{"id":"q2add7ab1a6b7aadb3044","batch_id":"batch-000044","seq":112,"speaker":"an7***","date":"2025-10-01T02:24:10.853Z","text":"“按照检方说法，初步没收令范围内的财产为被告犯罪所得，那luc就无权控制本案财产，应该转为司法冻结，现在检方在750一边说本案财产是诈骗所得，一边让luc继续控制本案财产……”——你還沒有走出聯盟敘事。\n\n我們很多戰友還在聯盟大V嘻嘻哈哈的敘事裡：”一邊破產庭說錢是郭先生的，一邊刑事庭說錢不是郭先生的，而是詐騙所得，兩者矛盾。”\n\n實際上破產庭和刑事庭根本就沒有矛盾，破產庭的邏輯是：破產申請人郭先生隱匿資產，而被隱匿的資產就在眾多alter ego即那些被破產申請人實質控制的公司裡，Luc作為受託人追查所有可能隱匿資產的代理公司，包括各類G系列實體和房產、其他資產控股公司，他都希望納入進來，不過需要說明的是破產庭承認了一部分尚未全部認可。\n\n而刑事庭檢方認為G系列是詐騙工具，受害者的財產被通過電信欺詐等手段藏匿其中，並作為洗錢通道。二者並不矛盾，相反是”自洽”的。\n\n聯盟大V連基本的法律邏輯、法庭語言都理解不了，怎麼可能還去分析案情。","edited":false,"reply_to":"q3e219aa9f934fafe2569","reply_status":"available","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q2add7ab1a6b7aadb3044","reply_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3e219aa9f934fafe2569","reply_label":"查看被回复的发言（跨批次）","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000044","batch_canonical_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000044","notice":"围绕郭文贵案的社区讨论与观点交锋。发言仅代表讨论者观点，不等同于法院认定。","content_type":"discussion_message","canonical_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q2add7ab1a6b7aadb3044","markdown_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q2add7ab1a6b7aadb3044/markdown","json_url":"https://mubeitech.com/api/discussion-messages/q2add7ab1a6b7aadb3044","surrounding_messages":[{"id":"q6091d8ff8f39239caa67","speaker":"rui***","date":"2025-10-01T00:34:04.703Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q6091d8ff8f39239caa67"},{"id":"qc0e8251ebe715f9978f9","speaker":"rui***","date":"2025-10-01T00:48:28.570Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc0e8251ebe715f9978f9"},{"id":"qdc9041745750e4ac1f54","speaker":"tut***","date":"2025-10-01T01:34:40.585Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qdc9041745750e4ac1f54"},{"id":"q21bfceff921e44c1d558","speaker":"an7***","date":"2025-10-01T02:28:19.333Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q21bfceff921e44c1d558"},{"id":"q2f42d3c0fecb0baef099","speaker":"him***","date":"2025-10-01T03:10:03.451Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q2f42d3c0fecb0baef099"},{"id":"qf82eedd4842106eab304","speaker":"him***","date":"2025-10-01T03:11:03.978Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf82eedd4842106eab304"}],"parent_message":{"id":"q3e219aa9f934fafe2569","speaker":"reb***","date":"2025-10-01T00:30:04.646Z","text":"法官以尊重辩方的辩护策略为自己的正常量刑辩护，完全没有问题。因为被告可能根本不想再在南区浪费时间，而是走上诉直接无罪释放。现在能撬动法官回复第三方的是luc在挥霍本案财产，按照检方说法，初步没收令范围内的财产为被告犯罪所得，那luc就无权控制本案财产，应该转为司法冻结，现在检方在750一边说本案财产是诈骗所得，一边让luc继续控制本案财产，还公然挑衅法庭说法官无权决定检方何时以及如何执行初步没收令。正常情况下，法官会在10月5日前下令冻结本案财产，直到进一步指示，不过看它们目前的疯狂，反正程序已经溃烂了，再烂一些也无所谓。接下来，法官也不保护本案财产，第三方请求法官保护本案财产，法官用不上传动议的隐私在程序上卡着，你上诉，责任最多追究到书记处。","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3e219aa9f934fafe2569"}}