{"id":"q13d2d0a7cc5983fdccc7","batch_id":"batch-000108","seq":859,"speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-05-05T01:51:50.787Z","text":"［用户 reb***］ 要证明这个才行","text_en":null,"edited":true,"reply_to":"q4ac375e07de147f1bf14","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q13d2d0a7cc5983fdccc7","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4ac375e07de147f1bf14","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言（跨批次）","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000108","batch_canonical_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000108","notice":"围绕郭文贵案的社区讨论与观点交锋。发言仅代表讨论者观点，不等同于法院认定。","content_type":"discussion_message","canonical_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q13d2d0a7cc5983fdccc7","markdown_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q13d2d0a7cc5983fdccc7/markdown","json_url":"https://mubeitech.com/api/discussion-messages/q13d2d0a7cc5983fdccc7","surrounding_messages":[{"id":"q65da62ea4ec13da36fe6","speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-05-05T01:49:23.884Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q65da62ea4ec13da36fe6"},{"id":"qfd716d6e432c3f50acf3","speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-05-05T01:49:48.219Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qfd716d6e432c3f50acf3"},{"id":"q4ac375e07de147f1bf14","speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-05-05T01:51:38.344Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4ac375e07de147f1bf14"},{"id":"q16bde193089b92dd3642","speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-05-05T01:58:22.297Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q16bde193089b92dd3642"},{"id":"qa7ad9f649648cfc4b00e","speaker":"mia***","date":"2026-05-05T01:58:47.422Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qa7ad9f649648cfc4b00e"},{"id":"qcaa91262d5843d178137","speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-05-05T02:00:15.028Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qcaa91262d5843d178137"}],"parent_message":{"id":"q4ac375e07de147f1bf14","speaker":"kir***","date":"2026-05-05T01:51:38.344Z","text":"情况B：他是主导者，但钱在“共同企业里”\n\n👉 争议点在这里（也是你想打的点）\n\n检方通常会说：\n    •    他构成“obtained indirectly”（间接获得）\n    •    或对资金有支配/控制权（dominion & control）\n\n👉 如果法院接受这个说法\n➡️ 仍然可以对他做 forfeiture\n\n⸻\n\n❌ 情况C：他既没拿过、也没控制过\n\n👉 这才是 Honeycutt 明确禁止的","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4ac375e07de147f1bf14"}}