{"id":"q4742576abb72517d4859","batch_id":"batch-000151","seq":201,"speaker":"roy***","date":"2026-08-25T09:17:22.190Z","text":"但859里王雁平确实出现了，而且位置非常精确\n\n这一点Robert和Qodty前面的讨论需要精细化。\n\n859说Additional Specific Property有两种基础：\n\n(i) 郭本人取得的Counts 1、2、4、7–11犯罪所得；\n\n以及：\n\n(ii) Count 3 money laundering涉及的property及其traceable property，在王雁平的forfeiture money judgment范围内，郭与王承担joint and several liability。\n\n所以王的作用确实存在。\n\n但是不是：\n\n“王认了GTV，所以拿王来替郭背GTV。”\n\n859原文不是这么写。\n\n它写的是：\n\n王与郭在Count 3 money-laundering property这一部分发生joint-and-several forfeiture关系。\n\n这两个完全不同。\n\n⸻\n\n859还有一句对第三方特别重要\n\n第7段明确说：\n\n只有等所有third-party interests adjudicated以后，法院才会针对Additional Specific Property进入Final Order of Forfeiture。\n\n而且：\n\n最终真正没收给美国的Specific Property，才用于冲抵Money Judgment。\n\n这正好证明Robert强调的三个层次确实必须分开：\n\nMoney Judgment\n\n≈ 郭个人应承担的没收金额。","text_en":null,"edited":false,"reply_to":null,"reply_status":"none","has_attachment":false,"url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4742576abb72517d4859","reply_url":null,"reply_label":"","batch_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000151/pages/2","batch_canonical_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/batches/batch-000151/pages/2","notice":"围绕郭文贵案的社区讨论与观点交锋。发言仅代表讨论者观点，不等同于法院认定。","content_type":"discussion_message","canonical_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4742576abb72517d4859","markdown_url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4742576abb72517d4859/markdown","json_url":"https://mubeitech.com/api/discussion-messages/q4742576abb72517d4859","surrounding_messages":[{"id":"qb5ecac4e5a5df53cabe5","speaker":"roy***","date":"2026-08-25T09:16:07.299Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb5ecac4e5a5df53cabe5"},{"id":"q681458b3479ca061c6ea","speaker":"reb***","date":"2026-08-25T09:16:37.293Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q681458b3479ca061c6ea"},{"id":"q247a7ba7cee3334d8db8","speaker":"roy***","date":"2026-08-25T09:16:46.023Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q247a7ba7cee3334d8db8"},{"id":"q6bbed20cefd2cc5310b9","speaker":"roy***","date":"2026-08-25T09:17:59.646Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q6bbed20cefd2cc5310b9"},{"id":"q4a64cb2ed73860b096e7","speaker":"joh***","date":"2026-08-25T09:22:41.968Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4a64cb2ed73860b096e7"},{"id":"qc1c42e2f2874f9c15938","speaker":"joh***","date":"2026-08-25T09:24:38.187Z","url":"https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc1c42e2f2874f9c15938"}],"parent_message":null}