# Guo Wengui / Miles Guo (Ho Wan Kwok): community discussion 119

Community discussion, batch 119 (Jun 14, 2026 – Jun 16, 2026), 1,000 messages, on the Guo Wengui / Miles Guo (Ho Wan Kwok) case. Participants divide sharply over framing the proceeding as a chain of criminal conviction consequences or as procedural victim remedies. Debates persist over offense characterizations, conspiracy boundaries, and claims that the prosecution has collapsed. Contention centers on prosecutorial credibility, non-prosecution agreements, and executive settlements, alongside conflicting procedural strategies regarding Crime Victims Rights Act motions, Second Circuit mandamus petitions, Section 853(n) forfeiture claims, and trial evidence under FRE 801(d)(2)(E).

Firsthand participant accounts and investment experiences, preserved with dates, sources and reply context.

English reading guide and paraphrases; Chinese source messages remain authoritative.

## Debate Over Charging Labels and Case Severity: Juxtaposing Minor Offenses with Subversion Allegations

Participants argue over whether the charges represent trivial infractions or severe crimes like subversion.

- roy***, Jun 15, 2026: roy*** contends that the current offense is trivial and compares it to subverting state power. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc07f157b7a7dcc2d96ba)
- roy***, Jun 15, 2026: roy*** argues that picking quarrels and provoking trouble is too insignificant of a charge to matter. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf56b8d349b1f870a1396)
## Dispute Over Public Availability: Conflict Between Comprehensive Records and Limited Visibility

Participants dispute whether court indictments and related case materials are publicly available online.

- spr***, Jun 14, 2026: spr*** asks whether the court indictments and documents posted online are all publicly accessible. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qff740e8d4a707e17d106)
- kir***, Jun 14, 2026: kir*** states uncertainty regarding whether the materials are accessible to the public. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1ad0995cdc280b3922bc)
## Role of the Investment Chain: Debating Fund Transfers versus Case Record Scope

Participants debate whether the charges center on investments and social media posts, noting omissions in fund transfers.

- roy***, Jun 15, 2026: roy*** reports hearing that the two charges involve investments and articles published on Gettr. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4c5b00c4038d84ed9781)
- joh***, Jun 15, 2026: joh*** points out that the documents omit the process of farm leaders receiving and transferring funds. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q312234a5e0cfc1284d12)
## Scope of Conspiracy and Arrest Status: Completeness of Named Co-Conspirators and Liability Chains

Participants dispute the defined scope of the conspiracy and why only select individuals were arrested.

- joh***, Jun 15, 2026: joh*** observes that the documents only mention specific farm and Iron Blood leaders, including Zhang, Xia, Wang Xuebing, David from the UK, Sara Wei, and Li Ya. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb9e6d915d718f694bac0)
- him***, Jun 15, 2026: him*** contends that only Guo and Wang have been arrested in the case so far. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q99fb3a8f5d27435613d3)
## Authenticity and Function of Non-Prosecution Agreements: Existence, Signatories, and Cooperation

Participants argue over the validity of reported non-prosecution agreements and whether tainted witnesses signed them.

- joh***, Jun 15, 2026: joh*** agrees with reb*** that prosecutors declined to indict certain individuals because they served as tainted witnesses. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5c520c82c8c56296ca29)
- him***, Jun 15, 2026: him*** contends that the prosecution would not sign an agreement otherwise. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q34da514c4c5557d677fc)
- him***, Jun 15, 2026: him*** disputes the existence of any non-prosecution agreements, calling them rumors fabricated by Ivy League. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf99c722c14da38c50cac)
## Prosecutorial Narrative and Procedural Credibility: Perceptions of Prejudgment and Bias

Participants dispute the prosecution's credibility and the implications of screenshots shared in court filing 833.

- joh***, Jun 15, 2026: joh*** questions whether Qing would sue prosecutors over screenshots provided to Qing in ECF 833. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q2ed1454cc5bdede2182b)
- him***, Jun 15, 2026: him*** contends that the prosecution no longer retains any credibility. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5753a0acb7a07898541d)
## Case Viability and Procedural Delays: Arguments Over Invalidation versus Strategic Continuation

Participants debate whether the prosecution has effectively collapsed or is experiencing inexplicable delays.

- him***, Jun 15, 2026: him*** asserts that the case has already collapsed. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1c11db6511d876d5764a)
- him***, Jun 15, 2026: him*** states that it remains unclear why the proceedings continue to drag on. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5171082a147984701f1c)
- him***, Jun 15, 2026: him*** argues that the case collapsed the moment Brother Luosi appeared in court. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q77d0fda0a100cb224121)
## CVRA and Victim Eligibility Contest: Establishing Verified Status Prior to Asserting Remedies

Participants dispute victim standing and whether filing in the Second Circuit confers verified victim status.

- kir***, Jun 16, 2026: kir*** asserts that chunk chyi is not a victim. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qfc7ccb4ccbd7aa8351b9)
- sar***, Jun 15, 2026: sar*** describes intervening in the Second Circuit as a victim and wonders whether that qualifies as verified victim status. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q01c3c742423e44ff2393)
## Procedural Shift to the Second Circuit: Mandamus, Motions, and Appellate Filing Costs

Participants discuss procedural requirements and costs associated with filing motions and mandamus petitions in the Second Circuit.

- sar***, Jun 15, 2026: sar*** asks whether the initial mandamus petition has concluded, whether adding motions to the Second Circuit is easy, and if filing a new petition requires paying another $600. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q985e63f6262a5b50b09e)
- kir***, Jun 15, 2026: kir*** highlights the Second Circuit. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qcc1b9d44c4fdeed91bf5)
## Evidentiary Basis for Conviction: Trial Testimony, FRE 801(d)(2)(E), and Admissibility Rulings

Participants recount trial evidence including co-conspirator hearsay admissions under FRE 801(d)(2)(E) and court orders.

- ton***, Jun 16, 2026: ton*** recounts that six out-of-court statements by Wang Yanping were admitted for their truth as co-conspirator statements under FRE 801(d)(2)(E), citing Doc 388 §I. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qf6e0960596082f8dbc09)
- ton***, Jun 16, 2026: ton*** notes that on May 28, 2024, the court ruled the government could ask questions eliciting statements from Wang, citing Doc 382 line 49 and Tr. 436:2–437:22. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q92d960b6265d5de1a875)
- ton***, Jun 16, 2026: ton*** describes prosecutors arguing in court for days that Wang served as an assistant who performed the acts and confessed. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q9ffb218e60b4d63c9fe5)
## Forfeiture and Property Rights Disputes: Section 853(n), Third-Party Petitions, and Ownership Claims

Participants dispute whether to pursue Section 853(n) forfeiture claims or CVRA standing to recover funds from the G-series.

- him***, Jun 16, 2026: him*** contends that the prosecution can argue individuals no longer own their money once it was transferred to the G-series. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1e532b57dd72b075bc92)
- him***, Jun 16, 2026: him*** argues that legal standing under the CVRA is stronger. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5b38a6c9fa8229b0724d)
- ton***, Jun 15, 2026: ton*** argues that Section 853(n) is intended for asset recovery, though group members also use it to seek the truth. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q24dafbf3016a8a4efe75)
## External Politicization and External Pressures: National Security, Institutional Bias, and Appeals

Participants discuss geopolitical angles, government claims, and contacting Department of Justice leadership.

- hel***, Jun 16, 2026: hel*** asks for contact information or an email address for the newly appointed Attorney General's office. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qaf8ce4f97a9f95d112f5)
- kir***, Jun 16, 2026: kir*** contends that the Chinese government could appeal regarding the funds invested by Brother Luosi. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd03be1479f82b360d395)
## Procedural Irregularities and Timeline Concerns: Continuances, Docket Entries, and Notice Updates

Participants question potential scheduling postponements and track changes to docket entries from notices to mandamus.

- hel***, Jun 16, 2026: hel*** asks whether the June 29 proceeding will be postponed again and on what grounds Judge Torres might grant a continuance. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q66199301424d38135aa5)
- joh***, Jun 16, 2026: joh*** cynically remarks that the reason for a delay could be as trivial as a pet dog dying. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qfdec0adfcfab8d9e0582)
- reb***, Jun 16, 2026: reb*** asks whether the three docket entries beginning with 850, previously labeled notice other on CourtListener and PACER, have been reclassified as mandamus petitions. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qa23db1a55d2c980e1fd0)