nPAUL HINTON\n主询问 由 Ms. Murray 进行 . . . . . . . . . . . .4355\n反询问 由 Mr. Kamaraju 进行 . . . . . . . . . . . .4399\n再次主询问 由 Ms. Murray 进行 . . . . . . . . . . . .4444\n再次反询问 由 Mr. Kamaraju 进行 . . . . . . . . . . . .4458\nWEI CHEN\n主询问 由 Mr. Finkel 进行 . . . . . . . . . . . . .4459\n反询问 由 Ms. Shroff 进行 . . . . . . . . . . . . .4509\n政府证据\n证据编号 采纳页码\nVB13, VB14, VB24, VB26, VB27, VB29, . . . . .4474\nVB31, VB33\nVB10-T, VB13-T, VB24-T, VB27-T . . . . . . .4474\nStip 21 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4473\nVB35 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4483\n被告证据\n证据编号 采纳页码\nDX-11124 至 11129, DX-11255, . . . . . .4401\nDX-11432 至 11436,\nDX-10299 至 DX-10301,\nDX-13005 至 DX-10329,\nDX-10526, DX-10528 至\nDX-10530, DX-10551 至\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nDX-10562, DX-10564 至\nDX-10577, DX-11299 至\nDX-11300, DX-11302, DX-11304\n以及 DX-11305, DX-11485,\nDX-11486 至, DX-11488,\nDX-11489, DX-11491 至\nDX-11492, DX-11548 至\nDX-11549, DX-11552 至\nDX-11553, DX-11562 至\nDX-11570, DX-10430 至\nDX-10457, DX-10960 至\nDX-10971, DX-11073 至\nDX-11078, DX-11110 至\nDX-11121, DX-11493 至\nDX-11506, DX-10007, DX-10531,\nDX-10606 至 DX-10626,\nDX-10008 至 DX-10010,\nDX-10330 至 DX-10356,\nDX-10578 至 DX-10605,\nDX-11256 至 DX-11257,\nDX-11281, DX-11517 至\nDX-11526, DX-11572 至\nDX-11573, DX-11581, DX-11585,\nDX-10357 至 DX-10359,\nDX-10627 至 DX-10631,\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300\n\nDX-10972, DX-10013, DX-10017\n至 DX-10028, DX-10360\n至 DX-10373\n7008 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4519\n7009 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4520\n7010 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4516\n7011 . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4519\n\nSOUTHERN DISTRICT REPORTERS, P.C.\n(212) 805-0300","key_entities":[],"ecf_references":[],"word_count":47408,"status":"published","published_at":"2024-07-23 00:00:00","created_at":"2024-07-23","updated_at":"2026-08-23 08:44:02"}