{"id":"batch-000070","number":70,"revision":62,"date_start":"2026-01-16T21:51:00.914Z","date_end":"2026-01-19T19:38:14.643Z","total_messages":970,"summary_en":"Community discussion, batch 070 (Jan 16, 2026 – Jan 19, 2026), 970 messages, on the Guo Wengui / Miles Guo (Ho Wan Kwok) case. Discussions centered on legal procedures and evidentiary chains across three primary disagreements: procedural routes regarding whether Supreme Court receipt triggers Second Circuit review, mandamus petitions, or appealable moments; status definitions debating 21 U.S.C. § 853(n), the CVRA, remission, and victim qualifications concerning 6,000 individuals; and shifts toward the Alliance, third parties, and Document 718-2 stipulations. Participants also disputed judicial recusal, evidence disclosure, and social media evidentiary value, framing developments around procedural obstacles.","guide_en":[{"title":"Whether Supreme Court Receipt Equates to Docketing: Divergence over Second Circuit Progress","description":"Participants debate whether the Supreme Court's receipt of filings signifies formal docketing and triggers further appellate movement.","message_ids":["q368b967fe19f78915075","q63dcb517fc18a767cbd0","q6c2876b0fe9e37cbf910"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"q368b967fe19f78915075","summary_en":"kir*** anticipates that the Supreme Court might formally docket the case in the coming week."},{"message_id":"q63dcb517fc18a767cbd0","summary_en":"ntp*** contends that because the Supreme Court confirmed receipt, favorable developments could occur on Monday."},{"message_id":"q6c2876b0fe9e37cbf910","summary_en":"kir*** argues that achieving formal case docketing remains the essential milestone."}]},{"title":"Conflict Among 853(n)/853(i), Remission, and CVRA Paths: Forfeiture Challenge, Mitigation, or Parallel Claims","description":"Participants analyze procedural differences between pursuing Department of Justice remission petitions and filing Section 853(n) ancillary claims in court.","message_ids":["q316c4fd19b0c8b075d1c","q45ff500740221b648493","q704170e7662221bc8048"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"q316c4fd19b0c8b075d1c","summary_en":"him*** asserts that Gail's final court motion relied on Section 853(n)."},{"message_id":"q45ff500740221b648493","summary_en":"him*** clarifies that the actual motion submitted to the court was grounded in Section 853(n)."},{"message_id":"q704170e7662221bc8048","summary_en":"him*** explains that the applicant pursued remission through the Department of Justice while simultaneously filing a Section 853(n) claim before the court."}]},{"title":"Controversy over Victim Boundaries: Distinguishing 6,000 Alleged Victims from Procedural Victims","description":"Participants dispute the legal criteria for victim status and how remission applicants differ from statutory forfeiture claimants.","message_ids":["q132e1aad7af7279244f2","q715ab682374b54a2df7f","q21b52c0d6cf8a42a0aef"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"q132e1aad7af7279244f2","summary_en":"him*** maintains that claimants must submit individual Section 853(n) petitions one by one."},{"message_id":"q715ab682374b54a2df7f","summary_en":"him*** suggests that defense counsel mentioned Gail to send a cautionary signal."},{"message_id":"q21b52c0d6cf8a42a0aef","summary_en":"him*** contends that individuals registered under the prosecution's remission process do not qualify as genuine victims."}]},{"title":"Authenticity and Legal Effect of Stipulation Texts: Competing Versions and Coercion Narratives","description":"Participants examine Document 718-2 to evaluate whether prosecutors coerced the defense into signing stipulated facts in exchange for witness testimony.","message_ids":["qd6c4579540c5fb537de8","q5ecd82b6cef34663f990","q0d90e07e4f94f9ff64fb"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"qd6c4579540c5fb537de8","summary_en":"ntp*** notes that the context involves actions directed at both him and the NFSC."},{"message_id":"q5ecd82b6cef34663f990","summary_en":"kir*** questions whether participants genuinely believe prosecutors presented an ultimatum forcing a choice between signing the stipulation or calling witnesses."},{"message_id":"q0d90e07e4f94f9ff64fb","summary_en":"kir*** analyzes Document 718-2 as a standard joint factual stipulation rather than a plea bargain, arguing that claims of prosecutorial coercion lack procedural foundation."}]},{"title":"Tensions in Evidence Preservation and Disclosure: Victim Rosters, Social Media Remarks, and Forensic Limitations","description":"Participants discuss preserving chat logs for future court evidence and demanding pre-sentencing disclosure of unredacted victim rosters.","message_ids":["q26d997693a80f29546e9","qf4baa1c26ffe7b062bfa","qfdba5d75eae0d46510db"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"q26d997693a80f29546e9","summary_en":"roy*** argues that statements made online can be preserved as court evidence, noting references to the CCP in Document 789."},{"message_id":"qf4baa1c26ffe7b062bfa","summary_en":"sar*** asks whether the original text of Document 789 can be shared in the chat."},{"message_id":"qfdba5d75eae0d46510db","summary_en":"kir*** contends that victims and third parties have valid grounds prior to sentencing to demand redacted victim lists and underlying evidence following appellate scrutiny of prosecutors and Luc."}]},{"title":"Judicial Bias and Recusal Pressures: Lack of Consensus on Judicial Withdrawal, Delays, and Rescheduling","description":"Participants debate whether judicial bias warrants voluntary recusal or if new petitions for writs of mandamus can resolve issues before sentencing.","message_ids":["q1308f436493b252fcc11","q1313be2109b45b3b44dd","q595cd51ae00cf8eff62d"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"q1308f436493b252fcc11","summary_en":"him*** states that in the judge's position, recusal would be preferable to avoid entanglement."},{"message_id":"q1313be2109b45b3b44dd","summary_en":"kir*** suggests that participants could draft a new petition for a writ of mandamus."},{"message_id":"q595cd51ae00cf8eff62d","summary_en":"kir*** disputes the likelihood of resolving these procedural disputes prior to sentencing."}]},{"title":"Third-Party Appellate Standing and Mandamus Timing: Contention over Direct Appeal Thresholds and Procedural Gateways","description":"Participants debate the legal avenues available to third parties, contrasting CVRA mandamus petitions with constitutional filing rights.","message_ids":["qf8a382edf0da1c4c28ac","qd06f7878a683d2f8a7ed","q5fe605f221d0e0376727"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"qf8a382edf0da1c4c28ac","summary_en":"him*** contends that only the CVRA permits filing a petition for a writ of mandamus at any time."},{"message_id":"qd06f7878a683d2f8a7ed","summary_en":"him*** maintains that the procedural mechanism in question still operates as a writ of mandamus."},{"message_id":"q5fe605f221d0e0376727","summary_en":"him*** argues that docketing filings remains an undeniable constitutional right."}]},{"title":"Focus Shifting to Enforcement: Urging Subpoenas, Hearings, and Section 853(n) Proceedings for Substantive Progress","description":"Participants assess whether third parties can appeal preliminary forfeiture orders or must await final district court rulings on Section 853(n) petitions.","message_ids":["q0b32e520fa003b630a8b","qe388b84242f07ab464d0","q67346226511ca3c36cf1"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"q0b32e520fa003b630a8b","summary_en":"reb*** proposes appealing immediately to stay the preliminary forfeiture order until Luc is subpoenaed for a Section 853 hearing to determine property ownership."},{"message_id":"qe388b84242f07ab464d0","summary_en":"beg*** recounts that the Second Circuit denied another Section 853(n) mandamus petition because the applicant had not filed for relief under the CVRA in district court."},{"message_id":"q67346226511ca3c36cf1","summary_en":"him*** details appellate jurisdiction standards, explaining that Section 853(n) claimants cannot appeal preliminary forfeiture orders until their property rights are conclusively adjudicated."}]},{"title":"Attribution of Underlying Facts and Victim Rosters: Uncertainty over Masterminds, Corporate Entities, and Asset Chains","description":"Participants discuss the corporate entities behind token issuances and whether the prosecution established direct links between the defendant and G-series assets.","message_ids":["q7e9026cfd65897bc24c7","qe3ea0b1320b78908d678","q201dcac996fa3bf8053c"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"q7e9026cfd65897bc24c7","summary_en":"him*** argues that establishing the precise connection between the defendant and G-series assets is the crucial factual issue."},{"message_id":"qe3ea0b1320b78908d678","summary_en":"reb*** questions why certain individuals were targeted first when other corporate entities issued the fraudulent tokens."},{"message_id":"q201dcac996fa3bf8053c","summary_en":"reb*** contends that presenting what they view as fraudulent bankruptcy creditor claims is vital to exposing external coordination against the defendant."}]},{"title":"Admissibility of External Social Media and Livestreams as Evidence: Competing Interpretations over Authenticity","description":"Participants circulate external social media posts and debate their relevance and evidentiary weight in ongoing court proceedings.","message_ids":["q3df29340df2115032155","qe228a54f178d44e625b5"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"q3df29340df2115032155","summary_en":"joy*** shares an external social media post regarding political commentary."},{"message_id":"qe228a54f178d44e625b5","summary_en":"kir*** distributes a link to an external social media broadcast."}]},{"title":"The Alliance, Defense Counsel, and Interference Narratives: Divisions over Fabricated Victims and Witness Pressure","description":"Participants dispute claims by Alliance leaders regarding absent witnesses and accuse internal factions of attempting to suppress third-party legal intervention.","message_ids":["q1b5d8d2902bdfd2fe6dd","qf7f4a917fc9bc05723ee","q80b2e35984f59cdb633c"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"q1b5d8d2902bdfd2fe6dd","summary_en":"him*** questions the Alliance's explanation that witnesses did not testify because the defendant chose to protect fellow movement members."},{"message_id":"qf7f4a917fc9bc05723ee","summary_en":"kir*** observes that the narrative appears aimed at responding to participants pursuing independent private legal actions."},{"message_id":"q80b2e35984f59cdb633c","summary_en":"chu*** contends that Section 853(n) and CVRA intervention are legitimate legal rights and accuses Alliance figures of intimidating prospective third-party claimants."}]},{"title":"Escalating Group Friction and Governance Boundaries: Disputes over Insults, Labeling, and Community Rules","description":"Participants debate community moderation standards and the potential legal value of preserving hostile online statements.","message_ids":["q46c3d57520aa70b84113","q852e547f3760fe9ae090","qcf164a38b82012a93e2d"],"quotes":[{"message_id":"q46c3d57520aa70b84113","summary_en":"kir*** laments that the term comrade has lost its positive meaning."},{"message_id":"q852e547f3760fe9ae090","summary_en":"roy*** outlines chat rules prohibiting abusive language, cryptocurrency promotions, and unauthorized collective legal motions directed at the judge."},{"message_id":"qcf164a38b82012a93e2d","summary_en":"roy*** argues that opposing statements can serve as pattern evidence, proof of a chilling effect, or support for a Cronic structural error claim."}]}],"summary":"讨论围绕案件程序与证据链并行发酵，核心分歧集中在三个层面：一是程序路径，成员对最高法院动作是否已触发二巡、强制令及可上诉时点存在持续分歧；二是身份定性，围绕853(n)、CVRA、remission与受害者资格（尤其“6000人”）是否成立反复对冲；三是叙事焦点外移，部分成员把焦点放在联盟/第三方角色、名单污染与法庭与检方行为动机。与此同时，法官是否偏袒、是否需回避、stipulation效力、证据保全与公开披露、社媒与外部言论的取证价值，均未形成统一解释，参与者多以“程序推进受阻”而非单一定罪事实作为主要观察框架。","guide":[{"title":"最高法“签收”是否等同立案：是否进入二巡推进产生明显分歧","message_ids":["q368b967fe19f78915075","q63dcb517fc18a767cbd0","q6c2876b0fe9e37cbf910"]},{"title":"853(n)/853i、remission与CVRA路径冲突：是反没收、减免还是并行主张","message_ids":["q316c4fd19b0c8b075d1c","q45ff500740221b648493","q704170e7662221bc8048"]},{"title":"受害者身份边界争议：6000人是否“真正受害人”与程序性受害人区分","message_ids":["q132e1aad7af7279244f2","q715ab682374b54a2df7f","q21b52c0d6cf8a42a0aef"]},{"title":"stipulation文本真实性及效力：谁是正确版本、是否存在二选一胁迫叙事","message_ids":["qd6c4579540c5fb537de8","q5ecd82b6cef34663f990","q0d90e07e4f94f9ff64fb"]},{"title":"证据保全与披露矛盾：受害人名单、社媒言论与下载取证能力不足","message_ids":["q26d997693a80f29546e9","qf4baa1c26ffe7b062bfa","qfdba5d75eae0d46510db"]},{"title":"法官偏袒与回避压力：是否会促使退场、延期与程序重排尚无共识","message_ids":["q1308f436493b252fcc11","q1313be2109b45b3b44dd","q595cd51ae00cf8eff62d"]},{"title":"第三方能否上诉、何时可提强制令：直接上诉门槛与程序入口反复争论","message_ids":["qf8a382edf0da1c4c28ac","qd06f7878a683d2f8a7ed","q5fe605f221d0e0376727"]},{"title":"争议重心转向执行层面：是否先催促传唤、听证与853n程序以求实质推进","message_ids":["q0b32e520fa003b630a8b","qe388b84242f07ab464d0","q67346226511ca3c36cf1"]},{"title":"“受害人名单”叙事外移到案情归因：主谋、组织与资产链是否成立未定","message_ids":["q7e9026cfd65897bc24c7","qe3ea0b1320b78908d678","q201dcac996fa3bf8053c"]},{"title":"外部社媒与直播信息是否可作为证据：支持与反驳并行，真伪解释权仍争议","message_ids":["q3df29340df2115032155","qe228a54f178d44e625b5"]},{"title":"联盟、律师与“猎狐/干预”叙事：围绕是否制造受害者、施压证言分裂","message_ids":["q1b5d8d2902bdfd2fe6dd","qf7f4a917fc9bc05723ee","q80b2e35984f59cdb633c"]},{"title":"群体对立升温后的秩序边界：谩骂、标签化与拉黑争端成为另一层争议","message_ids":["q46c3d57520aa70b84113","q852e547f3760fe9ae090","qcf164a38b82012a93e2d"]}],"closed":true,"is_finalized":true,"updated_at":"2026-09-06T20:21:03.686Z","notice":"这里汇集爆料革命参与者围绕郭文贵案的持续讨论，包括长期深度参与者及自述投入真金白银的投资者。他们分享亲历过程、资金投入与后续遭遇，并结合案卷展开追问、核对和观点交锋。这些来自事件内部的经验与细节，为理解事件经过和投资者处境提供了外部报道之外的重要视角。请结合具体发言判断其经历与依据，引用时保留发言者、时间和上下文。","content_type":"discussion_batch","canonical_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070/pages/3","base_batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070","markdown_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070/markdown","json_url":"https://mubeitech.com/api/discussion-batches/batch-000070?page=3","page":3,"page_size":200,"total_pages":5,"has_more":true,"next_url":"https://mubeitech.com/api/discussion-batches/batch-000070?page=4","prev_url":"https://mubeitech.com/api/discussion-batches/batch-000070?page=2","messages":[{"id":"qd21a82a13ece9389bdb0","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":401,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T18:56:52.146Z","text":"现在他们都把自诉人说成联盟的人","edited":false,"reply_to":"q0bf6f0292c5260edeaba","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd21a82a13ece9389bdb0","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0bf6f0292c5260edeaba","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言（跨批次）","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qdcbdc05f7c52f7c295b9","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":402,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T18:57:21.323Z","text":"看来联盟已经没人信了","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qdcbdc05f7c52f7c295b9","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q430046f402904010d545","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":403,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T18:57:46.577Z","text":"自诉人的动议都是打联盟的","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q430046f402904010d545","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q83b006b208649e104959","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":404,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T18:57:53.478Z","text":"他不知道吗","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q83b006b208649e104959","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q83430a1c543e30e084e9","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":405,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T19:02:20.692Z","text":"实在没得编了","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q83430a1c543e30e084e9","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3e5c34e1913e5d2f6433","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":406,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T19:34:02.111Z","text":"郝海东应该搞不清楚什么自诉什么的","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.co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深水炸弹 是这个啊 哈哈哈哈","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qea8ea86119253305de33","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3df56b7f9f65081ad3aa","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":409,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-17T19:47:11.138Z","text":"写”要求检方公布初始受害者脱敏名单”？","edited":false,"reply_to":"q4fa7ab7ac704261f1838","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3df56b7f9f65081ad3aa","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4fa7ab7ac704261f1838","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言（跨批次）","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qb3ef23c23d0c8f1218b8","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":410,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T19:47:21.477Z","text":"对的","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb3ef23c23d0c8f1218b8","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q6c1b6d8784a967b9452b","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":411,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T19:48:11.735Z","text":"也不仅仅初始  到现在为止各个时间段积累的受害者名单 需要包括时间点 什么时候成为的","edited":false,"reply_to":"q3df56b7f9f65081ad3aa","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q6c1b6d8784a967b9452b","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3df56b7f9f65081ad3aa","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q1b5d8d2902bdfd2fe6dd","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":412,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T20:15:23.574Z","text":"联盟说证人没出庭作证，是因为郭要保护战友？🤨","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":true,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1b5d8d2902bdfd2fe6dd","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qb5bf3126d78dc271bdde","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":413,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:23:41.213Z","text":"这个证据留好","edited":false,"reply_to":"q1b5d8d2902bdfd2fe6dd","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb5bf3126d78dc271bdde","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1b5d8d2902bdfd2fe6dd","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q880c2e8d5d3249871364","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":414,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:24:00.786Z","text":"这就是联盟执行猎狐令的证据","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q880c2e8d5d3249871364","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q29220e7dad524b069ac2","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":415,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:24:08.620Z","text":"联盟就是猎狐行动执行者","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q29220e7dad524b069ac2","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qf7f4a917fc9bc05723ee","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":416,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:24:23.543Z","text":"这好像是在回应我们自诉的人","edited":false,"reply_to":"q1b5d8d2902bdfd2fe6dd","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf7f4a917fc9bc05723ee","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1b5d8d2902bdfd2fe6dd","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q4b45b9c5c47f1bcc3631","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":417,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:24:54.877Z","text":"这个直播可以去看看","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4b45b9c5c47f1bcc3631","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q0b2712f02d3f4e931f38","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":418,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T20:29:52.141Z","text":"检方没有保护受害人，因为受害人和luc合作？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0b2712f02d3f4e931f38","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q65948f39309e45b8d026","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":419,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T20:29:59.674Z","text":"这是啥意思？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q65948f39309e45b8d026","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3210297daf086604b725","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":420,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T20:30:35.518Z","text":"受害人和luc合伙陷害被告，跟检方无关？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3210297daf086604b725","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qc8c48c3b18190b956ba3","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":421,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T20:30:45.745Z","text":"他们在保护检方？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc8c48c3b18190b956ba3","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q9450fbe8346e5f5c2681","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":422,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T20:30:55.821Z","text":"因为他们是检方证人？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q9450fbe8346e5f5c2681","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q49fe48a56b594a813177","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":423,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T20:31:29.608Z","text":"是为了免于起诉？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q49fe48a56b594a813177","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe228a54f178d44e625b5","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":424,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:42:33.829Z","text":"https://gettr.com/post/p3t3t4k3320","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":true,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe228a54f178d44e625b5","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q671d87660e6d902d83c9","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":425,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:42:40.718Z","text":"这个视频","edited":false,"reply_to":"qe228a54f178d44e625b5","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q671d87660e6d902d83c9","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe228a54f178d44e625b5","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q15fedcbf804e8eab42bf","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":426,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:42:51.148Z","text":"里面信息量很大","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q15fedcbf804e8eab42bf","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q597a8203c3607b6e138d","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":427,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:42:55.177Z","text":"大家看看","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q597a8203c3607b6e138d","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q5186138492fe5ca8b71e","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":428,"speaker":"roy***","date":"2026-01-17T20:43:59.923Z","text":"我是瑞恩小号我坦白🤣","edited":false,"reply_to":"q3924941adf89cd5fdb71","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5186138492fe5ca8b71e","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3924941adf89cd5fdb71","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言（跨批次）","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q328fe49016ea4751211c","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":429,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T20:47:19.368Z","text":"这是去年10月份的","edited":false,"reply_to":"qf7f4a917fc9bc05723ee","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q328fe49016ea4751211c","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf7f4a917fc9bc05723ee","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q825cd7f1cf2a181c313a","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":430,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T20:49:23.883Z","text":"他们说的是，检方和luc合作","edited":false,"reply_to":"q0b2712f02d3f4e931f38","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q825cd7f1cf2a181c313a","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0b2712f02d3f4e931f38","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q21039726f00bd95b6695","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":431,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:49:25.567Z","text":"[删节：隐私信息]  [删节：隐私信息]  [删节：隐私信息]  [删节：隐私信息]  你们仔细看看 1小时10分后内容","edited":true,"reply_to":"qe228a54f178d44e625b5","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q21039726f00bd95b6695","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe228a54f178d44e625b5","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q26382359be4db6121ad6","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":432,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:49:31.337Z","text":"首先 这是不是真的？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q26382359be4db6121ad6","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q01ebc2fa72106dc00055","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":433,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:49:49.324Z","text":"如果是真的 说明什么？ ［用户 roy***］  ［用户 chu***］  我想你们应该更了解","edited":true,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q01ebc2fa72106dc00055","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qa3e1ad5c8912101aaa32","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":434,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:50:02.909Z","text":"我到觉得这个事情很可能是真的","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qa3e1ad5c8912101aaa32","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q260d36281554df438611","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":435,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:50:28.572Z","text":"［用户 chu***］  ［用户 roy***］  如果是真的 那么我们的推测全部成立","edited":true,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q260d36281554df438611","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q183f65f3b66bd13c71ac","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":436,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:52:51.624Z","text":"但是ava之后的解释 是他妈瞎几把扯！","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q183f65f3b66bd13c71ac","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q54ff19d0b97b5242aed2","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":437,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:52:55.312Z","text":"[删节：隐私信息]  你好好看看","edited":true,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q54ff19d0b97b5242aed2","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qaa110f6bb642b3b53363","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":438,"speaker":"roy***","date":"2026-01-17T20:53:14.996Z","text":"在看","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qaa110f6bb642b3b53363","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q61affb3dfe47c93994ad","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":439,"speaker":"roy***","date":"2026-01-17T20:53:30.419Z","text":"讲普衡？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q61affb3dfe47c93994ad","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q91aed25aac755841a688","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":440,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:54:02.505Z","text":"［用户 roy***］  看一小时10后的内容。stipulation 应该就是检方签的 承认东区法庭的猎狐行动","edited":true,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q91aed25aac755841a688","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q68b88445199f27430a90","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":441,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T20:54:03.547Z","text":"那他们不怕得罪检方？","edited":false,"reply_to":"q825cd7f1cf2a181c313a","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q68b88445199f27430a90","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q825cd7f1cf2a181c313a","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q6d53bdd109f8181445c2","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":442,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:54:21.075Z","text":"这个早就是破产案文件了","edited":false,"reply_to":"q825cd7f1cf2a181c313a","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q6d53bdd109f8181445c2","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q825cd7f1cf2a181c313a","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q4371725b39b1951a9cbb","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":443,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:54:23.838Z","text":"不得罪","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4371725b39b1951a9cbb","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q57b159a4e06b7e4a1b1d","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":444,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:54:31.476Z","text":"这就是解释为什么检方不拿资产","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q57b159a4e06b7e4a1b1d","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qb4832eaf5b97ce23a612","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":445,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:54:49.722Z","text":"［用户 him***］  那个stipulation文件号你知道吗","edited":true,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb4832eaf5b97ce23a612","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qaaf19db955429222acfe","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":446,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T20:54:55.440Z","text":"是啊，把检方底给掀了","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qaaf19db955429222acfe","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q529dff33f4e33783f5c3","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":447,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T20:55:23.267Z","text":"这个stipulation有重磅 但ava绝对是瞎扯","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q529dff33f4e33783f5c3","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q164fc4cb203d2405d3d5","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":448,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T20:59:34.166Z","text":"stipulation是什么","edited":false,"reply_to":"qb4832eaf5b97ce23a612","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q164fc4cb203d2405d3d5","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb4832eaf5b97ce23a612","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q362e2ac0290b5bad832c","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":449,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:00:36.481Z","text":"郭文贵和检方签协议","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q362e2ac0290b5bad832c","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q66fce9ae735fe617ce2a","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":450,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:00:51.557Z","text":"检方承认郭文贵是灭共英雄","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q66fce9ae735fe617ce2a","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q11d6076beeaaea7dc61f","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":451,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:01:08.281Z","text":"［用户 ntp***］  要搞清楚 到底郭文贵没有被检方二选一","edited":true,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q11d6076beeaaea7dc61f","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3caf5955259efa0c2f16","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":452,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:01:22.361Z","text":"是联盟拦着有力证人  还是真的有这个二选一","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3caf5955259efa0c2f16","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd979b7376d94362dd512","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":453,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:01:37.164Z","text":"如果是联盟拦着 那就是联盟农场陷害郭文贵！ ［用户 chu***］","edited":true,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd979b7376d94362dd512","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qbfbceb70cfc48da6c4fd","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":454,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:04:04.137Z","text":"这个只有检方知道，怎么让检方谈这个事情？这算不算布雷迪？","edited":false,"reply_to":"q11d6076beeaaea7dc61f","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qbfbceb70cfc48da6c4fd","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q11d6076beeaaea7dc61f","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe06f13c56699c8edf825","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":455,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:04:21.886Z","text":"不是 有可能这个二选一是联盟瞎几把扯","edited":false,"reply_to":"qbfbceb70cfc48da6c4fd","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe06f13c56699c8edf825","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qbfbceb70cfc48da6c4fd","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q27ab4473b37e85a8d0a0","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":456,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:06:17.473Z","text":"到底有没有这个二选一","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q27ab4473b37e85a8d0a0","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3b03afb766f48c4aaa25","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":457,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:06:36.412Z","text":"如果没有 那么一定就是联盟拦着有力证人不让上","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3b03afb766f48c4aaa25","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q67477c5ca246e6331656","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":458,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:06:41.082Z","text":"那就是联盟干扰司法","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q67477c5ca246e6331656","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd99d540d07f89aece926","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":459,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:06:46.549Z","text":"陷害郭文贵","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd99d540d07f89aece926","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q337b55928f1cc180f971","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":460,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:07:07.536Z","text":"所以得检方证明有没有他们说的这个二选一的说法","edited":false,"reply_to":"qe06f13c56699c8edf825","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q337b55928f1cc180f971","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe06f13c56699c8edf825","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qc5a0e12610aee247a8bd","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":461,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:07:39.891Z","text":"但是，联盟是拦不住那些老外证人的","edited":false,"reply_to":"q3b03afb766f48c4aaa25","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc5a0e12610aee247a8bd","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3b03afb766f48c4aaa25","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qdff2f012358bbc5e76a0","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":462,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:07:56.497Z","text":"可以拦","edited":false,"reply_to":"qc5a0e12610aee247a8bd","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qdff2f012358bbc5e76a0","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc5a0e12610aee247a8bd","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3892b041d06e5c48648a","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":463,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:08:09.204Z","text":"联盟对[屏蔽词]丽娜有相当影响力","edited":true,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3892b041d06e5c48648a","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd4486e06d469059c7645","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":464,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:08:44.931Z","text":"老郭要传唤，律师有权拒绝？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd4486e06d469059c7645","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q8da10e46b10bea719c76","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":465,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:08:59.289Z","text":"老郭在里面","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q8da10e46b10bea719c76","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q0660b8ab1eebcc87d6d2","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":466,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:09:01.659Z","text":"如果拒绝，老郭当时为什么不说话","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0660b8ab1eebcc87d6d2","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qa6a3206b70a7df956fa2","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":467,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:09:08.936Z","text":"说不了话","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qa6a3206b70a7df956fa2","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qb0318a17ea8c11039017","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":468,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:09:30.999Z","text":"但他们说的是检方跟郭沟通","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb0318a17ea8c11039017","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q91036b1c1f8d56ae2b93","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":469,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:09:37.572Z","text":"让他二选一","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q91036b1c1f8d56ae2b93","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qafd3540e7ffa1dd625fc","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":470,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:11:11.501Z","text":"这事儿找谁证实呢？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qafd3540e7ffa1dd625fc","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q7e8ab322629ebc89d057","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":471,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:11:56.757Z","text":"老郭可以跟律师说话，律师如果拒绝，郭能怎么办？","edited":false,"reply_to":"qa6a3206b70a7df956fa2","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q7e8ab322629ebc89d057","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qa6a3206b70a7df956fa2","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q6a6a2a51284a160e428d","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":472,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:12:10.191Z","text":"我觉得不能怎么办😄","edited":false,"reply_to":"q7e8ab322629ebc89d057","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q6a6a2a51284a160e428d","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q7e8ab322629ebc89d057","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3733755abbd117301b43","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":473,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:12:26.510Z","text":"所以，差点死在律师手上","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3733755abbd117301b43","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3a7abd5b8d63267faf96","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":474,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:12:39.327Z","text":"老郭为什么不早点提出换律师","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3a7abd5b8d63267faf96","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qf90e084c96943da802bb","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":475,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:12:55.534Z","text":"不是随便换的","edited":false,"reply_to":"q3a7abd5b8d63267faf96","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf90e084c96943da802bb","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3a7abd5b8d63267faf96","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q0e849687877635dc068e","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":476,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:13:05.433Z","text":"如果是律师拒绝传唤证人，郭就该换律师","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0e849687877635dc068e","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q923837fc83c1e781ddf3","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":477,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:14:03.653Z","text":"他们说这个文件里写的都是中共对nfsc的迫害","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q923837fc83c1e781ddf3","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q505d3ea2f4c797bdc9a3","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":478,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:14:13.974Z","text":"可这跟被告有啥关系？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q505d3ea2f4c797bdc9a3","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qa15c76484cb527c0d913","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":479,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:14:22.361Z","text":"跟案子有啥关系","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qa15c76484cb527c0d913","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd0d21f90d0635a49a1a8","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":480,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:14:31.172Z","text":"说的是对郭文贵的迫害","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd0d21f90d0635a49a1a8","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q30bbf461b27849f9d389","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":481,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:14:36.792Z","text":"和nfsc没关系","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q30bbf461b27849f9d389","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe3d234a1860dbba51669","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":482,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:14:37.109Z","text":"为了这个文件，老郭宁愿不出来？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe3d234a1860dbba51669","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q1089c7f4d93fab0c309c","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":483,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:14:45.691Z","text":"他们就这个意思哈哈哈哈哈","edited":false,"reply_to":"qe3d234a1860dbba51669","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1089c7f4d93fab0c309c","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe3d234a1860dbba51669","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q1a597d6a5a558ef6276c","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":484,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:14:54.626Z","text":"这个里面有大问题啊","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1a597d6a5a558ef6276c","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3d4d0e4fec718ed4dd21","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":485,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:15:48.967Z","text":"罗伊更胡扯，为了保护战友，这些关键证人哪个是战友？吴增，jeolow","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3d4d0e4fec718ed4dd21","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd6c4579540c5fb537de8","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":486,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:16:42.097Z","text":"包括对他和Nfsc","edited":false,"reply_to":"qd0d21f90d0635a49a1a8","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd6c4579540c5fb537de8","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd0d21f90d0635a49a1a8","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qeed80d5f146d221a153a","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":487,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:17:40.619Z","text":"所以得去找stipulation源文件","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qeed80d5f146d221a153a","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe6b9aa974ac6a41bd41f","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":488,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:18:27.420Z","text":"我记得720多文件有一个附件 是那个","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe6b9aa974ac6a41bd41f","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q7d959164075d91088e09","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":489,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:18:32.565Z","text":"但源文件是多少","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q7d959164075d91088e09","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q2b13a5e8af735cb2b438","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":490,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:19:25.127Z","text":"佳佳说这文件保证人们能申请政庇？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q2b13a5e8af735cb2b438","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q615718866823a0f0a590","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":491,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:21:14.214Z","text":"按他们的说法，有这个stipulation就什么都搞定了，rico也没了","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q615718866823a0f0a590","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q4b1f2451cf30b865d160","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":492,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:21:46.382Z","text":"代价是他出不来","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4b1f2451cf30b865d160","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q0fdd90d878c5e78eae8f","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":493,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T21:31:17.128Z","text":"是zhou le 的庭审记录","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":true,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0fdd90d878c5e78eae8f","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qc30fcb364dace4bb66ea","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":494,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:55:24.407Z","text":"不是","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc30fcb364dace4bb66ea","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qf0393be237ec9a419043","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":495,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T21:55:28.996Z","text":"源文件不是这个","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf0393be237ec9a419043","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3b03f79f909379b4dcf7","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":496,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T22:05:59.659Z","text":"https://gettr.com/post/p37enpr52dd","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":true,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3b03f79f909379b4dcf7","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qdfb40ac7a7b3f80a408b","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":497,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T22:06:01.920Z","text":"在这里","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qdfb40ac7a7b3f80a408b","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q5ecd82b6cef34663f990","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":498,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T22:06:32.359Z","text":"这个东西是检方让郭文贵二选一签的： 要么签这个 要么不能传唤有效证人 你们信吗","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5ecd82b6cef34663f990","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q0975ff5d6604c9e25717","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":499,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T22:06:54.930Z","text":"如果能做实联盟在这个点撒谎 那么庭审结果全部推翻","edited":false,"reply_to":"q5ecd82b6cef34663f990","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0975ff5d6604c9e25717","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5ecd82b6cef34663f990","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qcb83d9006f37c934ed68","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":500,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T22:07:05.554Z","text":"［用户 chu***］ 这就是联盟农场共谋陷害郭文贵","edited":true,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qcb83d9006f37c934ed68","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q28ee0d5654ac2068ccb8","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":501,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T22:09:17.738Z","text":"大家赶紧去落实这个事情","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q28ee0d5654ac2068ccb8","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd932c592ed2451046119","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":502,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-17T22:10:57.809Z","text":"我想我可能会把这个二选一的事， 提供一个渠道问老郭 到底有没有这么回事","edited":false,"reply_to":"qafd3540e7ffa1dd625fc","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd932c592ed2451046119","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qafd3540e7ffa1dd625fc","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q508578021d71f072c9c0","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":503,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-17T22:13:22.042Z","text":"通过 - 不是提供","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q508578021d71f072c9c0","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qfc4881f9762162b02009","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":504,"speaker":"sar***","date":"2026-01-17T22:13:53.153Z","text":"我看完了你的清单。很棒！我写不出这些东西，主要是一些重要的文件号我们搞不清楚。这应该是经典之作。存了。我把它喂给机器人，给机器人洗下脑。😂","edited":false,"reply_to":"q1e8de474422e1d712843","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qfc4881f9762162b02009","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1e8de474422e1d712843","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言（跨批次）","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q034f594a8b4ca976c019","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":505,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T22:18:14.122Z","text":"不信","edited":false,"reply_to":"q5ecd82b6cef34663f990","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q034f594a8b4ca976c019","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5ecd82b6cef34663f990","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q15523caad6894128951f","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":506,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T22:20:45.904Z","text":"问题是写信给老郭不能谈案子","edited":false,"reply_to":"qd932c592ed2451046119","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q15523caad6894128951f","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd932c592ed2451046119","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qb12e8ef3e1efba1d9514","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":507,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T22:21:11.478Z","text":"如果撒谎 那庭审就推翻","edited":false,"reply_to":"q034f594a8b4ca976c019","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb12e8ef3e1efba1d9514","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q034f594a8b4ca976c019","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe8f3e2500b2d7da7403d","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":508,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-17T22:21:39.633Z","text":"不写信","edited":false,"reply_to":"q15523caad6894128951f","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe8f3e2500b2d7da7403d","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q15523caad6894128951f","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qc6f006ac397aa6a3a3da","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":509,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T22:21:44.445Z","text":"这个不能问郭本人，也不会有答案","edited":false,"reply_to":"q15523caad6894128951f","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc6f006ac397aa6a3a3da","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q15523caad6894128951f","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q86fd8102aec895bf3df0","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":510,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T22:22:06.768Z","text":"可以发给法庭作为记录","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q86fd8102aec895bf3df0","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qf530abc4c5baf52c7db4","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":511,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T22:22:34.110Z","text":"因为这种事，如果是真的，律师应该会拿出来说事","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf530abc4c5baf52c7db4","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q680ac75579112d40dbfe","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":512,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T22:22:44.843Z","text":"这是不合法的吧","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q680ac75579112d40dbfe","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q0d90e07e4f94f9ff64fb","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":513,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T22:42:41.096Z","text":"一、先定性：这份 stipulation 是什么级别的文件？\n\n你贴的 Document 718-2（Defense Exhibit, 双方签署的 stipulation） 有几个关键特征：\n    1.    双方签署（prosecution + defense）\n    2.    明确写明 “may be admitted into evidence”\n    3.    内容涉及：\n    •    PRC（中国政府）\n    •    Operation Fox Hunt\n    •    对郭文贵的国家级跨境打压\n    •    FBI调查、起诉、定罪事实\n    4.    不是 plea agreement\n    5.    不是 cooperation agreement\n    6.    不是 Rule 11 下的认罪交换\n\n👉 结论一句话：\n这是一个“事实承认型证据约定（stipulated facts）”，不是交易条件文件。\n\n⸻\n\n二、联盟的说法在法律上站不站得住？\n\n“检方给了两个选择：\n要么签这个 stipulation\n要么选择对你有用的证人\n郭选择签这个，所以宁愿输掉庭审，是为了保护战友”\n\n我们拆解这个说法的逻辑和程序可能性。\n\n⸻\n\n（一）检方“逼签 stipulation”换证人 —— 程序上极不成立\n\n在联邦刑事程序里：\n    •    证人问题属于：\n    •    Rule 16 discovery\n    •    Brady / Giglio\n    •    Jencks\n    •    或 defense 自主决定是否调用\n\n👉 不存在合法机制允许检方说：\n\n“你要证人，就不能签 stipulation；\n你签 stipulation，我就不给你证人。”\n\n这是赤裸裸的胁迫取证 / 干预辩护权，一旦留下记录，对检方是灾难级风险。\n\n⸻\n\n（二）如果真是“二选一交易”，它必须体现在这些地方之一\n\n如果联盟说法是真的，至少会留下痕迹：\n    1.    📄 on-the-record colloquy（法庭记录）\n    2.    📄 sealed side letter\n    3.    📄 Rule 11 / Rule 410 相关说明\n    4.    📄 defense motion complaining of coercion\n    5.    📄 CIPA / national security handling order\n\n但你现在看到的是：\n    •    一个干净、标准、可入证的 stipulation\n    •    没有任何：\n    •    “in exchange for…”\n    •    “conditional upon…”\n    •    “waiver of witnesses”\n    •    “defendant agrees not to call…”\n\n👉 从文件形态上看，这不像“交易”，而像“共同承认不可否认的事实”。\n\n⸻\n\n（三）更致命的一点：这个 stipulation 对谁有利？\n\n冷静看内容：\n    •    这份 stipulation 极大强化了郭文贵的叙事：\n    •    他是 PRC 最高优先级目标\n    •    被国家机器跨境追杀\n    •    被网络战、假信息、代理人围攻\n    •    FBI 认可、起诉过相关人\n\n👉 如果你是检方，你为什么要给被告这么一块“国家安全金牌”？\n\n这类 stipulation 的典型用途只有两种：\n    1.    防止陪审团被更血腥的证据震撼\n    2.    避免 defense 调 FBI / 国安证人上庭\n\n也就是说，检方更需要这个 stipulation，不是郭文贵。\n\n⸻\n\n三、联盟“为了保护战友宁愿输案子”的说法，逻辑上哪里崩？\n\n我们假设联盟是善意的，也会遇到三个硬伤：\n\n1️⃣ 如果有“对郭有用的证人”，为什么不调用？\n    •    刑案里 calling exculpatory witness ≠ 出卖战友\n    •    除非：\n    •    证人会暴露正在进行的情报行动\n    •    或涉及 仍在运行的 foreign intelligence operation\n\n👉 那就不是“保护战友”，而是 CIPA / 国家机密问题\n👉 但你看到的是：没有 CIPA litigation 被触发\n\n⸻","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0d90e07e4f94f9ff64fb","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd98c5c94b9241e342297","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":514,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-01-17T22:42:44.013Z","text":"2️⃣ 如果这是“保护战友”，为什么 defense 不留痕？\n\n哪怕一句：\n\n“Defense reserves objection to coercive limitation of witness presentation”\n\n都没有。\n\n👉 一个愿意为战友牺牲的人，不会连历史记录都不留下。\n\n⸻\n\n3️⃣ 更现实的判断：联盟有没有“叙事动机”？\n\n这类说法常见于：\n    •    案件结果不理想\n    •    需要解释“为什么输了”\n    •    需要维护内部忠诚、英雄叙事\n\n👉 “他不是输，他是牺牲”\n👉 这是政治叙事，不是法庭叙事。\n\n⸻\n\n四、你的核心判断问题：他们是不是在撒谎？\n\n我不用情绪词，给你一个法律级判断：\n\n目前没有任何可验证的程序、文件、记录支持“二选一胁迫说法”。\n\n而相反：\n    •    stipulation 的形式\n    •    内容的受益方向\n    •    风险分布\n    •    没有 CIPA / coercion 痕迹\n\n👉 强烈指向：这是一个事后叙事，而不是当时真实决策结构。\n\n是否“撒谎”，取决于你对他们主观动机的判断；\n但在法律世界里，这套说法 站不住。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd98c5c94b9241e342297","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q1c01d9d2aa85161446d1","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":515,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T22:46:17.840Z","text":"俺就是把动议全喂给AI，让它自己整理的","edited":false,"reply_to":"qfc4881f9762162b02009","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1c01d9d2aa85161446d1","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qfc4881f9762162b02009","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q0bf3739dfa4879a7b9b4","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":516,"speaker":"ntp***","date":"2026-01-17T22:47:44.333Z","text":"什么意思？阻碍被告传唤证人能推翻庭审？","edited":false,"reply_to":"qb12e8ef3e1efba1d9514","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0bf3739dfa4879a7b9b4","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb12e8ef3e1efba1d9514","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q59b8bb0b9e14d7539c0f","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":517,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-17T23:19:41.079Z","text":"联盟带节奏的东西，基本就是对被告不利的，至少它们主观故意是这样的。没必要在它们提及的事情上浪费精力。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q59b8bb0b9e14d7539c0f","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q201dcac996fa3bf8053c","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":518,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-17T23:25:14.471Z","text":"最重要的是把本案最重要的事实呈现到法庭上，拱卒的虚假债权就是本案最重要的事实。如果拱卒债权是真的，那么被告的行为就是干扰破产程序，就是妨碍司法，就是一个故意借钱不还的老赖，陪审团认为被告确实在诈骗就说得通。如果拱卒债权是假的，反过来一切就说得通，从2017年开始的司法缠诉，到南区的刑事案件，都是猎狐行动的组成部分，灭共演员，g系列实体的管理层，司法部，破产法庭，南区法院，都是猎狐行动执行者。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q201dcac996fa3bf8053c","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q8e2347766270c9be5d2e","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":519,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-17T23:26:45.590Z","text":"我们可能无法证明拱卒的债权是假的，第三方能够做且理论上可以做成的是，把luc强制过来进行听证，核实拱卒的债权是不是真的。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q8e2347766270c9be5d2e","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q9d12f39dc2200f970183","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":520,"speaker":"chu***","date":"2026-01-17T23:35:43.738Z","text":"正在第二巡回法院路上的，能不能把卢克强制听证原始报案受害者等写进去。有这样的强制令立案，就牛逼了","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q9d12f39dc2200f970183","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q0b32e520fa003b630a8b","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":521,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-17T23:37:08.508Z","text":"推进这个事情，可以换一个方式，就是上诉，现在就可以。上诉标的：初步没收令➕法院签发后政府受托人（一定要强调是政府受托人）继续控制并挥霍了5个月，这一状态证明了政府实质上执行了最终没收。\n上诉诉求：中止初步没收令，在强制传唤luc进行853听证查清本案财产所有权事实前，不得重启初步没收令。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0b32e520fa003b630a8b","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q395fd305a4617f60b50a","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":522,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-17T23:46:10.814Z","text":"拱卒做证了吗？ 没有吧。为什么他不做证呢。传唤luc 也是一个办法 但是luc也可能撒谎","edited":false,"reply_to":"q8e2347766270c9be5d2e","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q395fd305a4617f60b50a","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q8e2347766270c9be5d2e","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe388b84242f07ab464d0","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":523,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-17T23:51:18.061Z","text":"再确认一下：\n\n又一份853n强制令被二巡拒绝了， 二巡的拒绝信与我及另外一位同样模版信， 就是说 “a review indicates you have not filed a motion for relief under the CVRA statute in the district court” - \n\n大家认为如果再同样以 non CVRA 上二巡， 是不是还是被拒？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe388b84242f07ab464d0","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qc892bf16d120ae24627e","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":524,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-17T23:53:14.699Z","text":"就算luc会撒谎，这个事情也非常值得推进。","edited":false,"reply_to":"q395fd305a4617f60b50a","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc892bf16d120ae24627e","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q395fd305a4617f60b50a","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q1007b1960ceb9b11ced5","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":525,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-17T23:58:03.237Z","text":"上最高法，管他可能性有多小，也要试一下。二巡的意思可以被理解为不接受853申请强制令，管他实际是什么意图。不接受853申请强制令，等同于剥夺853的正当程序权。正好有巡回判例冲突，正好是一个写cert的钩子。","edited":false,"reply_to":"qe388b84242f07ab464d0","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1007b1960ceb9b11ced5","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe388b84242f07ab464d0","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qf8a382edf0da1c4c28ac","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":526,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T23:58:25.237Z","text":"只有Cvra可以随时发强制令","edited":false,"reply_to":"qe388b84242f07ab464d0","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf8a382edf0da1c4c28ac","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe388b84242f07ab464d0","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qc1803e23939658296d2f","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":527,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T23:58:34.614Z","text":"853n是不行的","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc1803e23939658296d2f","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qf55ae23b28afea204388","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":528,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T23:58:59.285Z","text":"853n只有没收程序全部结束以后，才可以","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf55ae23b28afea204388","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q45f847d8d3465c3a9399","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":529,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-17T23:59:05.348Z","text":"不认同。","edited":false,"reply_to":"qc1803e23939658296d2f","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q45f847d8d3465c3a9399","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc1803e23939658296d2f","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qf30d5e4693c628e5ef3e","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":530,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-17T23:59:45.049Z","text":"可以去最高法，申请看看","edited":false,"reply_to":"q45f847d8d3465c3a9399","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf30d5e4693c628e5ef3e","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q45f847d8d3465c3a9399","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd43e3ac45b9331b3838f","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":531,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-17T23:59:48.020Z","text":"也不是这样。财产权正在被政府侵害且地区法院不作为，就可以申请。","edited":false,"reply_to":"qf55ae23b28afea204388","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd43e3ac45b9331b3838f","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf55ae23b28afea204388","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q53ce8cfc482550f077b6","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":532,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:00:11.534Z","text":"那你不同意二巡的话，只能去高法了","edited":false,"reply_to":"qd43e3ac45b9331b3838f","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q53ce8cfc482550f077b6","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd43e3ac45b9331b3838f","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q55e7fca37c1c64951f1e","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":533,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-18T00:00:54.547Z","text":"理论上二巡不接受853说不通 - 853 与CVRA 都是有效 parties , 二巡都有管辖权","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q55e7fca37c1c64951f1e","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q6304a2704b14cb5ced62","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":534,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:01:08.586Z","text":"他觉得你时间不到","edited":false,"reply_to":"q55e7fca37c1c64951f1e","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q6304a2704b14cb5ced62","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q55e7fca37c1c64951f1e","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qf325a18a89b8aac44393","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":535,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:01:30.579Z","text":"或者你写的让他觉得不到位","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf325a18a89b8aac44393","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q52165f1da76f4d74adee","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":536,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-18T00:01:30.746Z","text":"这个解释说的通","edited":false,"reply_to":"q6304a2704b14cb5ced62","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q52165f1da76f4d74adee","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q6304a2704b14cb5ced62","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe09d088e4a40480f9d08","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":537,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-18T00:01:44.420Z","text":"嗯","edited":false,"reply_to":"qf325a18a89b8aac44393","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe09d088e4a40480f9d08","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf325a18a89b8aac44393","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qdc392610f6779f6054d5","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":538,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T00:02:06.822Z","text":"是这样。美国巡回法院的判决也有错的，一定也有很多错误就这么被当事人任命了。","edited":false,"reply_to":"q53ce8cfc482550f077b6","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qdc392610f6779f6054d5","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q53ce8cfc482550f077b6","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3038275b539b1ffa04c1","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":539,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T00:03:31.526Z","text":"不过依然可以去争取。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3038275b539b1ffa04c1","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qbb9eadcb75f06c2cde25","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":540,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-18T00:04:10.336Z","text":"OK","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qbb9eadcb75f06c2cde25","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q27cac11f2a594a9a94f0","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":541,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:11:28.265Z","text":"https://x.com/i/status/2012578408832581708","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":true,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q27cac11f2a594a9a94f0","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q2a429dcc56a9f27306f6","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":542,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T00:11:33.896Z","text":"我认为改用到二巡去像我刚才说的那样去上诉，比去最高法，更有机会。","edited":false,"reply_to":"qbb9eadcb75f06c2cde25","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q2a429dcc56a9f27306f6","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qbb9eadcb75f06c2cde25","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe515fb9737d461254b75","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":543,"speaker":"chu***","date":"2026-01-18T00:16:37.516Z","text":"［用户 beg***］ ［用户 reb***］ \n强制令立案太难。也可以尝试上诉。上诉哪部分，研究一下","edited":true,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe515fb9737d461254b75","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q93cc6c391e6bc19cc47f","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":544,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:18:03.709Z","text":"没有判决，可以上诉吗","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q93cc6c391e6bc19cc47f","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qfe43ab63eb11c30c5af2","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":545,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-18T00:18:09.947Z","text":"在哪里上诉？二巡？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qfe43ab63eb11c30c5af2","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q29c5016eb32694dc2ff1","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":546,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:18:50.025Z","text":"南区不上传，不裁决，就等于你没有上诉的途径","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q29c5016eb32694dc2ff1","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q2441905a9b203f824371","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":547,"speaker":"chu***","date":"2026-01-18T00:19:11.720Z","text":"上诉法庭命令。命令就是判决。但是，你怎么找到与你有关的命令是个问题。尤其是在没有入卷的情况下。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q2441905a9b203f824371","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q0597743cee6b962a2b5e","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":548,"speaker":"chu***","date":"2026-01-18T00:19:39.545Z","text":"是。上诉也是第二巡回法院","edited":false,"reply_to":"qfe43ab63eb11c30c5af2","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0597743cee6b962a2b5e","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qfe43ab63eb11c30c5af2","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qb74f5279216b82dec3a6","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":549,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:19:44.716Z","text":"你是说退信吗？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb74f5279216b82dec3a6","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q77e7c783a9e74796409b","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":550,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:20:20.862Z","text":"针对强制令的退信上诉？","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q77e7c783a9e74796409b","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qf8167ff32fac97f07910","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":551,"speaker":"chu***","date":"2026-01-18T00:22:27.191Z","text":"退信。上诉，扯淡。\n\n问问机器人，能不能上诉财产初步没收令。或者法官的其他命令。\n我的意思是没有入卷的人，可以参考一下，能不能通过上诉进入郭文贵刑事案件。毕竟强制令立案太费劲","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf8167ff32fac97f07910","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3417bd9edf8eb1d2b197","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":552,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T00:23:07.571Z","text":"推进这个事情，可以换一个方式，就是上诉，现在就可以。上诉标的：初步没收令➕法院签发后政府受托人（一定要强调是政府受托人）继续控制并挥霍了5个月，这一状态证明了政府实质上执行了最终没收。\n上诉诉求：中止初步没收令，在强制传唤luc进行853听证查清本案财产所有权事实前，不得重启初步没收令。","edited":false,"reply_to":"qe515fb9737d461254b75","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3417bd9edf8eb1d2b197","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe515fb9737d461254b75","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qfb5869747cbe1e2d0624","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":553,"speaker":"chu***","date":"2026-01-18T00:23:41.878Z","text":"比如，上诉法院的853n，60天。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qfb5869747cbe1e2d0624","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q56aa058e63f852aeac25","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":554,"speaker":"chu***","date":"2026-01-18T00:25:17.569Z","text":"我感觉不合适。破产案卢克花费一直都存在。那是合法的费用，至少面子上合法。","edited":false,"reply_to":"q3417bd9edf8eb1d2b197","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q56aa058e63f852aeac25","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3417bd9edf8eb1d2b197","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q67346226511ca3c36cf1","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":555,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:26:41.831Z","text":"可以，但范围和时点非常有限，而且不能直接针对“初步（或主）没收令”向第二巡回上诉法院提起上诉。以下是针对 21 U.S.C. § 853(n) 第三方申请人与第二巡回上诉管辖权的准确说明：\n一、初步（或“主”）没收令\n§ 853(n) 申请人不可上诉\n初步没收令是依据《联邦刑事诉讼规则》32.2(b)，在政府与被告之间作出的裁定。\n§ 853(n) 申请人在此阶段不是当事人\n该命令不裁定第三方权利\n因此，对你而言不构成“最终裁决”\n第二巡回的一贯立场：\n第三方在其财产权利尚未被裁定之前，不具备就初步没收令提起上诉的资格。\n结论：\n❌ 作为 § 853(n) 申请人，不能直接就初步／主没收令上诉。\n二、§ 853(n) 附属程序 —— 你的权利在此被裁定\n你的法律地位仅在 § 853(n) 附属程序中产生。\n关键在于法院是否已经：\n受理并审理你的 § 853(n) 申请；并且\n作出最终裁定，处理你所主张的财产权利\n只有在上述情形发生后，才存在针对你个人的“最终裁决”。\n三、§ 853(n) 申请人可以上诉的情形\n在以下情形中，你可以向第二巡回上诉：\n（一）最终没收令\n如果法院作出最终没收令，并且：\n驳回你的 § 853(n) 申请，或\n否定、消灭你所主张的所有权或优先权\n➡️ 属于 28 U.S.C. § 1291 意义上的最终判决，可依法上诉。\n（二）驳回或否决你的 § 853(n) 申请\n如果地区法院：\n以“缺乏主体资格”为由驳回你的申请；\n因程序原因将申请删除或不予受理；\n就实体问题否决你的申请；\n➡️ 对你而言均构成最终、可上诉的裁定。\n（三）拒绝或事实上未进行 § 853(n) 附属程序\n如果法院：\n在未审理已及时提交的 § 853(n) 申请的情况下，直接作出最终没收令；或\n以实际效果剥夺或阻断你依法享有的 § 853(n) 程序；\n➡️ 视具体程序状态，可通过直接上诉或**职权强制令（mandamus）**寻求第二巡回的审查。\n四、§ 853(n) 申请人不能上诉的事项\n❌ 初步／主没收令\n❌ 量刑裁定\n❌ 受害者人数或认定\n❌ 仅涉及被告的裁定\n❌ 政府与被告之间的协议或认罪安排\n这些事项均未裁定你的财产权利。\n五、第二巡回的核心判断标准\n第二巡回在处理 § 853(n) 上诉时，核心问题始终是：\n“地区法院是否已经对该申请人的财产权利作出最终裁定？”\n若 否 → 无上诉管辖权\n若 是 → 可依法上诉\n六、简要对照表\n§ 853(n) 申请人是否可上诉\n裁定类型\n初步／主没收令\n❌ 不可\n附属程序中的最终没收令\n✅ 可\n§ 853(n) 申请被驳回／否决\n✅ 可\n未进行或拒绝进行 § 853(n) 程序\n⚠️ 视情况：上诉或强制令\n总结\n§ 853(n) 申请人不能直接就初步（主）没收令向第二巡回上诉。\n只有在地区法院最终裁定（或拒绝裁定）你的 § 853(n) 财产权利之后，才具备上诉条件。\n如需，我可以结合你当前的程序状态（例如：申请未入卷、转交特别法官、或最终没收令的时间节点），进一步分析最合适的上诉路径。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q67346226511ca3c36cf1","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd06f7878a683d2f8a7ed","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":556,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:30:46.806Z","text":"那也是强制令","edited":false,"reply_to":"q803561c6e8520594852c","reply_status":"out_of_scope","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd06f7878a683d2f8a7ed","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"被回复的附件未收录","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q33b537125f7ba9d86fd9","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":557,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:31:15.627Z","text":"但是似乎法院在60天之后，还允许853n上传，所以现在还没结束","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q33b537125f7ba9d86fd9","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q58753cdfc3f555fb1653","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":558,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T00:31:38.461Z","text":"以实际效果剥夺或者阻断依法享有的853程序","edited":false,"reply_to":"q67346226511ca3c36cf1","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q58753cdfc3f555fb1653","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q67346226511ca3c36cf1","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe9d14af212b8fc309710","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":559,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:31:57.218Z","text":"简要结论：\n不能以“直接上诉”的方式向第二巡回提出上诉；但在该情形下，可以考虑向第二巡回申请职权强制令（mandamus），而不是常规上诉。\n下面按法律结构说明原因与可行路径。\n一、为什么仍然不能直接上诉（§ 1291）\n即使 POF（初步没收令）已作出、政府公告已满 60 天，且你已及时提交 § 853(n) 申请，但地区法院未将其入卷（docket）：\n对你而言，仍不存在“最终裁定”\n法院既未受理、也未驳回、更未就实体裁定你的 § 853(n) 权利\n因此，不满足 28 U.S.C. § 1291 的“最终判决”要件\n结论：\n❌ 仍然不能通过“直接上诉”进入第二巡回。\n二、但：这正是适合考虑 Mandamus 的情形\n当出现以下组合事实时，**mandamus（职权强制令）**成为可行路径：\n你已在法定期限内提交 § 853(n) 申请\n政府已完成公告，60 天期限已过\n地区法院未将申请入卷 / 未采取任何裁判性行动\n这种不作为事实上剥夺了你法定的 § 853(n) 程序权利\n此时问题不在于裁判结果是否错误，而在于：\n地区法院是否违反了其“非裁量性义务”——即受理并处理及时提交的 § 853(n) 申请。\n三、Mandamus 的法律基础（概括）\n第二巡回通常依据 Cheney v. U.S. Dist. Court 的三要素评估 mandamus：\n明确且无可争辩的权利\n§ 853(n)(2) 赋予第三方在期限内提交申请并获得审理的法定权利\n地区法院负有非裁量性义务\n对及时提交的 § 853(n) 申请，法院至少必须入卷并处理\n长期不入卷、零行动，构成程序性拒绝\n不存在其他充分救济途径\n无入卷 → 无裁定 → 无法上诉\n因此，常规上诉途径被“程序性封堵”\n四、第二巡回可提供的救济类型\n在 mandamus 框架下，请求的救济通常是程序性的，而非实体性的，例如：\n命令地区法院 将已提交的 § 853(n) 申请入卷\n命令法院 启动或完成 § 853(n) 附属程序\n命令法院 不得在未处理 § 853(n) 申请的情况下作出最终没收裁定\n⚠️ 注意：\n第二巡回不会直接裁定你的财产权利本身，只会纠正程序性不作为。\n五、如果随后发生“最终没收令”\n若地区法院在未处理你已及时提交的 § 853(n) 申请的情况下，直接进入最终没收令：\n那么该最终没收令本身就可能构成对你的可上诉的最终裁定\n同时，mandamus 与直接上诉在实践中可能出现竞合（需谨慎选择或并行评估）\n六、路径对照表（清晰版）\n情形\n可行路径\n§ 853(n) 申请未入卷、无任何裁定\n❌ 直接上诉不成立\n法院长期不作为，程序被阻断\n✅ 第二巡回 mandamus\n§ 853(n) 申请被驳回 / 否决\n✅ 直接上诉\n未处理 § 853(n) 即作出最终没收令\n✅ 直接上诉（并可能附带程序错误）\n总结一句话\n60 天已过且 § 853(n) 申请未被入卷，并不产生直接上诉权；但这恰恰是向第二巡回申请职权强制令（mandamus）的典型情形。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe9d14af212b8fc309710","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q2708d73d00899943eea4","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":560,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:33:23.240Z","text":"但是现在还没到最终没收令，二巡不会受理853n相关的强制令的","edited":false,"reply_to":"q58753cdfc3f555fb1653","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q2708d73d00899943eea4","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q58753cdfc3f555fb1653","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qc0bf0fe2818f84c1fa19","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":561,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:33:45.128Z","text":"特别法官还没上任呢","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc0bf0fe2818f84c1fa19","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3da40c2353552843ef8b","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":562,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:49:02.682Z","text":"二巡会等着看看这个special master到底要干什么","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3da40c2353552843ef8b","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd7c6f2588090b28b5150","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":563,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:49:33.677Z","text":"二巡会觉得南区已经在行动了","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd7c6f2588090b28b5150","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qaba5432d9ec0ed323bb2","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":564,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:49:42.476Z","text":"没有必要介入","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qaba5432d9ec0ed323bb2","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd0128bdebe930ffc15eb","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":565,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:50:23.795Z","text":"如果这个special master对资产流失没有任何阻止的权利，那二巡可能会介入","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd0128bdebe930ffc15eb","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q45c901d9dcc0c42e6343","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":566,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T00:52:12.485Z","text":"如果法院直接对初步没收令范围内财产进行853冻结，二巡不受理就没问题。如果争议财产仍在被挥霍，二巡就应该受理这些强制令或者上诉。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q45c901d9dcc0c42e6343","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qbd165bcfd6df3e179555","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":567,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:53:00.345Z","text":"强制令是关于你不可否认的宪法权利","edited":false,"reply_to":"q263da8878a4857e1278f","reply_status":"out_of_scope","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qbd165bcfd6df3e179555","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"被回复的附件未收录","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q8f5994634bc8c16bc8dd","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":568,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:53:26.217Z","text":"比如入卷，比如给你禁令之前要走的程序","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q8f5994634bc8c16bc8dd","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe690b51a91a68bc390ac","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":569,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:53:53.488Z","text":"调查盖尔不是你不可否认的宪法权利，这属于法官的自由裁量权","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe690b51a91a68bc390ac","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q5400547ea9cc4c22e8d2","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":570,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T00:54:21.911Z","text":"包括让luc听证，也不一定是你不可否认的宪法权利，当然你们可以自己查一查","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5400547ea9cc4c22e8d2","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q8028c5182e416f5c04db","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":571,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-18T00:57:41.938Z","text":"https://x.com/mubeitech/status/2012476884957736964?s=20","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":true,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q8028c5182e416f5c04db","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q839df9fba6d2e20ba511","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":572,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-18T00:58:21.019Z","text":"这个墓碑科技 就是我才知道的自诉","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q839df9fba6d2e20ba511","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qc8bc389e5e7bd5b2bc6a","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":573,"speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-01-18T00:58:53.034Z","text":"所以才疯狂的在各个群推自诉 所以才被踢","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc8bc389e5e7bd5b2bc6a","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q1490809b56ddfbb26355","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":574,"speaker":"sar***","date":"2026-01-18T00:59:08.709Z","text":"我遇到的就是这种来回踢皮球的死循环，而我又不想在这个死循环中浪费时间，所以才上最高法的。","edited":false,"reply_to":"q3226a2081ea8d6cee684","reply_status":"out_of_scope","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1490809b56ddfbb26355","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"被回复的附件未收录","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qf82ea0aefcf588cde2ff","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":575,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T01:00:15.927Z","text":"这个在二巡看来是这样。强制传唤luc是查清财产所有权的必然路径，如果南区法院认为不传唤luc就可以查清，她可以决定不传，但我们可以在南区请求强制传唤，因为南区不docket,我们才在二巡提出强制传唤。如果我们在南区提出要强制传唤的动议被上传，就不应该在二巡提。如果没有被上传，就可以在二巡提，当然二巡可以驳回，说应该由南区法院决定传唤哪些人更有助于查清事实。","edited":false,"reply_to":"q5400547ea9cc4c22e8d2","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf82ea0aefcf588cde2ff","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5400547ea9cc4c22e8d2","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q5fe605f221d0e0376727","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":576,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:01:03.865Z","text":"那还是上传的问题，上传是你不可否认的宪法权利","edited":false,"reply_to":"qf82ea0aefcf588cde2ff","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5fe605f221d0e0376727","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf82ea0aefcf588cde2ff","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd94ea82b75ff9b08fab7","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":577,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:01:19.150Z","text":"让Luc听证不是","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd94ea82b75ff9b08fab7","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qb6d58fed48f3f0f9ab64","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":578,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:01:47.452Z","text":"你只能让二巡强制上传","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb6d58fed48f3f0f9ab64","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qb6f36bcd5cf5b74d3890","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":579,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:02:01.101Z","text":"地方法院上传后不判","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb6f36bcd5cf5b74d3890","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q370c49896d3864e5032b","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":580,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:02:11.743Z","text":"那你去二巡强制让他判","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q370c49896d3864e5032b","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qb02ac9f72e525623346d","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":581,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:02:26.089Z","text":"等地方法院判了，你才能去二巡上诉","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb02ac9f72e525623346d","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qbe7a4e8cdc04c7d09c54","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":582,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:03:10.075Z","text":"现在的问题是，二巡认为量刑前， 上不上传，什么时候上传，都是南区的自由裁量权","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qbe7a4e8cdc04c7d09c54","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q975859fe3b09220e24ad","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":583,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:03:49.180Z","text":"除非你的强制令提出新情况，新观点，能说服二巡，你的动议必须马上上传， 不然你的不可否认的宪法权利就被损害了","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q975859fe3b09220e24ad","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qc5db3656edf3764177f7","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":584,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:13:16.698Z","text":"你们可以查一下，宪法有没有规定cvra动议多少天必须上传","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc5db3656edf3764177f7","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q74b25c2846967a545b49","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":585,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:13:37.660Z","text":"853n动议宪法规定有没有上传的期限","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q74b25c2846967a545b49","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q4c62f6bb854a302e0dba","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":586,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T01:16:21.541Z","text":"争议财产正在被耗散，解决办法就是要听证明确财产所有权，南区可以直接853冻结，但这样对luc可能带来权利侵犯，所以必须立即听证，luc也必须参加听证。地区法院本应做这些但其没有做，所以申请强制令。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4c62f6bb854a302e0dba","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q3b27802f70eb71dd5574","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":587,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T01:16:48.465Z","text":"不是期限的问题，而是争议财产正在被挥霍。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3b27802f70eb71dd5574","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q94ec6fe4c4ed4cfce601","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":588,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:17:30.578Z","text":"财产被挥霍有没有影响到你作为853n申请人的不可否认的宪法权利","edited":false,"reply_to":"q3b27802f70eb71dd5574","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q94ec6fe4c4ed4cfce601","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3b27802f70eb71dd5574","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q82f8b805235c8b540fb6","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":589,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:17:40.095Z","text":"二巡看的是这个","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q82f8b805235c8b540fb6","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q443e20dd279838f824e8","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":590,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T01:17:59.040Z","text":"第五修正案，财产权。","edited":false,"reply_to":"q94ec6fe4c4ed4cfce601","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q443e20dd279838f824e8","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q94ec6fe4c4ed4cfce601","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe7a6d38aa0e70832d690","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":591,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:18:23.074Z","text":"可以试试","edited":false,"reply_to":"q443e20dd279838f824e8","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe7a6d38aa0e70832d690","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q443e20dd279838f824e8","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qd4e258d32fac046ad182","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":592,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T01:20:19.043Z","text":"这个只是理论可行。二巡就是错误判决，你走最高法也很难被立案。只是相关方应该尽一份人事。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd4e258d32fac046ad182","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q294bbefa0efea25b4ed7","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":593,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:20:46.365Z","text":"第三方可以不停尝试","edited":false,"reply_to":"qd4e258d32fac046ad182","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q294bbefa0efea25b4ed7","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd4e258d32fac046ad182","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qb3df6410f0f658a8c64c","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":594,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:28:43.205Z","text":"https://x.com/Weiwei603438482/status/2012689760989364459?s=20","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":true,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb3df6410f0f658a8c64c","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qe169541b87b2205405b0","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":595,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:28:53.030Z","text":"https://x.com/okmyfriend7/status/2012692300749496532?s=20","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":true,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe169541b87b2205405b0","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qc3c2a64cc82e4fc8eb58","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":596,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:30:22.176Z","text":"https://x.com/Haier918/status/2012697845007020038?s=20","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":true,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc3c2a64cc82e4fc8eb58","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q05c82a4f05f03d6a9130","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":597,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:30:59.418Z","text":"我就知道，他们一定会拿CVRA做文章。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q05c82a4f05f03d6a9130","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q59820477635db5d32cf8","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":598,"speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-01-18T01:34:06.126Z","text":"它们肯定会说所有cvra自诉都是中共代理人来添乱，添乱是个万能的阻挡韭菜行动的理由，也是给懒惰者，胆小者不行动不担当的万能理由。","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q59820477635db5d32cf8","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"q52037a9d2227c1b6f188","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":599,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:51:49.233Z","text":"所以这个郭的律师现在提出什么中共代理人，又不敢说清楚谁是中共代理人，这种做法真的很有问题","edited":false,"reply_to":"q59820477635db5d32cf8","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q52037a9d2227c1b6f188","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q59820477635db5d32cf8","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"},{"id":"qeca3d479cff654ed1f84","batch_id":"batch-000070","seq":600,"speaker":"him***","date":"2026-01-18T01:51:59.007Z","text":"直接说了不就完了","edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qeca3d479cff654ed1f84","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000070"}],"prev_batch_id":"batch-000069","next_batch_id":"batch-000071"}