# Guo Wengui / Miles Guo (Ho Wan Kwok): community discussion 163

Community discussion, batch 163 (Oct 9, 2026 – Oct 18, 2026), 1,002 messages, on the Guo Wengui / Miles Guo (Ho Wan Kwok) case. Participants dispute whether farm loans and settlement payments were included in the accounting, how funds moved, and whether trial evidence supports claims about control and ownership. They discuss investor recovery, forfeiture and appeals, including lawyer effectiveness and possible retrial. One participant challenges differing treatment of third-party motions in No. 26-1476 and 25-3046, associated with 1:23-cr-00118-AT. Others debate responsibility and share speculative AI interpretations of victim statements in ECF 477 and its attachments.

Firsthand participant accounts and investment experiences, preserved with dates, sources and reply context.

English reading guide and paraphrases; Chinese source messages remain authoritative.

## Dispute over audio possession and handover

kir*** relays him***’s claims about an audio recording and a deadline.

- kir***, Oct 9, 2026: kir*** relays him***’s claim that the recording is with someone on another team and not with the addressee. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q421b2250feb09d8c455d)
- kir***, Oct 9, 2026: kir*** relays him*** giving the addressee two days. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1f2d90fdba5d29b601d4)
## Farm loans, settlement payments and accounting

joh*** disputes how farm loans and settlement funds were accounted for.

- joh***, Oct 10, 2026: joh*** argues that farm loans and a settlement payment do not reconcile with the amounts discussed at trial. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0503bccdafac923e0553)
- joh***, Oct 10, 2026: joh*** contends that Maywind’s settlement shows it operated independently of MOS LLC. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q4151f595a16140593c13)
- joh***, Oct 10, 2026: joh*** argues that at least $4.55 million in farm loans was omitted from the $110 million total. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qbdba4f695417a8b91dc3)
## Trial evidence, fund flows and disputed amounts

reb*** and joh*** challenge interpretations of the evidence and financial amounts.

- reb***, Oct 10, 2026: reb*** contends that testimony attributed others’ alleged misuse of farm investments to Guo’s fraudulent intent. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qc7347776a5c07b926ddd)
- joh***, Oct 12, 2026: joh*** argues that funds allegedly withheld by Long Island and Zhang cannot be linked to Guo, undermining the overall G-series amount. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q45003e285fa2a0b55a68)
- joh***, Oct 13, 2026: joh*** contends that appellate evidence concerning Zhang and Fair Fund refunds warrants prosecutors bringing him back. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe10e2392292b937475c4)
## Third-party interests, forfeiture and investor recovery

Participants discuss forfeitable interests and recovering invested money.

- reb***, Oct 10, 2026: reb*** argues that the funds were not Guo’s forfeitable interests and at most belonged to other actors. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q49515f2eb0fb42594994)
- hel***, Oct 13, 2026: hel*** says their goal is to recover the money they invested. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q2efbf208da00bbe8af63)
- kir***, Oct 18, 2026: kir*** contends that Section 853 disputes must be resolved before post-sentencing forfeiture. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q1cfd56968103e4360da5)
## Bankruptcy settlement motives, objections and possible effects

joh*** and kir*** discuss objections to the settlement and what it might resolve.

- joh***, Oct 12, 2026: joh*** describes objections from HEX users and Guo family companies, and speculates about the parties’ motives and court delay. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qeb7359ef915e772f2c38)
- kir***, Oct 12, 2026: kir*** asks whether the settlement might leave the nature of the funds unresolved. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qadea248ef1a7491099ec)
- joh***, Oct 12, 2026: joh*** argues that the settlement could help the Southern District address an earlier problem involving Mahwah. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q27de60f2491b1126e0e1)
## Appeal materials, effective assistance and a Cronic claim

kir*** discusses jury materials, possible legal strategy and third-party claims.

- kir***, Oct 10, 2026: kir*** says Guo’s appellate lawyer found pages missing from the jury screening materials. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q9af695ddce1ab24ada75)
- kir***, Oct 12, 2026: kir*** speculates that counsel may pursue Cronic and ineffective-assistance claims. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q457c306e82c3234e0b11)
- kir***, Oct 15, 2026: kir*** contends that avoiding the issue would acknowledge that third parties had reached the merits. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe1efd77c9cc13850c43a)
## Second Circuit third-party motions and clarification request

Participants question the handling of third-party motions and describe a clarification request.

- kir***, Oct 12, 2026: kir*** relays a chatbot’s claim that the Second Circuit created a tandem hearing for third parties in the case. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qa200870e964dc65e13a5)
- kir***, Oct 14, 2026: kir*** says Sarah seeks an explanation for different treatment of two groups’ motions. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q8a0ea032829bbda1ae5b)
- sar***, Oct 14, 2026: sar*** describes Docket Entry 32.1 in No. 26-1476, associated with 1:23-cr-00118-AT, as seeking clarification of treatment compared with 25-3046 and the scope of Dkt. 31. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q035f4b79d6dc05ca3fb5)
## Private prosecution, motions to vacate and retrial prospects

kir*** argues about the purpose of private prosecution and the implications of Cronic.

- kir***, Oct 13, 2026: kir*** questions the value of private prosecution if it does not overturn the case. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q296f404d19dcc7045c7c)
- kir***, Oct 13, 2026: kir*** argues that private prosecution should seek to overturn the case rather than recover money. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qae50079949e7de9f1b60)
- kir***, Oct 15, 2026: kir*** contends that establishing a Cronic claim would overturn the entire case. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q3a7f6074c6ad4c013abf)
## Responsibility, organization and internal relationships

Participants recall their experiences and dispute responsibility for the alliance’s activities.

- sar***, Oct 12, 2026: sar*** recalls being persuaded by Guo and the alliance’s question-and-answer sessions. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q09bfd4b063f0225804dc)
- hel***, Oct 12, 2026: hel*** blames Guo for bringing in people who harmed others. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qaabae1b62e75337498b2)
- kir***, Oct 17, 2026: kir*** argues that the alliance should dissolve if its continued operation only supports the prosecution’s narrative about victims. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd1de2184951101a4433a)
## Other cases, the judge’s statements and possible connections

kir*** and joh*** discuss alleged connections and the judge’s role.

- kir***, Oct 14, 2026: kir*** contends that three prosecutors linked unrelated matters when referring to Judge Torres’s prior cases. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qb3d65625c2d90c1cb65f)
- kir***, Oct 14, 2026: kir*** describes Torres as treating the case as financial and not primarily considering national security or Chinese Communist Party infiltration. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qd018965005ff69507550)
- joh***, Oct 14, 2026: joh*** says third parties directly requested Torres’s replacement. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q0c4225fe1af43a34a426)
## Victim statements, witness credibility and AI interpretation

sar*** shares an AI interpretation of victim statements, while reb*** raises evidentiary concerns.

- sar***, Oct 16, 2026: sar*** recounts accessing ECF 477 but not its attachments and shares an AI analysis of ECF 477-1 and 477-3 in 1:23-cr-00118-AT. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/q5cf7796749f93c48563a)
- sar***, Oct 16, 2026: sar*** continues the AI analysis, including speculative claims about restricted attachments, submitters’ motives and Dkt 32.1 in 26-1476. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qe968082837b6cc68869a)
- reb***, Oct 16, 2026: reb*** alleges new evidence, witness-credibility disclosure violations and unreliable loss calculations and sentencing. [Chinese original](https://mubeitech.com/discussions/messages/qabdc383ea0b4ec042613)