{"id":"q033a4fccf70fec27624e","batch_id":"batch-000153","seq":183,"speaker":"roy***","date":"2026-08-27T11:59:48.991Z","text":"如果这四点全部坐实，性质就完全不同了。\n\n因为已经至少有底层投资人后来向刑事法院正式说：\n\n她把Phoenix Farm贷款转给MOS，由MOS代表追回；\n\nMOS赢了官司以后没有通知她，也没有退还她的钱。\n\n这已经是一个实实在在的红旗。\n\n所以你说“夏有欺诈行为”，我现在会把证据状态分成三档：\n\n已经很强：\nMOS取得的813.6万中不只包含MOS自己的直接本金；它还依赖其他投资人/受让债权。法院也明确关注真实权利人和秘密贷款人的问题。\n\n已经出现严重异常：\n至少有底层投资人称MOS已经追回钱但没有返还她。\n\n还不能直接下定论：\n夏启东是否故意向法院虚构不存在的投资人、故意夸大受托金额、或者把不属于MOS的几百万据为己有。要证明“欺诈”，还需要把转让名单、每个人金额、法院实际追回款、MOS最终分配记录对上。\n\n最值得你注意的是，亚利桑那法院早就抓到了一个非常关键的数字问题：MOS原本要求接近 996.7万美元，法院最终只允许其针对Sara/Maywind主张 455万美元的default judgment，因为法院不接受把所有他人转入Maywind的金额都直接当成MOS自己的损失。\n\n这句话非常关键。\n\n它实际上说明：\n\n法官已经拒绝过MOS把“别人转的钱”全部算成MOS自己的damage。\n\n而后来MOS却又通过两个不同回收渠道拿到了 813.6万。\n\n所以真正值得深挖的不是泛泛说“夏诈骗”，而是：\n\n法官只认MOS约455万自己的可判损失，为什么MOS后来能够实际控制813.6万？\n\n多出来的大约358万分别对应哪些合法受让投资人？\n\n这些投资人后来收到钱了吗？\n\n如果没有，MOS凭什么继续持有？\n\n这四个问题如果对不上，才会真正形成一个很强的受托资金/虚假陈述/不当占有甚至欺诈问题。\n\n而且它会直接反过来影响郭刑事案的Farm损失：\n\n如果一批所谓“诈骗受害人”的债权已经被转给MOS；\n\nMOS又已经从其他法院实际追回相当金额；\n\n但底层投资人没拿到，\n\n那么今天真正的未赔偿损失究竟应归因于原Farm诈骗，还是MOS后续未分配追回款，必须重新拆开，不能全压在郭头上。\n\n这个点，我认为非常大。","text_en":null,"edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q033a4fccf70fec27624e","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000153","batch_canonical_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000153","notice":"围绕郭文贵案的社区讨论与观点交锋。发言仅代表讨论者观点，不等同于法院认定。","content_type":"discussion_message","canonical_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q033a4fccf70fec27624e","markdown_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q033a4fccf70fec27624e/markdown","json_url":"https://mubeitech.com/api/discussion-messages/q033a4fccf70fec27624e","surrounding_messages":[{"id":"q54498011523293feed8b","speaker":"roy***","date":"2026-08-27T11:59:04.189Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q54498011523293feed8b"},{"id":"q901a6d6adab707c63b64","speaker":"roy***","date":"2026-08-27T11:59:23.353Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q901a6d6adab707c63b64"},{"id":"qaa2f2e8864d41e03a9c8","speaker":"him***","date":"2026-08-27T11:59:23.506Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qaa2f2e8864d41e03a9c8"},{"id":"q31a70d122679073eec92","speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-08-27T12:08:18.722Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q31a70d122679073eec92"},{"id":"q401bfcae959e2eb30be6","speaker":"beg***","date":"2026-08-27T12:11:59.514Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q401bfcae959e2eb30be6"},{"id":"q8d27188a3fd9a317999c","speaker":"roy***","date":"2026-08-27T12:12:04.566Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q8d27188a3fd9a317999c"}],"parent_message":null}