# Guo Wengui / Miles Guo (Ho Wan Kwok): community discussion 101

Community discussion, batch 101 (Apr 13, 2026 – Apr 16, 2026), 1,000 messages, on the Guo Wengui / Miles Guo (Ho Wan Kwok) case. Discussion focused on one criminal matter and remained split on key legal questions rather than settling on shared conclusions. Participants contested whether prosecutors and courts were structurally unfair, whether the 6000/1800 creditor records and alleged fake entries could establish bail effects or shifted liability, and how post-sentencing procedural rights should be preserved. They also debated CVRA/853n timing and success, with identifiers 733, 817, alter ego, forfeiture, and cert/mandamus repeatedly cited. Community statements, not court findings.

English reading guide and paraphrases; Chinese source messages remain authoritative.

## Whether prosecution and judicial procedures were biased

Participants dispute whether judicial institutions were biased toward the prosecution, with some arguing procedural blocks on third-party filings and incomplete records made the process unfair. Community statements, not court findings.

- kir***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant claims judicial fraud, saying the prosecution could secure no confiscated funds. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qeb1bcdfd8680d00a3b02)
- kir***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant confirms agreement with the bias allegation. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qff1bfccf58d8d063bf74)
- beg***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant contends even the assigned judge cannot fix core process issues, citing refusal of third-party filing access and incomplete records. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qfc64ba3d91343dce7eb4)
## "6000/1800" creditor list and whether it can prove bail causation

Participants dispute whether the 6000/1800 creditor list is reliable proof of bad-faith transfers affecting bail and whether those entries show Guo-related culpability. Community statements, not court findings.

- joh***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant links the 6000/1800 issue to the earlier 6000-person creditor argument as the same pattern. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q307f7946ffd7cd90cfe5)
- joh***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant clarifies they see creditor updates as validating real creditors, not deleting them. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q16d292c5c018b12bc2c9)
- joh***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant references an earlier note marked 733 and says fake creditor registration was said to make Guo ineligible for bail. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4dc42e7d3a4a038f5ee4)
## Creditor deletion/addition and burden of proof dispute

Participants contest whether creditor deletions were record manipulation or routine validation, and whether Guo allegedly directed any cleanup. Community statements, not court findings.

- ntp***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant asks if someone was helping delete creditors from the list. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q9f632585c2afa47d94f3)
- joh***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant confirms agreement with the creditor-deletion question. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q679ebd65c7d8182a4c20)
- him***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant asks whether the no-deletion claim was still influenced or directed by Guo. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc8e3c40b94ece9cf97b4)
## "Sold defendant," staged responsibility transfer, and conspiracy-chain inference

Participants argue over whether the “sold defendant” and responsibility-shifting theories are genuine legal theories or speculation, and whether the prosecution depends on those claims to hold. Community statements, not court findings.

- joh***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant argues that without that theory, the prosecution would have no meaningful case. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q6703ceb5ab96144cb748)
- kir***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant claims indicators already existed that the prosecution sold Luc. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q12a21c7a53779e364a45)
- kir***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant argues the prosecution cannot be the party bearing blame. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q14d6660662b4f0c02f62)
## Two-circuit and Supreme Court return path: file first or immediate refusal

Participants dispute the post-SCOTUS route, including whether second-circuit review is required after another refusal and whether additional relief motions remain worth pursuing. Community statements, not court findings.

- reb***, Apr 14, 2026: A participant says a second cert filing was denied, saying it required circuit court pre-review, and they stopped filing clerk-direct motions. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5f252186c27079f1e371)
- sar***, Apr 14, 2026: A participant says they used cert rather than mandamus and expect denial for similar reasons. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q06f9a7c3fe06061b19f5)
- kir***, Apr 16, 2026: A participant contends Guo’s main appeal would involve all second-circuit judges. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q56ef4c7a7268d70ee2e7)
## Motions, mandamus-equivalent relief, and clerk-upload barriers

Participants discuss motion filing practice, with conflict over clerk handling, ignored submissions, and whether practical drafting support is still unavailable. Community statements, not court findings.

- ntp***, Apr 15, 2026: A participant observes a live broadcast tying defense and a group called Three-Fire as awkward and contentious. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q75dfe14fa278ea04bc99)
- sar***, Apr 15, 2026: A participant claims multiple electronic motions and one paper filing sent since last September were not uploaded by the court, arguing victim rights were not protected. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q43602e05a57d4bbd54c4)
- spr***, Apr 16, 2026: A participant says they have not yet drafted the required filing and do not know how to write it yet. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qec8230f35c3f33ee3e08)
## Post-sentencing route: appeal first or preserve rights

Participants contend that post-sentencing rights must be preserved early and that choosing not to appeal can terminate practical options. Community statements, not court findings.

- mia***, Apr 14, 2026: A participant claims the case effectively ends if Guo does not appeal after sentencing. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf8eea0a85a6245b89b65)
- him***, Apr 16, 2026: A participant advises pre-sentencing letters to the Southern District and second circuit to preserve rights and avoid mootness. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q47bc21b3aabcadde8bc0)
- him***, Apr 16, 2026: A participant argues that filings fail if those who filed do not continue through appeal. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q53e4cef529f3585dcfe0)
## CVRA, 853n, and 844 timing and prospects

Participants dispute when CVRA and 853n relief remains viable, whether rights persist after sentencing, and whether an 853n appeal has realistic odds. Community statements, not court findings.

- him***, Apr 15, 2026: A participant argues that a CVRA motion not pushed in the second circuit before sentencing may be effectively lost afterward. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qee2369291115c7ab733d)
- him***, Apr 16, 2026: A participant says 853n and CVRA rights can continue after sentencing only if actively pursued. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3493d1532261843110b8)
- him***, Apr 16, 2026: A participant says 853n denials are appealable but assesses the case as unlikely to win on appeal. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q50ced478e6e480c33d50)
## Asset-responsibility boundary: alter ego, forfeiture, and G-series assets

Participants contend that alter-ego theories and asset seizure are central, while also disputing service and notice issues around filing 817 and record copies. Community statements, not court findings.

- joh***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant argues the creditor list is the core basis for bringing criminal charges. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q8a4354138797083e1075)
- joh***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant claims company claims target corporate entities as Guo’s alter ego and therefore support asset forfeiture. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qcd9b81e47a8c460eb96a)
- reb***, Apr 16, 2026: A participant raises whether defendants and defense counsel were served with 817-related file copies at the time. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q30b7c5c6f1a014b6d953)
## Lawyer role and advocacy objective: defend client or endorse alliance

Participants argue over counsel motivation, with some suggesting attorneys may be shaping strategy for alliances rather than solely defending Guo. Community statements, not court findings.

- sar***, Apr 15, 2026: A participant suggests someone is effectively giving strategic ideas to lawyers. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q9e4c8163adf199ace017)
- him***, Apr 15, 2026: A participant says counsel should be judged by whether it represents Guo or the broader alliance. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q42d7f53d9ee3be63a613)
- him***, Apr 15, 2026: A participant claims lawyers may be sacrificing Guo to protect themselves. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf039ef3cffbd1eeabf89)
## Evidence standard: whether to classify with proof or keep interpretive paths open

Participants dispute what level of evidence is needed before conclusions are fixed, with arguments that assertions should wait for support and others pressing for concrete proof in contested token claims. Community statements, not court findings.

- xin***, Apr 15, 2026: A participant says it is enough to explain the point clearly to AI, signaling a demand for structured argument. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q9653e6d0f2dbb3dd3116)
- xin***, Apr 16, 2026: A participant claims to have proof of TDCCP purchase. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q2ac86b42abfa60425825)
- xin***, Apr 16, 2026: A participant challenges how prosecutors can assert Guo issued the coin absent direct proof. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q005e6f36f06dff947d73)
## Public narrative and relationship framing escalated the dispute

Participants dispute whether social-media signals and faction-control stories are reliable evidence, while others argue these narratives intensify public framing rather than proving legal facts. Community statements, not court findings.

- joh***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant claims a person showed nervousness around Percy-related posts and kept sharing social posts, implying unstable positioning. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q909c0da8d9348b63dace)
- joh***, Apr 13, 2026: A participant equates the Gai 6000-person creditor idea with the same recurring claim pattern. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q6a4d2e67b91c7994d188)
- sar***, Apr 15, 2026: A participant asserts that the Qing group is controlling TDCCP tokens. Community statements, not court findings. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0737ebd0796241967306)